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A platform of recovery for Jews who find themselves struggling with addictions to pornography, masturbation or other sexual problems. Post anonymously about your struggles without fear of anyone finding out who you are. Ask questions, post answers and be inspired! Get tips and guidance from the experts who moderate this forum, as well as from fellow strugglers.

TOPIC: Tryin' 167098 Views

Tryin' 23 Jun 2013 09:41 #210029

  • cordnoy
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Shalom
I am in my 40s married with children
Recently, I decided to get help on a serious level with my addiction .

My mind wanders and the tayva builds.
It would be easy to blame this on the lack of excitement in marriage intimacy, but I had done this at times before marriage, and at times, when marriage bedroom was good, id still fall. Perhaps it still is the reason, but marriage stuff is probably not getting better anytime soon.
I have more to write, but as this is my first post, id like to hear some suggestions first please.
Thank you so much
C
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.
Last Edit: 04 Nov 2014 12:11 by cordnoy.

Re: tryin 23 Jun 2013 11:11 #210036

  • reallygettingthere
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Welcome Cordnoy,

My name is Eli (real name)

Thanks for sharing your story. I'm sorry to here that there is a difficult family situation. May Hashem give the the strength you need to deal with it.

Sounds like you are very frustrated.

The good news is that you are not alone.

There are some very wise people on this forum who have gotten themselves out of some really sticky situations. They will be able to help you find a path toward sanity (yes, sanity).

You started posting. That's good.

I would suggest at this point to forget the religious aspect of this problem. Whatever you know obviously isn't stopping you from masturbating and doing who knows what else. Save the frumkeit for later.

The reason to get a handle on this problem is that you probably have no life. I too had no life before I had a handle on this problem. Every spare second I had I was masturbating to porn in the bathroom, so I never had time for my wife, I never had time for kids, I was always late for everything - including work. This terribly strained all my significant relationships.

Why do you want to get help?


Eli
Roy in the SA White Book noted that we frequently prayed and it did not work...because the best we could muster was begging G-d to "Please take it away, so I will not have to give it up!

No amount of sobriety can cure the insanity -ChaimCharlie

The emmes hurts but fake chizzuk will hurt more -Bards

Remember, best block, no be there - Mr. Miyagi

Re: tryin 23 Jun 2013 17:20 #210041

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Thank you eli
I appreciate all your words and chizuk

Lateness is not my problem, but I do get behind in work because of all these things.

Why do I want to stop?
Here is the short answer, and I plan on elaborating.
1 god
2 marriage
3 family
4 self


Tysm
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.
Last Edit: 18 Feb 2016 23:29 by cordnoy.

Re: tryin 24 Jun 2013 02:03 #210118

  • Chachaman
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don't worry about "teshuva" or seriousness of the aveira.

I'll be honest: its good you're seeing a therapist. excellent. However, if you want to know the religious side, se a Rav. It is a serious issur. Can you kill someone if they are going to die in a year anyway?

its the y"h speaking.

with that being said, the "issur" side of it isn't why you are going to stoo--the concept is too vague.

Who have you opened up to about this?

The addiction fills a void in your life. What void is that? do some soul searching or 12 steps. The main point in recovery is to start living.

also, are you prepared to give up lust to Hashem DURING RECOVERY? Talk to Dov about that, or see Gibbor120's Dov quotes page (most recent) for clarification.

Be prepared to attain a genuine relationship with Hashem while living one day at a time and not worrying about what happened yesterday or might happen tomorrow.

my name's Robert. Nice to meet you "tysm" (?) and good luck! Hashem loves you more then you can imagine.

Re: tryin 24 Jun 2013 02:22 #210122

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Thank you robert
Tysm
Thank you so much

I do not understand your analogy
You can't kill someone that will die
My zera, however, al pi derech hateva will not produce another child

Unless you are saying that every zera has potential child, and hotzaah is killing that child
Seems weird though

My relationship to god is not the strongest right now
I am extremely frum however

I have told all to frum therapist
Told all to a rav via email

Don't know the void
Will need to look at those ideas you sent

Tysm
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.
Last Edit: 18 Feb 2016 23:30 by cordnoy.

