retrych wrote on 25 Jan 2022 20:28:

Thank you "retrych" for your post.

I totally relate to what you wrote.

Truth is, about a year ago I had reached 450 days clean and if I am honest with myself I'll admit that I was a happier person. I was totally מסיח דעת from the תאוה and able to focus on the important things in life. But then I got to a point of "התאוו תאוה" (as it says about the Yidden who wanted the שליו even though they had the מן) - wanting to have a תאוה and wanting to be טועם טעם חטא. And that's when it started going downhill...

I will בס"ד get up and try again.

sleepy wrote on 25 Jan 2022 21:25:

The concept of מים גנובים יומתקו just means that it is extra sweet but has nothing to do with controlling your life.
Even things that are מותר can control your life:
1. Eating habits - especially for those with a bigger appetite
2. Bedroom with wife - forever thinking how to make it more exciting
3. News websites - can be very addictive
and I am sure there is more...

I therfore agree with "trouble" that if it were to be מותר - the nature of this תאוה would make it control your life...

it is sad to see how clueless some people are. to quote dr. bill (and notice how there is no mention of god, religiosity, or what is forbidden): I had lost control of me.  The compulsion had complete control, as it always had, from the very first.  Only this was no longer "innocent" Lust was taking on a malevolent aspect.  I was getting perilously close to connecting with the Darkness and crossing the point of no return.  Those who've been out there know what I mean.  After awhile, it ceases to be fun and games; it's for keeps.

But I thought I was free.  Free from the yoke of marriage and responsibility.  How easy to forget the family even existed.  Free to pursue lust as I wished without having to creep home guiltily, fearing discovery.  But the more freedom I had, the less free I became.  The escape that the ritual and sex provided wasn't as complete and didn't last as long as before.  The pleasure was not as unsullied, the rapture not as naive.  I must have begun to see.  I would swear off prostitutes periodically.  Sex with myself had never stopped, and the magazines kept apace to feed the progression, abetting it further still.  Then I'd try to stay completely sober without either.  Nothing worked longer than a few weeks at best.
                
Somewhere, again, I had crossed another invisible line.  Lust, by which I had been able to function and for which I lived, was exacting a wage — from me.  Each new stage brought increased craving, which brought ever greater dependence and more insatiable desire and an ever greater need to quit.

About this time, I was beginning to look for a way out again; my ability to function and cope was deteriorating. 

Trouble wrote on 25 Jan 2022 20:20:

Like me and food... Totally muttar still have to control it to have a manageable life.

sleepy wrote on 25 Jan 2022 23:34:

Nothing wrong with making it exciting as long as it is also/mainly for the sake of connection with partner. But in a תקופה where I am not doing well in עניני קדושה and depend on it purely because of my תאוה then it does take control of my life. The entire day my mind can be thinking of how to make it super exciting. Can't focus on putting children to bed calmly. Can't do anything else properly - just thinking of getting down to business... And if she is not interested then I would get very frustrated and angry and upset.
Does anyone relate? Doesn't it control your life sometimes?

sleepy wrote on 25 Jan 2022 21:25:

Assumptions. Assumptions. Assumptions.

UpAndDown wrote on 26 Jan 2022 00:16:

Could not have said it better. I remember those days that i was planning all day for the bedroom. My schedule was anxiously arranged to accomodate being home on time. I planned on doing it "like this". I was going to manipulate for "that" to happen. As i went through a regular day with all my responsibilities, there was a background script playing nonstop. The stress/anxiety level was over the top. If things didn't go as anticipated.... Thanks for the reminder os the days when i was a sick man. A little humility is good medicine....

sleepy wrote on 27 Jan 2022 20:55:

