Workingguy wrote on 20 Jul 2017 08:18:

I think we should leave it up to the mechaber

serenity wrote on 19 Jul 2017 02:14:

you're right in your point but not not in fact - pornography is one sin thing and being  עובר על הנדר is another..!

serenity wrote on 20 Jul 2017 00:23:

true - but the Taphsic method is something that GYE strongly suggest. i would never take that on my own. 

Lovely Jew wrote on 20 Jul 2017 10:25:

Maybe we should ask GYE to tone down the suggestion
Heres another case in point, and not the first, where people swear aliegance to Chinese food because it's promoted as such a cure it all, when I'm waiting for any real stats from gye how powerful is Tapsic as a stand alone tool

I believe it does help some but my guess is that it's a very small percent 

Taphsic is built on the premise of "When under a lust attack swear it off". IMHO For most of us even non addicts, that's not the greatest break-free tool...

Yes, thank you. I understand that now. 

MarkZ asked me to say how I stay sober. For me it's very simple. I put my sobriety before everything else in my life, because I don't have anything without it.  I don't have a God in my life to even make an oath to when I'm acting out. My God is a loving, caring, tolerant, patient and accepting god. He is a Father to me when I need direction and when I'm sick and suffering he is right there with me cradling me in His arms like my mother held me as  a baby. When I'm acting out in my sickness and my insanity he is right there with me, I just don't realize it. You don't have to believe a guy like me for any of this just take a look in kuntres umayain that teaches that no person will sin unless a ruach shtus enters his mind and that's talking about a regular person! How much more so for a sick person like me! If a person felt that Hashem is right there with him and all he has to do is fall in his arms and surrender why would he turn to porn for comfort. If you're thinking because the porn is offering actual physical comfort right now and not theoretical vision of bliss then you are proving my point. 

​Not everyone's mind works the same and the mind of an addict is sick. We turn to the very source of our problems and discomfort for comfort. But where does all this stem from? It stems from our character defects and fear. For me it stems greatly from my ego and fear. So if you give me a religion that feeds ego gratification for success and employs fear to prevent transgression, then that religion is feeding right into my addict mind and I will turn elsewhere for comfort. If your can't relate to this then you should probably never listen to another  word I say. 

​I was talking to my sister the other day and I told her that I don't to shul to find God. I go to shul because I found God. I found God in the struggles of human beings and in human fragility. I found God when I was brought to a place of surrender and the realization that I'm powerless over life. A religion that teaches me that I have power is too much for an addict like me to handle. I've had more blessings and seen more good in my life by just surrendering and doing nothing than I have ever seen when I run on self will and control. An oath, my friends, for me is all about my power. It's the exact opposite of what I need as an addict. To me an oath implies that I have the power over lust and that God is distant from me.  If I make an oath to a distant God who will reward me for keeping it and  punish me for breaking it that is just feeding into my ego and fear. 

Now you may say, but isn't that what Toras emes teaches, so how can it not work for you. I would say back that first off all there are many drachim to Torah and secondly I'm a sick person and I need medical help and recovery. And if I have diabetes I don't look to Torah for the treatment. It just so happens that Torah offers me a lot of help in my disease but i need a guide to what is healthy for me and what isn't and that guide is the 12 steps and my sponsor. 

So Mark, the answer is that I put sobriety first (or I try to). It is the most important thing to me and without it I have nothing and with it I have everything that God wants to have. And without sobriety no one has me.