Hashivalisesonyishecho Its good to know its your thread....but guess what it really is GYE and they do the copyright otherwise i wouldnt be able to post..............But dont worry your my Good friend too.....maybe you should also have a nigun that we can call it on your name.....................

shlomoy wrote:



but I thank you the Baal Haachsanya Hashiva.......and be Moichel if I said something wrong.

Woah, Neveragain - May I remind you of what Bill and Bob wrote near the end of their book: "This book is suggestive only...". My sponsor reminded me once that this is not a matter of faith, just experience. If something doesn't work for you, why would anyone want to keep it? Is AA or SA a religion? Last time I checked, the Program was secular (look up the word if you think [as I did] that it means "w/o G-d"). And thank G-d for that! I can have a roman catholic sponsor whose help saved my life and led me to caring about wearing rabeinu Tam's, learning with hislahavus before shacharis in the morning, building a heiligeh (sorry Reb b!) home with my wife, and learning how to be a true jewish father to my kids - and for the same reason, I am able to sponsor yidden who are frum, agnostics, frum but still totally sold on lust (oy?), evangelicals, and mormons, all the same way. And each person is precious to Hashem right where he is, and will grow into living the right way only after they become sober.

So SA is not a religion, just a toolbox. The tools work for me so far. Why listen to the religio-program types at all? Just take what works and leave what doesn't behind you!

(fluff) Dov

PS. Indulge me here...OK so what are the lies in AA? And how did you determine what wasn't working for you vs you not working it? What do you mean when you say you tried it? Do you mean that you read it and tried carrying out what they suggest, or that it just seemed so stupid that in all honesty you just couldn't bear to go there at all? Being pretty sold on much of the program, I'd like to hear it clear from someone who has been there. I may not respond, but I'd like to learn, maybe trade notes. I'm OK with that, but not debating. Thanks. If you'd prefer to PM me, that's fine. Bye!

I just read the first six pages of this thread and WOW!! do I relate to this idea of not becoming what I thought and was expected I would be.

On another note, I wish I can lust day and night without consequences and it kills me to know that I cannot. That being said, however, I am so happy that I am starting to work on this aggressively (or at least more aggressive than in the past) because I know that it means my life, job, family (in no specific order).