Re: tryin 24 Jun 2013 06:12 #210129

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I'm not a Rav, so I don't know. However, the issur is said to be extremely serious, and the sefarim talk a lot about the seriousness and negative consequences. see briskodesh.org for more info (but again, I don't find negative reinforcement helpful b'sha'as ma'a'seh.

Assuming you are correct, its still a king Shlomo type of thing.

the point also: determine whether or not u are an addict. We all are to some extent. An alcoholic wouldn't even take a sip of wine in recovery, whereas a person can.

I'll be frank with you: do you want to be happy or instead self Medicare your issues. no amount of religion can make that choice for you.

Re: tryin 24 Jun 2013 06:26 #210133

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Yes, I wanna be happy
One slip up ruins an entire month
Its like it never happened
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.
Last Edit: 01 Jan 2014 02:14 by cordnoy.

Re: tryin 24 Jun 2013 19:49 #210163

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Have you read the GYE handbook? It's also on a page called "21 principles" somewhere on this website, which is a yesod in recovery:

Your past gains are not ruined by one fall.

You see, the point of recovery is to not measure your progress on a 90-day chart or to see how big of a streak you can get.

If that were the point, then you would be right, that one slip or fall that gets you back to day 0 would ruin everything.

I don't like the 90 day chart for that reason. Because 90 days is a means to an end, not an end in and of itself. If it motivates you to continue a streak, great! But the point is to take things one day at a time.

Let's say you are climbing up a mountain in the winter. God forbid you trigger a small avalanche that sets you back 100 feet. Has it taken you to the base of the mountain? Of course not! A slip does not set back your entire recovery.

I fell this morning (I was in a half-sleep state). I'm kind of mad at myself for falling in that manner. But does that mean I've lost all my progress because my streak now says "0"? Of course not! I've made tremendous progress in the last year.

The point of recovery is to start living, and to surrender all lust to Hashem. All-too often on our streaks, we don't surrender our lust to Hashem. If you are underwater, you can only hold your breath so long. If you are above-water, you don't need to hold your breath.

From that perspective, a fall doesn't ruin anything. It can in fact be sent from Hashem as a thing to make you more humble (see "sonoftheking" for more of the Torah on that if you are interested).

We all get improper thoughts. It's how you deal with them. Getting frustrated just because you get them is counterproductive.

Make sense?

Re: tryin 24 Jun 2013 21:30 #210181

  • cordnoy
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Thank you for the analogy
It is putting it into practice that is difficult
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.

Re: tryin 24 Jun 2013 21:54 #210187

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Very much so. I go around posting all of this stuff on the forum, but I don't know if I always practice what I preach. However, I figure that I will eventually listen to what I am saying lol.

It's natural to be upset after a fall or slip. Here's the litmus test:

If that feeling of being upset or mad at yourself enhances your avodas Hashem, then it is from the yetzer Hatov.

if the feeling just gets you depressed and detracts from your avodas Hashem, then it is the yetzer hara.

it is okay to be upset sometimes--just make sure that you channel that feeling in the proper direction.

Re: tryin 25 Jun 2013 00:20 #210207

Shalom, and welcome.

In one of your posts you said:


Oh, I am an addict - of that I know
Yes, I wanna be happy
One slip up ruins an entire month
Its like it never happened


From what I have come to understand, an addict cannot view his drug as something that is a minor set back only when he slips. Rather it is something that will eventually kill us. Not necessarily literally, but living enslaved to something which has the ability to suck the life out of you at its will, cannot be called truly living. On your list of reasons to be sober, I think that your life should be number one. because even if you are sober for a long period, you may still be enslaved to the lust, to the images and fantasies in your mind, not just the acts themselves. a person enslaved is not living the life he should or could, and that is his main responsibility. A secondary result of not being the you you are meant to be is that others suffer, but once you are the you that you can be, then you can be the tool that Hashem wants you to be to do good in the world including to those that He put in your immediate surrounding (wife and kids). So, why stop, because you are worth it, because your life has infinite value, because with it you can do much good, the good you were meant to do. - I hope that makes sense.

