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Re: It's all in the name 06 Dec 2022 03:27 #389003

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cordnoy wrote on 06 Dec 2022 03:19:

Human being wrote on 06 Dec 2022 03:05:

Teshuvahguy wrote on 06 Dec 2022 01:47:

cordnoy wrote on 06 Dec 2022 01:32:

Human being wrote on 06 Dec 2022 00:17:

cordnoy wrote on 05 Dec 2022 22:34:
I generally do not talk Torah on this site and I certainly do not weigh in on philosophical nuanced stuff, however....

The Torah says: Lo sachmod, accordin' to many that means: do not covet/desire thin's that are not yours or that are wrong.

I am addicted to lots of stuff. I have acted upon those addictions as well. It is my responsibility to fix both those thin's. I may not equate the two and I may be more guilty of one more than the other, but even if God gave me those desires, which I have no way of knowin', He still would rather that I work on them somehow.

Yes, the Ibn Ezra, beis halevi, and more.

Godspeed to all

I don't think that would apply to sexual desire that cant just get worked on and "fixed".

Covetin' your fellow's wife sounds pretty sexual to me.

What’s the deal with the final “g”s, Cord…you didn’t used to drop them. What is the significance of that?

It doesn't mean to eradicate the desire. We cant eradicate feelings. That's just not how feelings work. We cant get up one day and decide we dont want a desire and then work on it and it goes away. It means to reach a state of not triggering the desire and not never giving in to the desire. -in my opinion. (The hashkafa given over to me) Same with anger. We don't control our feelings. We cant just decide "hay I'm not going to feel anger" It means if we don't try to avoid triggers and give in to the desire to be angry. As it says 

ר"ש בן אלעזר אומר משום חילפא בר אגרא שאמר משום ר' יוחנן בן נורי המקרע בגדיו בחמתו והמשבר כליו בחמתו והמפזר מעותיו בחמתו יהא בעיניך כעובד ע"ז שכך אומנתו של יצה"ר היום אומר לו עשה כך ולמחר אומר לו עשה כך עד שאומר לו עבוד ע"ז והולך ועובד

R’ Shimon Ben Elazar said in the name of Chilfa bar Agra, who said in the name of R’ Yochanan Ben Nuri: One who tears his clothing in anger, or who smashed vessels in his anger, or who scatters money in his anger - he should be in your eyes like an idolater. For this is the way of the Yetzer Hara: Today it tells him to do this, and tomorrow it tells him to do that, until it tells him to worship idolatry, and he goes and worships.

torah.org/torah-portion/ravfrand-5770-yisro/   -one of the many pshatim in lo sachmod.Parshas Yisro“Lo Sachmod”: Two Approaches

These divrei Torah were adapted from the hashkafa portion of Rabbi Yissocher Frand’s Commuter Chavrusah Tapes on the weekly portion: Tape # 712, The Kiddush Club. Good Shabbos!

The tenth of the Asserres HaDibros [“Ten Commandments”] is Lo Sachmod: “Do not covet your neighbor’s house; do not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his slave, his donkey, his ox, or anything that belongs to your neighbor” [Shemos 20:13]. A person is not allowed to be jealous of his friend’s possessions.

The Ibn Ezra wonders how the Torah can legislate against a person’s desires. It is very natural for a person driving a jalopy to be jealous of a person who has a new car and does not have to worry about leaking oil and whether the car will start each time he turns the key in the ignition. If this is readily understandable in terms of our neighbor’s car, it is certainly understandable in terms of more meaningful things in life. We see their families, we see their position, etc., etc. How does the Torah command a person not to be jealous?

The Ibn Ezra cites a parable which allows us to understand the proper approach to the prohibition of not coveting: No commoner ever thinks he will marry the princess. He knows that the princess is out of his league. It is human nature that one only has desires for things he can relate to. A person does not covet things which are so far removed from him that he considers them to be “out of his league”. When the villager goes into the big city and sees the King’s palace and sees the King’s beautiful daughter, he does not even think “Oh, I wish I could marry her.” He knows that such an occurrence is strictly beyond the realm of possibility in terms of his lineage and background. It is just not going to happen.

