Dear GYE friends,

I am looking for some practical, quick & easy tips for שמירת העיניים in real life (not internet).

I'll share what has helped me in the past, but I'd love to hear some new ideas.
I feel that just like the YH comes in new forms every day (יצרו של אדם מתחדש עליו בכל יום שנאמר רק רע כל היום, קידושין דף ל) so to the "anti-YH-thoughts" must be refreshed from time to time.

What do you say or think to yourself when you are feeling spiritually weak (...לא תתורו not working) and you're in the mood to just let your eyes loose and to enjoy looking at the many very attractive woman/girls that are around you, on the street, in the shops, at the counter or in your work place or at a wedding?

Any thoughts, stories or Chizzuk that have helped you, are very welcome.

Thank you in advance.

So here is what I do when I'm about to look, I tell myself (loud): "דמיונות! דמיונות! דמיונות It's all just דמיון!" And I repeat it until the Nisayon is over. (Hope nobody around me hears me...)

(Please excuse my next few lines, I hope its not triggering but only לתועלת)
It's really all כח הדמיון, pure imagination, because even if I would approach her:
1. She will probably scream and run away. And I'll stand there like a Goilem...
2. She will say I'm a freak. Which is true. I'll feel humiliated. 
3. Even if she was possibly a bit interested in a night out with me, she's probably scared of her husband/friends. 
4. Once I get closer to her I might see that she's not even so pretty (this is probably correct in most cases).
5. Once I get to know her in the bedroom I might discover that she has a HUGE birth mark that I can't stand looking at. Or perhaps a big burn that happened when she was a child. Or just a horrible spot.
6. In the process of my fantasies I might be spotted by someone and בו ביום I'll be the hot topic of every Kollels' coffee-room in town!
7. She might not be great at s*x.
8. I spoke to a BT who in his youth hung out with girls.. he said the following: as soon as you're "done", all you want to do is chuck her out of your bed! (Same as with watching porn. Ever noticed? As soon as you've mast***  you straight away close all the many tabs of pornography that just a few moments ago were so so thrilling...)
9. You're very likely going to get into serious trouble. Possibly a bad name for life. Even if this affair were to work out, but it most likely won't end there. Another affair and another affair until one day: כי עוף השמים יוליך את הקול (קהלת פרק י’ פסוק כ’). The fun is over. I might even loose my job. After all who wants to employ someone who is "the talk of town"...
10. The enjoyment can be exactly the same as what you (will one day) get from your wife. So why take all the risks? 

So I try to just quickly remind myself that's its nothing but harmful imagination and look away...

However, for the next few days we're hosting a couple (there is no way out of it) who is not very frum. She is very attractive, loves talking to me (looking in my eyes) and to flirt. So I will probably need a fresh boost of Chizzuk in order not to fall...

Instead of lo sasuru, I say v'heyisem Kedoshim. I repeat shivisi Hashem. I think of my gedolim in shomayim watching me in those moments and I become embarrassed to look. I carry with me a picture of my wife, my children, and my Rebbi that I look at or place a hand on it when I need a quick boost. 

If I happen to see something that I don't want to, I blink hard as I turn away to "reset" my vision. 

And this one still works for me: I picture the fire on the mizbeiach.

As far as your home visitor, maybe tell your wife that this woman is overly friendly in a normal for her way, but it makes you uncomfortable. Tha might take some of the pressure off and you can be politely boring, like a Golem that is a mentch. Hatzlacha!

Does anyone have any tips on talking to a woman? When I go to the bank or cashier I manage to make myself busy. But what can I do if I need to talk to a woman to ask them a question etc. when I talk to my sister in laws it’s not really an issue because they’re really yeshivish and I am also so it’s not so awkward to avoid eye contact. But with a regular girl it’s really hard     Any suggestions?

For me, it helps to relate to her and respect her as a person, not a body.

And focus on staying completely matter of fact and on point throughout conversation, focusing on what’s necessary,  don’t dawdle to enjoy the experience.

She - as a full person - isn’t someone that you have a right  to “use” for your enjoyment without her knowledge or will. Working on relating to her with the sense of respect that comes of relating to her as a full person puts you in a position to be less likly to be affected the wrong way.

How did I forget the most important thing!?!
Ask Hashem for help!
There is  Ribono Shel Olam tefillah for shmiras einayim written by the Vilna Gaon and I say it very frequently.
Here is the excerpt from the GYE ebook (sorry for the weird Hebrew formatting):
PRAYER BEFORE LEAVING THE HOUSE Before one leaves the house, or first thing in the morning, a person should pray to be saved from forbidden sights or speech in advance - before facing any difficulties (Keser Rosh, 73). Here is a prayer composed by the Vilna Gaon, along with an addition from sefer Taharas HaKodesh (modified to singular). The Keser Rosh comments that a person may add his own heart-felt prayers, asking for Hashem’s protection. רִ בּ וֹ נוֹ שֶׁ ל עוֹ לָם, הִ נְנִי הוֹ לֵך בְּ גֵיא צַ לְ מָ וֶת ּו ּ מָ קוֹ ם מְ סו ּ כָּ ן, הוֹ שִׁ יעֵנִי מִ יֵצֶר הָ רַ ע ומֵ חַ טָ אִ ים ּו ּ מֵ עַוֹ נוֹ ת, ובִּ פְ רַ ט מֵ הִ סְ ת ּ ַ כְּ לות בָּ עַרָ יוֹ ת. )ע"כ מהגר"א(. ּו ּת ּ ְ זַכֵּנִי לְ קַ דֵ שׁ אֶ ת עֵינַי שֶׁ לֹא אֶ סְ תַ כֵּל ּ וְ לֹא אֶ רְ אֶ ה בַּ מְ קוֹ מוֹ ת הָ אַ סו ּ רִ ים, ו ּ בְּ שׁ ום ּ מָ קוֹ ם שֶׁ הוא נֶגֶד רְ צוֹ נוֹ יִתְ בָּ רַ ך, וְ לֹא יֶאֶ רַ ע ּ וְ לֹא יִזְדַ מֵ ן לִ י שׁ ו ּ ם רְ אִ יוֹ ת וְ הִ סְ ת ּ ַ כְּ לות רַ ע, ּ שֶׁ לֹא יִגְרְ מו לִ י אֵ יזֶה הֶיזֵק לְ נִשְׁ מָ תִ י הַ קְ דוֹ שָׁ ה חָ לִ ילָה. Master of the Universe, I am about to walk through terribly dangerous domains. Save me from the yeitzer hora and from sin - whether accidental or intentional, and especially from seeing the forbidden. Help me to sanctify my eyes, that I shouldn’t glance or gaze anywhere that is forbidden or against Your Will. Let me not encounter any forbidden sight, so that no damage should be done to my holy soul, G-d forbid.

