About two months ago I had a fall, for some reason (which both myself and my therapist considered valid) I decided not to tell my wife straight away but to postpone it. After talking it over again with my therapist I told my wife which resulted in her losing her trust in me (she caught me last year, her condition to try build up again was honesty).
She keeps telling me I'm a liar which I find exaggerated. I do relate to her issue of honesty, understanding I haven't been as straightforward as she expected but I find the term 'lying' to be too much.

Yesterday over the course of an hour she managed to tell my parents I'm a lousy boss (too kind with the employees), she told me that our marriage is a total failure (in the sense that she expected a faithful husband, now she knows she will never have that from me) and that I don't understand the first thing about feelings (which is more or less right).
Basically after working on my recovery for almost one year and being sober most of it I feel like a total loser. Although my wife did apologize later on I know what she thinks about me and that doesn't give me much hope.
Besides fighting for myself I'm kind of asking myself now what's the point? She might be right on some or all points but right now I'm quite desperate.  

About two months ago I had a fall, for some reason (which both myself and my therapist considered valid) I decided not to tell my wife straight away but to postpone it. After talking it over again with my therapist I told my wife which resulted in her losing her trust in me (she caught me last year, her condition to try build up again was honesty).

She keeps telling me I'm a liar which I find exaggerated. I do relate to her issue of honesty, understanding I haven't been as straightforward as she expected but I find the term 'lying' to be too much.



Yesterday over the course of an hour she managed to tell my parents I'm a lousy boss (too kind with the employees), she told me that our marriage is a total failure (in the sense that she expected a faithful husband, now she knows she will never have that from me) and that I don't understand the first thing about feelings (which is more or less right).

Basically after working on my recovery for almost one year and being sober most of it I feel like a total loser. Although my wife did apologize later on I know what she thinks about me and that doesn't give me much hope.

Besides fighting for myself I'm kind of asking myself now what's the point? She might be right on some or all points but right now I'm quite desperate.  

 Yikes! So sorry for you. Tough time right now.



However, you were honest, went to a therapist, worked a plan to tell her. She is a woman who feels scorned and said the marriage is a "total failure". Probably this is an exaggeration even in her own mind but she needed to say that to get out all her pent up emotions.

Remember my good friend if you:

1) have decided to do whatever it takes for sobriety, your marriage etc(sounds like marriage therapy would be helpful)

2) you are taking concrete and proven steps in that regard.

If this is you one day at a time, then you have earned the right to feel wholesome and proud of yourself one day at a time.

As for your wife coming around? That will take time and will automatically come(most likely) - as a direct result of you living properly every day.

Hang in there

Love ya man!

mike dupont wrote on 25 Aug 2016 08:57:

Ultimately your wife is not the final arbiter of what you are, and you are the guy who was sober for most of a year, and you're a different person because of it. No-one and nothing can take away that achievement and make you into the guy who continued acting out for the past year.

Other posters have also heard harsh words from their dearly beloved spouses, and have also seen an improvement in their marriages after they continued working on themselves.

May Hashem help you get there bkarov.

Mike I feel for you!

Is there any reason why you have to be sharing your recovery with your wife

First of all I'd like to thank you guys for your positive attitude, I just needed to see that.

Actually I told my wife just an hour ago I'm not sure we should continue having all these discussions. I understand she's traumatized and needs time to regain her confidence in me but when she expresses all her feelings and all the things she doesn't want to do I feel my self esteem is just disappearing.

This being said my therapist (who sees us together at times) told us we should discuss it.
So, how do I go on with this?
Any experience that can be shared?

My experience is that sometimes it seems like the right thing to share recovery with the wife and sometimes it seems like the wrong thing.
I usually discuss it with my sponsor, but it is definitely a confusing parsha.

She obviously needs Hadracha to know how to deal with you. Therapist/ Rabbi/Rebbetzin.

As eslaasos said you have achieved a lot.

Yet, there is something about a wife's way that can bring us up emotionally or chas v'shalom bring us down. Why not do your best to get her working on your team?

I very much relate to what you're going through and feel for you. For me the most frustrating thing was feeling hopeless that anything can really change.

I would feel SO dejected when I worked so hard at something and then felt that my wife would knock me right back to square one with words that made me feel like a total failure.

I'm going to repost something i wrote on a different thread in the baalei batim section, (I think the topic is "OK I've finally hit rock bottom" if you want to see the whole thread) maybe it can provide some level of chizuk, because my wife and I are in a much better place now BH:

"neshamaincharge" post=258414 date=1435802390 catid=19
Boy can I relate to your situation! I could've written the exact same post when I started here at GYE.

My main concern was how I can get my wife to trust me again. Of course I knew that I had to stay clean, but what was more important to me was to get my wife's trust back.

I began to turn the corner when (based on advice i received on this forum) I made a decision. I was getting out of show business. I quit putting effort into showing that I was trustworthy. Instead, I focused my effort on BEING trustworthy.

For some people that might be just semantics, but for me it was (still is) a big deal. I used to spend so much energy on whether or not she trusted me, resented her when she didn't fully trust me when I feel I'd "earned" it back already, hiding anything I might've done because I thought it would ruin any trust I had built up already (and that was most important to me), etc.

I started (believe me, this didn't happen overnight, and I'm still growing) to actually accept and take responsibility for my actions and the consequences that come along with it. I'm not just talking about what I said to her, I'm talking about my own mindset first.