The Ibn Ezra says that an intelligent person must realize that people do not acquire spouses or possessions based on their wisdom or cleverness, but only based on the Will of G-d to grant him such. If a person has a beautiful house or car or wife, it is because the Almighty wanted him to have that. For whatever reason, it is G-d’s Will that Reuven have these things and Shimmon not have them. The antidote a person must employ to avoid coveting, says Ibn Ezra, is Emunah [faith]. Namely, the faith that all his possessions are what G-d wants him to have and all of his neighbor’s possessions are what G-d wants his neighbor to have.



Aka Hashem wants us to work on avoiding triggering the anger/lust. Not "fixing it" and taking it away. If anger/lust does get triggered, we cant just "fix" them. All we can do is work on the triggers.

Thanks for writin' the Ibn Ezra I mentioned, you then went and corrupted what he said with your explanation in the last paragraph.

That is the hashkafa i was given over by my rabbeam. Those highlighted texts show the ibn ezra telling us not to trigger the desire. Not to destroy the desire.
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Re: It's all in the name 06 Dec 2022 03:19 #389001

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Human being wrote on 06 Dec 2022 03:05:

Teshuvahguy wrote on 06 Dec 2022 01:47:

cordnoy wrote on 06 Dec 2022 01:32:

Human being wrote on 06 Dec 2022 00:17:

cordnoy wrote on 05 Dec 2022 22:34:
I generally do not talk Torah on this site and I certainly do not weigh in on philosophical nuanced stuff, however....

The Torah says: Lo sachmod, accordin' to many that means: do not covet/desire thin's that are not yours or that are wrong.

I am addicted to lots of stuff. I have acted upon those addictions as well. It is my responsibility to fix both those thin's. I may not equate the two and I may be more guilty of one more than the other, but even if God gave me those desires, which I have no way of knowin', He still would rather that I work on them somehow.

Yes, the Ibn Ezra, beis halevi, and more.

Godspeed to all

I don't think that would apply to sexual desire that cant just get worked on and "fixed".

Covetin' your fellow's wife sounds pretty sexual to me.

What’s the deal with the final “g”s, Cord…you didn’t used to drop them. What is the significance of that?

It doesn't mean to eradicate the desire. We cant eradicate feelings. That's just not how feelings work. We cant get up one day and decide we dont want a desire and then work on it and it goes away. It means to reach a state of not triggering the desire and not never giving in to the desire. -in my opinion. (The hashkafa given over to me) Same with anger. We don't control our feelings. We cant just decide "hay I'm not going to feel anger" It means if we don't try to avoid triggers and give in to the desire to be angry. As it says 

ר"ש בן אלעזר אומר משום חילפא בר אגרא שאמר משום ר' יוחנן בן נורי המקרע בגדיו בחמתו והמשבר כליו בחמתו והמפזר מעותיו בחמתו יהא בעיניך כעובד ע"ז שכך אומנתו של יצה"ר היום אומר לו עשה כך ולמחר אומר לו עשה כך עד שאומר לו עבוד ע"ז והולך ועובד

R’ Shimon Ben Elazar said in the name of Chilfa bar Agra, who said in the name of R’ Yochanan Ben Nuri: One who tears his clothing in anger, or who smashed vessels in his anger, or who scatters money in his anger - he should be in your eyes like an idolater. For this is the way of the Yetzer Hara: Today it tells him to do this, and tomorrow it tells him to do that, until it tells him to worship idolatry, and he goes and worships.

torah.org/torah-portion/ravfrand-5770-yisro/   -one of the many pshatim in lo sachmod.Parshas Yisro“Lo Sachmod”: Two Approaches

These divrei Torah were adapted from the hashkafa portion of Rabbi Yissocher Frand’s Commuter Chavrusah Tapes on the weekly portion: Tape # 712, The Kiddush Club. Good Shabbos!