upanddown wrote on 17 Jun 2024 00:39:

First avoid Ichud at any price and keep yourself busy, try being the least you can around her.
If she is not yet frum, she is used to talk to men and maybe she is talking to you because she wants to get closer to Judaism, be the right example and make a kidush hashem.
From my experience, even non Jewish women get so impressed when they see how Jewish men who stand up to their standards.
Having this in mind can give you strength.

I just googled the word Judaism
Ant this what came up - Judaism is one of the oldest monotheistic religions and was founded over 3500 years ago in the Middle East.
Jews believe that God appointed the Jews to be his chosen people in order to set an example of holiness and ethical behavior to the world.

doingtshuva wrote on 17 Jun 2024 22:45:

She actually grew up in a frum home & in a frum community.. she knows it all but is rebellious. Together with her husband, they gradually went more and more secular. She no longer covers her hair. Unfortunately there are many such couples in our generation.
I will of course try to make a Kiddush Hashem, maybe maybe it will have a positive effect on them, but my main focus is going to have to be to protect myself and my children.

I liked what BenHashem said about talking to my wife about it. I have spoken to her today and told her about my concerns... this in itself will be a Shemira אי”ה.

You are doing great
Keep us posted

upanddown wrote on 17 Jun 2024 23:44:

Gevaldig. Sunlight is the best disinfectant as they say. Good to hear you were able to be open about the issue with your wife. In addition to the practical benefits of her acting as your "wingman" to stop any inappropriate/excessive conversing with this woman, they say the act of being honest with yourself and others about lust kills it.

Is she one of those people who deliberately tries to mess with careful guys, or is it innocent? Nafka mina being the mental attitude you take in ognoring it.

retrych wrote on 18 Jun 2024 16:12:

I don't think she's doing it in order to be מכשיל.
She's more like trying to feel accepted by us for who she has chosen to be and for the way she has chosen to live. And she is over friendly.
Happens to be she really is naturally very pretty.
But iyH I'll manage to avoid challenging situations..
Thanks to all of you for your support!! It's amazing to be connected to such great Yidden here on GYE, everyone is trying to battle this final YH before Moshiach comes... 
מי כעמך ישראל

Another thought came to mind, as I contemplated random things during my quiet commute home after work. (It’s nice once in a while to have that quiet time to just exist with yourself). I read this in Rav Greenwald’s incredible sefer Guiding with Wisdom (original lashon hakodesh Eitzos v’Hadrachos vol 1) and didn’t even realize that I was applying it in this way. Rav Greenwald discusses the main goal of a person – to achieve shleimus. For every unique person, what they need to do to accomplish this is different. So how do we know what it is we need to do? This line in my signature comes from the sefer: The yetzarim a person has the most trouble dealing with are his most powerful God-given tools for developing his potential and achieving shleimus. This is a concept that probably most people have heard at some point. Where you struggle the most is where your main tachlis lies.

Rav Greenwald continues and says more things we’ve probably heard before, that our challenges are tailor made for us, so we can grow. He then brings a new perspective to looking at some of these struggles. Not just the overall goal of conquering our YH, but case-by-case. When you happen upon that crack in your filter, Hashem is showing where you need to mend it. When you get ambushed by a sighting in public, Hashem is showing where your shmiras einayim needs to be refined. These “failures” are actually gifts, in that Hashem is communicating to us exactly what we he wants us to work on. We are obviously talking about the unintentional part after the fact. The 2nd look or any successive steps are on me, but the initial oneis which might leave me wondering “why?!” is my divine GPS saying turn left here.

This woman is in your house and if it could be considered an oneis situation for you, then you might wonder why Hashem sent this nisayon. Perhaps He wants you to recognize your vulnerability in this area and now that you are aware of it you can and are dealing with it. This is growth and refinement that Hashem sent tailor made for you to get closer to your shleimus. Knowing this can be a chizuk, not to focus as much on the nisayon as purely negative, but a deliberate opportunity to ascend beyond your past self, both in this moment and for the future.

Continued Hatzlacha!

@BenHashemBH - thanks for your post. I have been thinking about what you wrote and it really resonates with me. Eitzos Vehadrachos is truly a remarkable Sefer.

Re my current Nisayon, BH so far I have managed to overcome any triggers. Thanks to all of you for your support! I have no words... מי כעמך ישראל! If not for GYE I would def have fallen already...
Hashgacha Pratis that my wife went to the Mikva the same night that this couple arrived. So it made things slightly easier... פת בסלו.

Shabbos is coming and its def going to be more difficult.
Need some Tefillos...
"Upanddown  ben  Upandup" (I'm sure thats what my father would have named himself on GYE)