As often as possible

Dear friends,
I've not posted on my thread for a while...
I need some help... (got no patients for chats etc..)
I'm feeling sad and depressed. Not getting satisfaction from my learning. Working hard to make some money, it's very draining. A few things in my life are totally not working out and I feel like a failure. 
And my wife.... omg... She's a Parsha! 
My wife struggles with mental health for many years now. Its been a roller coaster... I have to put up with alot... Atm she's behaving so wierd... very unnatural.. (she's been on various meds). On top of it she has ADD which causes her to be dysfunctional in many areas, e.g. not keeping a clean and tidy home, so I have to step in to do her jobs... I'd love to write more about this Parsha but I'm too tired...
I come from a yekkish family with absolutely NO mental health problems, and she comes from a family where most of them are on medication.. its so upsetting. I suppose its Bashert, but its difficult.
And she's a Niddah atm for some stupid מראה that made her Assur. So it feels like I'm abstaining for no reason... (a bit like what the Gemara speaks about that it's worse to get to a situation of ספק נידה because then a person feels that "על חינם אני נמנע" as Rashi explains in סנהדרין דף קט).
על כל פנים, I'm feeling really upset and depressed. And I'm scared I'm going to fall. I'm 61 days clean now and I'm hoping to beat my record of 400 days clean... but I'm taking it day by day.
I'm aware that acting out is not what my Neshomo needs.
But it's still so difficult... 

Don't tell me to get myself a cheesecake. It won't make me happy.
Don't tell me to sleep more, because it won't happen.. I've got sweet children that keep me up from early morning until late at night!
And don't suggest I speak to someone, because I ain't got anyone to speak to...
And the Mikvah night in a few days is also not exciting me.. my wife's s*x drive is very numb atm and I must say I'm not looking forward... (and she's not so beautiful either.)

I don't know what I want...
I wish Hashem would show me the way forward with more clarity... 
הוריני ה’ דרכך ונחיני באורח מישור 

I know it's a luxury to complain and that I should really just be grateful for all the good in my life/wife (which is a very lot ב”ה), but still, I'm only human and its soooo difficult.. I'm feeling worn. And the YH is not letting go...

Thank you for listening to my rant..

Wow - amazing post and amazing thread!! 

I can relate to a lot of what you wrote. I am sorry I have not much to say, it must be very tough! and sad!
With all she is going through, and as hard as it is for you, maybe you can work on empathizing with her more? Like realize that as hard as it is for you to deal with her and the kids and the home, maybe she is suffering much more, low self-esteem from needing to be on meds, feeling out of control of her life, feeling unloved, feeling incapable... Maybe there is a way you can slowly build up your relationship and caring for her. Not sure exactly how.

Did you ever have a conversation with HHM?

Keep strong!!! Get to 500 days!!

Hatzlacha and have a great Shabbos!

frank.lee wrote on 12 Jul 2024 07:18:

Thank you.
You are right, I will try my best to empathise more with the way she feels... Generally my relationship with her is rock solid and we have excellent Shalom Bayis bh, but in this specific area of mental health I'm still struggling to accept and embrace the challenges...
I've never spoken to HHM or anyone on GYE. It's a big step for me to take..

upanddown wrote on 12 Jul 2024 10:13:

One big step for upanddown, one YUGE! step for upanddownup. 
You have a lot on your shoulders. You don't have to bear the burden alone.
Hatzlacha

I highly recommend speaking to HHM. There are others here who also help out and are happy to talk on the phone.

Call HHM, say you are borrowing someone's phone so he won't track you down He is a very caring and safe person to speak to, I am talking from personal experience. It is so good to be able to talk on the phone with someone, so therapeutic, such an amazing feeling. Try it...

All the best!

Thank you for the honest share. It's okay to feel pain - you're not wrong for feeling like you're in a tough situation. And we're happy to lend a listening ear.
Sounds like you've got your head screwed on straight and know what to do.

Keep on keeping on!

How is your Shabbos? I find that Shabbos (and Sunday here in Chu"L) are my recharge time till I fall back into the swamp of taivos and stress during the week. Keeps me going.

Specifically I make an extra special effort to connect to wife and kids during that time when I'm not beset by taavos (and yes even if my wife is niddah which has been a challenge)