The tenth of the Asserres HaDibros [“Ten Commandments”] is Lo Sachmod: “Do not covet your neighbor’s house; do not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his slave, his donkey, his ox, or anything that belongs to your neighbor” [Shemos 20:13]. A person is not allowed to be jealous of his friend’s possessions.

The Ibn Ezra wonders how the Torah can legislate against a person’s desires. It is very natural for a person driving a jalopy to be jealous of a person who has a new car and does not have to worry about leaking oil and whether the car will start each time he turns the key in the ignition. If this is readily understandable in terms of our neighbor’s car, it is certainly understandable in terms of more meaningful things in life. We see their families, we see their position, etc., etc. How does the Torah command a person not to be jealous?

The Ibn Ezra cites a parable which allows us to understand the proper approach to the prohibition of not coveting: No commoner ever thinks he will marry the princess. He knows that the princess is out of his league. It is human nature that one only has desires for things he can relate to. A person does not covet things which are so far removed from him that he considers them to be “out of his league”. When the villager goes into the big city and sees the King’s palace and sees the King’s beautiful daughter, he does not even think “Oh, I wish I could marry her.” He knows that such an occurrence is strictly beyond the realm of possibility in terms of his lineage and background. It is just not going to happen.

The Ibn Ezra says that an intelligent person must realize that people do not acquire spouses or possessions based on their wisdom or cleverness, but only based on the Will of G-d to grant him such. If a person has a beautiful house or car or wife, it is because the Almighty wanted him to have that. For whatever reason, it is G-d’s Will that Reuven have these things and Shimmon not have them. The antidote a person must employ to avoid coveting, says Ibn Ezra, is Emunah [faith]. Namely, the faith that all his possessions are what G-d wants him to have and all of his neighbor’s possessions are what G-d wants his neighbor to have.



Aka Hashem wants us to work on avoiding triggering the anger/lust. Not "fixing it" and taking it away. If anger/lust does get triggered, we cant just "fix" them. All we can do is work on the triggers.

Thanks for writin' the Ibn Ezra I mentioned, you then went and corrupted what he said with your explanation in the last paragraph.
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
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GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.
Hi Oived, 

I am a little late to seeing these posts, I hope you are doing okay. I think there are two things I would say. First, it is so normal and healthy to go through cycles out doubt. Grappling with faith is an essential part of life. I think sometimes we are pushed to find a new approach to life, one that will lead to a real evolution in who we are as a person, and in order to get us to find that new approach our old approach and understanding is taken away from us. I heard a saying once that really resonated with me. In order to cross from one shore to another, you first have to lose sight of the first shore. 

The second thing is, remember that our minds like to extrapolate a moment, day, month, or year of our lives and make the assumption that the current experience now defines our entire life trajectory. We forget that experiences and states of mind of transient. Sometimes you may be taken very far from who you really are. You may feel a stranger to yourself and your life. But when you're in that murkiness, don't fear or panic. With time you always come back to yourself. Sending prayer and well wishes.
Last Edit: 06 Dec 2022 03:18 by committed_togrowth.
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Here I will write my thoughts...

I had a bit of up and downs in the last few months..particularly since a little before elul. 

Since that time i got a job and started dating.
Ironically I think since I've had more of a productive life I see a slow digression in my efforts in this area. 

(Also I should note my learning is not too great either but lets put that on the side for now)

In general I believe I'm in a good place (and not addicted to porn...if that makes a difference) and am proud of myself in general.

Watching porn the other night felt very platonic and non exciting (i didn't even masterbate) so what was the point? Why am I looking to watch porn or explicit pictures?
I am 50% sure it's an escape..but from what?