In the past, because I was so ashamed of my poor choices, I wanted to give quick lip service to the fact that I was wrong, I was sorry, I  felt horrible and will never do it again. Then I wanted to move on and forget about it. "Be positive!" I would get so upset at her if she would ever bring up that she felt anxious or nervous or felt any difficulty trusting. I would either resent her or shut down emotionally, if she had any hesitation with desiring intimacy with me.

No, I don't allow myself to wallow in guilt over the past. However I do allow her to share her feelings- her pain, her anxiety, her feelings or hurt and betrayal, her feeling used and violated (gulp- those kind of words always used to send me over the edge). I try to the best of my ability to connect with those feelings, and feel for a minute what it might feel like for her. To recognize that I will never be able to fully comprehend what she goes through.

All of the systems that you put into place will help, but you need to be in a place where you trust yourself before you can even think of her beginning to trust. She wants desperately to trust her husband. She doesn't want to ask you if you've been "behaving".

Tell her (& yourself!) over and over and over again that you don't expect her trust at this point. She doesn't have to trust your words, because your actions will do the talking.

Love her. Accept her. Appreciate her. Be in awe and wonder at how she has, and continues to give to you with love. Take responsibility for your actions and their results.

Be real with her. Quit hiding. This was more difficult for me than "staying clean". Remember how your wife was more upset with the hiding and lying? My wife said the same thing. Many times. I didn't believe her! Then gibbor120 told me that many wives around here say the same thing. OK, so it might be true. (Maybe they've been reading our forum and conspiring to make up this "more hurt with the lying and hiding stuff" )

Read some Dov quotes. Express your gratitude for hashem's goodness constantly. Read some more Dov quotes- especially the married section.

You know how they say that a watched pot never boils? It's a similar idea. Her trust will come back sooner if you aren't focused on it.

You have a fantastic life ahead of you! Hopefully you can spare your wife some of the עגמת נפש that i put my wife through.

Looking forward to hearing your updates, positive or not so positive- as long as they're real. Hatzlacha!!

No, I don't allow myself to wallow in guilt over the past.

--> How do you achieve this? I know the theory but it's easier said than done. Tachles, I messed up many aspects of my life (this includes my wife and children) which I'm not sure I can turn back.

This morning I started in a more positive way than the last days. The chizuk that I receive here is helping to realize that this is just a temporary dip and I shouldn't despair too quickly.
I also went running, this give me positive feelings (I track my runs and analyze my achievements, no feelings involved with this activity). 

mike dupont wrote on 25 Aug 2016 08:57:

Join Dov's Desperados 

mike dupont wrote on 08 Sep 2015 15:17:


You gotta start TRUCKING, not relying on anyone else for your recovery

All the best

Mark

mike dupont wrote on 26 Aug 2016 10:39:

Mike - One thing I can tell you. Being over 50 I have the benefit of years of experience in life. Many people have made many consistent errors over time. However, I have seen so many miraculous changes in families.
If: you are steadfast in your dedication to being sober. Doing whatever it takes and daven hard you should see changes. Many guys here can attest to the fact that when I see many days/years of sobriety I PM them and ask. Have you sen positive changes in other aspects of your life now that you have significant days of being clean? All I can say is that everyone I have asked has answered in the affirmative - yes!
Everone I asked said yes! True I did not ask all members of the forum but I did ask a considerable amount of them.
Just do the right thing, try your best and leave the rest to Hashem.

"God, Give us the grace to accept with serenity
the things that cannot be changed, Courage
to change the things which should be changed,
And the wisdom to distinguish the one from the other."

mike dupont wrote:

Mike, I know women don't always buy logic, especially in this kind of situation, but here is how it seems from a logical point of view. 
Do you think you should have told her as the thought of viewing "it" came to your mind?
How about as you were viewing it? 
How about the second it was over?
She obviously knows you are in a struggle and there is a possibility to fall, right?
So if a reasonable person would not expect you to be perfect, implicit in that is the hiding of that information for a given time. (namely at least the time of the fall). Now, you say you had a valid reason (approved by your therapist) to withhold this information for more time. If she can agree that withholding information for the actual time of acting out is not dishonest, then it's just a matter of discretion as to how much time must go by before you tell her. Since you actually planned on telling her and you presumably wanted to be in a certain frame of mind before doing so, that is analogous to withholding for the five minutes of given discretion. 
Hatzlacha rabba!!!

dovb wrote on 28 Aug 2016 05:27:


Dovb,
Good luck getting a woman to buy that drasha. The reason why they don't buy it is bc the emotion of it FEELS like you want to hide from them. Perhaps a pre-agreed time- like Chas veshalom if I fall I will tell you within a day or within two- might work better. (I think neshama told me that idea.

Even better, my wife didn't want to hear that I fell, rather, we made up that I would tell her by a certain time, and I would tell her what I did to rectify the situation. (Reaching out, etc.)

Hatzlocha

Well, there you have the difference between men and women. Men -mostly- think logically and women use their emotions. On some issues my wife and me won't agree anyway.

I'm actually trying to understand her point of view  which isn't easy to me (i'm very bad when it comes to understand and dealing with emotions) but I think this should be a good start.
Hopefully I'll be able to take responsibility for my actions and be able to act differently next time.
I've finally been able to define for myself what I consider my triggers. It took me some time but BH I believe I'm making some progress. 
Thanks again for all your support