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Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery?
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TOPIC: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 17536 Views

Re: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 15:11 #269273

  • Watson
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cordnoy wrote:

you write: addicts don't need SA; they need the 12 steps.
Then: the 12 steps must be done in a group.


They need a group. Not necessarily SA. What's shver?

I feel I've been derailed so I want to make my point again.

I don't have a problem with addicts using GYE. I'm an addict I use GYE.

I feel that non-addicts calling themselves addicts can be damaging. I think it could potentially be used as denial (some people don't want to be a regular guy who just made a mistake, it's more comfortable to be 'powerless'), and it gives the real addicts here the wrong impression, making their recovery more difficult than it has to be.

Re: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 15:19 #269274

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Watson wrote:
cordnoy wrote:

you write: addicts don't need SA; they need the 12 steps.
Then: the 12 steps must be done in a group.


They need a group. Not necessarily SA. What's shver?

I feel I've been derailed so I want to make my point again.


perhaps we are harpin' on two different points, but a group workin' the 12 steps is what's known as SA.

the point I am interested in here (not in original poll, but some posts and conversations afterwards) is: What works for an addict?
What is your answer?
1. SA (meetings of 12 steps)
2. GYE
3. Combination.
4. Other
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If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.

Re: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 15:33 #269275

  • Markz
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I like repeating great quotes
Dr wrote:
I feel that non-addicts calling themselves addicts can be damaging. I think it could potentially be used as denial etc....

I feel there are people here who are chronic slippers and are blissfully unaware... If they were part of a group, someone would be able to call them out on their BS. Not to upset them or feel superior, to help them and save their lives. But they're not in a real group, they're here on GYE sitting behind a computer listening to these messages from others who call themselves addicts but really are not (I don't mean you specifically Skep, I'm talking in general terms)...


Dov wrote:

Unfortunately, there is this thing called denial, and it delays that final destination...while families and neshoma's and marriages rot in living hell



cordnoy wrote:

Oh, it seems you can only see results after you vote....

9494 You can see results before you vote
Try it - go to this page without logging in
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Last Edit: 22 Nov 2015 15:35 by Markz. Reason: why not

Re: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 15:41 #269277

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SA, SAA, SLAA, AA, NA, OA, CA. OINK....?

Yes but R' Avrohom, picture this scenario:

You run a poll asking what works and most people say GYE is the main source of recovery.

Now a real addict comes on to GYE for the first time and sees that people say they recovered from their addiction on GYE. So he tries to do what they do. And it doesn't work. Year after year he keeps trying to do what those 'recovered addicts' did on GYE and he keeps falling flat on his face. And people keep telling him he's doing well, making progress. It never occurs to him that he is fundamentally different from the people he is getting advice from. Why would he?

Far fetched? It happened to me.

The problem as I see it is not that the addict came to GYE. That seems a logical first step towards recovery. But the fact that almost everyone here calls themselves an addict creates an incorrect impression of recovery. And so many people have come here, tried to recover from a real addiction using the wrong tools and then left disappointed, not knowing that there is a solution for him.

Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 15:48 #269280

  • skeptical
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Dr. Watson

I feel that non-addicts calling themselves addicts can be damaging. I think it could potentially be used as denial (some people don't want to be a regular guy who just made a mistake, it's more comfortable to be 'powerless'), and it gives the real addicts here the wrong impression, making their recovery more difficult than it has to be.


My experience (3+ years worth) on GYE shows that GYE members are very very very very reluctant to call themselves addicts. Nobody is using it as denial. Everyone wants to just be a regular guy. I am pretty sure that you yourself denied that you were an addict until the very end, but I'd have to look that up to be sure.

Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 15:54 #269281

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Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 16:00 #269283

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My experience is that real addicts deny it to the last, while a lot of non-addicts are quick to call themselves addicts.

Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 16:05 #269284

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Last Edit: 22 Nov 2015 16:05 by skeptical.

Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 16:07 #269286

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Actually my thread is a great example of a guy calling himself an addict without even really knowing what that meant, thinking it was under control because I had made 'progress', 'working' the 12 steps by himself to no avail, then refusing to go to SA for a very long time, even fighting vehemently against it. Here is my first post there:

qi wrote:
Hello all,

I'm in my late 20s and have been masturbating since I was 12. By the time I found out it was wrong I was so used to it I couldn't stop. I saw lots of pornographic pictures online but wasn't addicted until I discovered pornographic videos. I tried hundreds of times to stop but when the inevitable fall happened I despaired of ever fully recovering. That changed about a year ago when I started really trying to stop and when I fell I got right back up.

However, I'm far from recovered. The longest I've gone is 40 days with no P or M. I found GYE a few weeks ago and joined last week. I think it's fantastic that we have a frum site on this. And, it's much better organised that goyishe equivalents.

So here I am trying to kick the habit of a lifetime for a lifetime. I'm interested in the 12 steps although I don't fully understand how they work. But here goes:

Hi, my name's Qi and I'm a porn addict. Porn has damaged my life considerably. It affected my school work when I stayed up till 2 am looking at it. It affected my learning when I needed to leave mid seder to M. It affected my shidduchim in a profound way. It made me depressed when shidduchim were hard. It affected my shteiging because nothing else matters compared to this. It affected my moods. It affected my relationship with my family. It affected my relationship with HKBH.

When I first found out it was wrong I still didn't know how bad it was. I'm ashamed to admit this but I actually masturbated on Yom Kippur once. HKBH please have mercy on me and forgive me.

Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 16:16 #269288

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Doc
I think all that you bring up is irrelevant to this string
The question being asked to people that passed 100 days is
What was your Primary Source of Recovery?

Simple question simple answer

Cordnoy forgot to put his signature in the header
"What was your Primary Source of Recoverin'?"
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Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 16:17 #269289

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I don't understand why you judge qi to not be an addict. He doesn't say very much, and what he does say seems to point in the direction that he actually does have a problem.

And by the way, I know people who joined SA and thought that progress meant finally having control of the problem.

I don't see the difference.
Last Edit: 22 Nov 2015 16:33 by skeptical.

Re: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 16:19 #269291

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Watson wrote:
SA, SAA, SLAA, AA, NA, OA, CA. OINK....?

Yes but R' Avrohom, picture this scenario:

You run a poll asking what works and most people say GYE is the main source of recovery.

Now a real addict comes on to GYE for the first time and sees that people say they recovered from their addiction on GYE. So he tries to do what they do. And it doesn't work. Year after year he keeps trying to do what those 'recovered addicts' did on GYE and he keeps falling flat on his face. And people keep telling him he's doing well, making progress. It never occurs to him that he is fundamentally different from the people he is getting advice from. Why would he?

Far fetched? It happened to me.

The problem as I see it is not that the addict came to GYE. That seems a logical first step towards recovery. But the fact that almost everyone here calls themselves an addict creates an incorrect impression of recovery. And so many people have come here, tried to recover from a real addiction using the wrong tools and then left disappointed, not knowing that there is a solution for him.


maskim.
that could be a problem - if it's true.
i don't know.
all i am askin' is for you to say that: An addict needs 12 steps!
simple
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.

Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 16:19 #269292

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It's like starting a poll whether you eat cheese or not.

Then comes along a lactose intolerant.........

Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 16:22 #269293

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Dr. Watson

It's like starting a poll whether you eat cheese or not.

Then comes along a lactose intolerant.........


Huh?

So a lactose intolerant person comes along.

So what?

Re: Poll: What was your Primary Source of Recovery? 22 Nov 2015 16:54 #269300

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skeptical wrote:
I don't understand why you judge qi to not be an addict. He doesn't say very much, and what he does say seems to point in the direction that he actually does have a problem.


Qi was my previous name, that was my first post.

skeptical wrote:
Dr. Watson

It's like starting a poll whether you eat cheese or not.

Then comes along a lactose intolerant.........


Huh?

So a lactose intolerant person comes along.

So what?


OK, I've gotten all tied up in knots here. I lose the debate.

White: Bishop to Queen 6
Black: Resigns
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