Am I looking to escape from stress from dating? Job? Regular day to day stuff? 

could it be porn is just seared in my brain as my go to method to destress or fill time? 

Could it be i just like porn? 

It could be. i dont know forsure.

being clean for some long periods 
of time and now falling while I'm in the pasha is somewhat of a blow...
But then again hormones are all over the place and stress is high.

Not an easy time over here


In any case, I need to stop being reactive and start being proactive in this erea. 

this is me on a rant thinking things over and trying to make sense of myself.

Plan is to move on

One who has given up hope is without a G‑d.

One who sees hope in each day is already free

Re: It's all in the name 06 Dec 2022 03:05 #388998

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Teshuvahguy wrote on 06 Dec 2022 01:47:

cordnoy wrote on 06 Dec 2022 01:32:

Human being wrote on 06 Dec 2022 00:17:

cordnoy wrote on 05 Dec 2022 22:34:
I generally do not talk Torah on this site and I certainly do not weigh in on philosophical nuanced stuff, however....

The Torah says: Lo sachmod, accordin' to many that means: do not covet/desire thin's that are not yours or that are wrong.

I am addicted to lots of stuff. I have acted upon those addictions as well. It is my responsibility to fix both those thin's. I may not equate the two and I may be more guilty of one more than the other, but even if God gave me those desires, which I have no way of knowin', He still would rather that I work on them somehow.

Yes, the Ibn Ezra, beis halevi, and more.

Godspeed to all

I don't think that would apply to sexual desire that cant just get worked on and "fixed".

Covetin' your fellow's wife sounds pretty sexual to me.

What’s the deal with the final “g”s, Cord…you didn’t used to drop them. What is the significance of that?

It doesn't mean to eradicate the desire. We cant eradicate feelings. That's just not how feelings work. We cant get up one day and decide we dont want a desire and then work on it and it goes away. It means to reach a state of not triggering the desire and not never giving in to the desire. -in my opinion. (The hashkafa given over to me) Same with anger. We don't control our feelings. We cant just decide "hay I'm not going to feel anger" It means if we don't try to avoid triggers and give in to the desire to be angry. As it says 

ר"ש בן אלעזר אומר משום חילפא בר אגרא שאמר משום ר' יוחנן בן נורי המקרע בגדיו בחמתו והמשבר כליו בחמתו והמפזר מעותיו בחמתו יהא בעיניך כעובד ע"ז שכך אומנתו של יצה"ר היום אומר לו עשה כך ולמחר אומר לו עשה כך עד שאומר לו עבוד ע"ז והולך ועובד

R’ Shimon Ben Elazar said in the name of Chilfa bar Agra, who said in the name of R’ Yochanan Ben Nuri: One who tears his clothing in anger, or who smashed vessels in his anger, or who scatters money in his anger - he should be in your eyes like an idolater. For this is the way of the Yetzer Hara: Today it tells him to do this, and tomorrow it tells him to do that, until it tells him to worship idolatry, and he goes and worships.

torah.org/torah-portion/ravfrand-5770-yisro/   -one of the many pshatim in lo sachmod.Parshas Yisro“Lo Sachmod”: Two Approaches

These divrei Torah were adapted from the hashkafa portion of Rabbi Yissocher Frand’s Commuter Chavrusah Tapes on the weekly portion: Tape # 712, The Kiddush Club. Good Shabbos!

The tenth of the Asserres HaDibros [“Ten Commandments”] is Lo Sachmod: “Do not covet your neighbor’s house; do not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his slave, his donkey, his ox, or anything that belongs to your neighbor” [Shemos 20:13]. A person is not allowed to be jealous of his friend’s possessions.

The Ibn Ezra wonders how the Torah can legislate against a person’s desires. It is very natural for a person driving a jalopy to be jealous of a person who has a new car and does not have to worry about leaking oil and whether the car will start each time he turns the key in the ignition. If this is readily understandable in terms of our neighbor’s car, it is certainly understandable in terms of more meaningful things in life. We see their families, we see their position, etc., etc. How does the Torah command a person not to be jealous?