The other thing that I noticed was that you have told a lot of people. Let me share with you a little something I read recently in the white book,


I see now that in all my religious striving and psychotherapy I was waiting for the miracle to happen first, that I should somehow be zapped or "fixed," unable ever to fall or be tempted again. I thought that if a person just had the right religious belief, he was automatically "a new creature; old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." That all thought of lust would be removed, much as a tumor would be excised by a surgeon. The "religious solution" was one of the subtlest strategies in my arsenal of denial.
I didn't realize that the essence of being human is to have free choice. God doesn't want to remove from me the possibility of falling; he wants me to have the freedom to choose not to fall. I'd been praying self-righteously all along, "Please God, take it away!" not realizing my inner heart was piteously whining, ". . . so I won't have to give it up." There was belief in God without surrender. That belief availed nothing! I had never died to lust.


To me this rang such a bell, I tried many things, all the time hoping that that would be the magical step that would take the lust away from me, but they didn't and never would. not until I was really willing to give it up. and to tell you the truth I am not, but I know it, and that is the goal I am working towards.

Either way, what I think I am trying to say, is that its not about who or how many people you tell that necessarily reflects sincere motivation to stop, but rather willingness to actually give up the drug that has been a crutch keeping one afloat all these years, which when I actually think about it actually scares me half to death.

Oh and by the way, don't get the wrong idea, way to go on one week, the first step to RECOVERY is SOBRIETY.

MAY G-D HELP

Re: tryin 25 Jun 2013 00:40 #210220

  • cordnoy
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Wow!
Tysm
Very insightful
In short, you are saying:
1. Focus on living - that is me; meaning taking control of life 9this is what I called "self"]
2. Resolution to give it up (not tiptoeing around the issue in various ways)

[I sorta felt that way about the taphsik method; except that it is a way to help become clean]

Tysm

A lot what to think about
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.

Re: tryin 08 Jul 2013 20:47 #211497

Hi Cordnoy,
I have read your entries and realize that I am in a very similar situation to yours, both in age and in the scope of my problem.
The only thing that has helped me was connecting with people like you who are facing a similar struggle to mine.
As I am typing, I am also listening in on Duvid Chaim's phone conference. This is also extremely helpful. I will be doing my 5th step call with my sponsor shortly and I am quite afraid of it. The thought of opening up my life to a total stranger and disclose all the despicable things I have done, completely disarms me and scares me.
The lure of the "clubs" and the warm feeling I get when I go and approach the Y"H, seems so impossible to resist while I am away, alone and isolated.
When I talk about it or write about it here, the sanity that the spotlight of the public discussion shines and illuminates on my lustful desire, vaporizes the lust. Discussing this rationally, exposes the irrationality of indulging and helps to dissipate an itch before it progresses to urge, desire and overwhelming wave of a free fall.
We can change our lives or rather reclaim our lives, one day at a time, together with all our wonderful friends here.
I have all my friends in mind when I daven every day because I want to change as a group.
Please daven for me as well. To me changing is nothing short of a nes, a miracle. I need your teffilos to help me merit this ness I so desperately need for my sake, the sake of my wife and children and all my descendants, and all of Klal Yisroel.

Re: tryin 08 Jul 2013 21:28 #211511

  • cordnoy
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thank you
very well put

I have basically opened up to therapist on phone and to all my buddies here.

if you know of some way we can help each other more, please let me know

I am available in all sorts of ways

thank you
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.
Last Edit: 18 Feb 2016 23:32 by cordnoy.

Re: tryin 28 Jul 2013 08:00 #213811

  • cordnoy
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reflections
happy and ecstatic about life
streak will go on, and on iy"H

marriage and intimacy....nu nu, so so

why ruin a good thread?
lets stick to being clean!

Onwards!
My email: thenewme613@hotmail.com
My threads:
GYE Handbook | Gibbor's Insights | GYE FAQ - Thanks Skep and DMS123456789 White Book | Big Book (Alcoholics Anonymous)

If one gives up at the first sign of a struggle, he is really not ready to be successful."
"Tryin' and doin' are two different thin's - tryin' is hopin'; doin' is succeedin'.
"The right thin' to do and the hard thin' to do are usually the same."


Disclaimer: I am not a cheerleader; B"H, there are many on the site. I am here to change myself, and with God's help, by some mistake, I might even help change others.

MY POSTS ARE NOT WRITTEN AS A MODERATOR UNLESS EXPLICITLY STATED.
Last Edit: 18 Feb 2016 23:33 by cordnoy.
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