The Ibn Ezra cites a parable which allows us to understand the proper approach to the prohibition of not coveting: No commoner ever thinks he will marry the princess. He knows that the princess is out of his league. It is human nature that one only has desires for things he can relate to. A person does not covet things which are so far removed from him that he considers them to be “out of his league”. When the villager goes into the big city and sees the King’s palace and sees the King’s beautiful daughter, he does not even think “Oh, I wish I could marry her.” He knows that such an occurrence is strictly beyond the realm of possibility in terms of his lineage and background. It is just not going to happen.

The Ibn Ezra says that an intelligent person must realize that people do not acquire spouses or possessions based on their wisdom or cleverness, but only based on the Will of G-d to grant him such. If a person has a beautiful house or car or wife, it is because the Almighty wanted him to have that. For whatever reason, it is G-d’s Will that Reuven have these things and Shimmon not have them. The antidote a person must employ to avoid coveting, says Ibn Ezra, is Emunah [faith]. Namely, the faith that all his possessions are what G-d wants him to have and all of his neighbor’s possessions are what G-d wants his neighbor to have.



Aka Hashem wants us to work on avoiding triggering the anger/lust. Not "fixing it" and taking it away. If anger/lust does get triggered, we cant just "fix" them. All we can do is work on the triggers.
Be a part of my 90 day journey! -Destination -90 days, A Human beings journey. Every post and suggestion response and chizzuk is appreciated.



I love connecting, supporting and sharing. To private message me, my email is Hashemsboy@gmail.com Feel free to say hello and #Shareyourstory.#NOJUDGMENTZONE!
Last Edit: 06 Dec 2022 03:07 by Human being.
Hi Zedj, 

Your enthusiasm is beautiful. Regarding the phone, I switched to sunbeam orchid a while back and am quite happy with it. It has a good gps app and voice to text, so that covers most peoples bases in terms of what they really need to get back. It's been very beneficial for me. Not just for kedusha (although it has certainly made the challenge much more surmountable), but after a month or two the part of my brain that constantly wanted to check my phone faded away. I think I have much more presence of mind now, I high recommend it.
Great news everybody I was crushed into a little ball by life today, recycled five times, composted, and then slam dunked.

Didn’t fall

Big win

Good night

zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Challenge accepted!

If you figured out my identity, don't be shy, come say hi! 
It takes tons of courage to fight the good fight, but we don't have to do it all alone. 
Last Edit: 06 Dec 2022 02:38 by iLoveHashem247.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Zedj, Sapy, committed_togrowth, Human being

Re: It's all in the name 06 Dec 2022 02:07 #388994

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Eerie wrote on 06 Dec 2022 00:09:
dear cordnoy, just wanting somebody else's stuff is not an aveirah. One is oiver only if he forces the owner to give it to him or somehow forces the situation to get what he wants. That said, it is not a middah toiva to covet somebody else's things. here we are discussing a different desire altogether. We are talking about sexual desire, which is not among the things the Torah says to eradicate from your heart. Of course, one must not harp on those desires or think  about them in a way that he grows those desires. That's part of what I meant when I wrote that what IS my job is to control those desires. Not only control from doing terrible things, but also to do my best to not cultivate that desire and cause it to grow. As much as possible to not think about it. Not look at things that are triggers. Also, we are talking here about the feeling that many people have that desire makes them bad, and that is not true. The desire is not something that they bring upon themselves, so it in no way defines them. and whatever desire is there naturally is not something that one must get rid of. I would love to hear what you have to say

Your first two sentences are both wrong. In the second sentence, you are mixin' up "lo sachmod" with a chamsan.
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If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

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1 day clean!

WE ARE BACK!

Before I get too excited this is the deal.

I have 2 ideas in mind

start afresh as i did when i first started GYE:

1: Making a deal with a fellow gye member
2: Writeing out a pro/con list
3: writeing up a contract with specific conditions customized for myself
4: nightly accountability to make sure im clean

Sounds intense I know..

Idea #2
Get a kosher phone....still something i have to look into and see if it will be practical for me.

just wondering the peoples thoughts on the subject.
what would you choose and why?

One who has given up hope is without a G‑d.

One who sees hope in each day is already free

Last Edit: 06 Dec 2022 01:57 by Zedj.

Re: It's all in the name 06 Dec 2022 01:47 #388992

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cordnoy wrote on 06 Dec 2022 01:32:

Human being wrote on 06 Dec 2022 00:17:

cordnoy wrote on 05 Dec 2022 22:34:
I generally do not talk Torah on this site and I certainly do not weigh in on philosophical nuanced stuff, however....

The Torah says: Lo sachmod, accordin' to many that means: do not covet/desire thin's that are not yours or that are wrong.

I am addicted to lots of stuff. I have acted upon those addictions as well. It is my responsibility to fix both those thin's. I may not equate the two and I may be more guilty of one more than the other, but even if God gave me those desires, which I have no way of knowin', He still would rather that I work on them somehow.

Yes, the Ibn Ezra, beis halevi, and more.

Godspeed to all

I don't think that would apply to sexual desire that cant just get worked on and "fixed".

Covetin' your fellow's wife sounds pretty sexual to me.

What’s the deal with the final “g”s, Cord…you didn’t used to drop them. What is the significance of that?
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excellence wrote on 04 Dec 2022 18:27:
Dear Hakodosh R Zedj,

Even though I don't really post on your thread, I have always been following your journey, I think from when you started posting.
Your'e a true inspiration to me, It's the battle that counts and you excel at that. falls are extremally frustrating, but let it pass and move on. I wish I had been involved in GYE as a bochur. If you pull yourself up right now, you have no idea what a tremendous impact it can have on your life.

keep on inspiring us,
Love excellence   

Thank you excellence for your kind words and thank you for following my posts.

One who has given up hope is without a G‑d.

One who sees hope in each day is already free

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Sapy wrote on 04 Dec 2022 17:35:
Sorry to hear Chabibi. 

Thank you!

One who has given up hope is without a G‑d.

One who sees hope in each day is already free

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Gevura Shebyesod wrote on 04 Dec 2022 15:46:
A very Choshuve guy on this site wrote the following in his signature:

One who has given up hope is without a G‑d.

One who sees hope in each day is already free”


Thank you.
I see you pulled "you said it yourself" card.
it kinda worked.

One who has given up hope is without a G‑d.

One who sees hope in each day is already free

Re: It's all in the name 06 Dec 2022 01:32 #388988

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Human being wrote on 06 Dec 2022 00:17:

cordnoy wrote on 05 Dec 2022 22:34:
I generally do not talk Torah on this site and I certainly do not weigh in on philosophical nuanced stuff, however....

The Torah says: Lo sachmod, accordin' to many that means: do not covet/desire thin's that are not yours or that are wrong.

I am addicted to lots of stuff. I have acted upon those addictions as well. It is my responsibility to fix both those thin's. I may not equate the two and I may be more guilty of one more than the other, but even if God gave me those desires, which I have no way of knowin', He still would rather that I work on them somehow.

Yes, the Ibn Ezra, beis halevi, and more.

Godspeed to all

I don't think that would apply to sexual desire that cant just get worked on and "fixed".

Covetin' your fellow's wife sounds pretty sexual to me.
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.
Fell. In short, started working from home today--on my unfiltered work device--in part to deal with a property damage issue. It was stressful. No excuse, but alas... I have already resumed my plan of locking my unfiltered devices in my car overnight. This is a one and done. Not letting this spiral out of control.
The following user(s) said Thank You: committed_togrowth, Human being
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