welcome!
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Hatzlacha!

My apologies.
I assume you mean Menachem on the chat.
Just noticed that he posted in between...will look.
I do not believe he is on this thread.
I have never been called a troll before on this site, but there's a first for everythin'.
I was and am merely tryin' to help, but I will keep quiet.

b'hatzlachah

I wish you much success and yes I can completely relate.

I don't think anyone could have given me answers. It's kind of a journey that I had to experience. I can say that my best thinking had me leading an unmanageable life. My Rebbi in yeshiva told me that when come to learn from a new Rebbi, or a different derech or sugyah, you have to come with a blank slate. No pre-conceived notions. That's my approach to SA.

Htazlacha!!!

Welcome!!!

Stick around there is a lot to learn here. So see what works for you and make it happen.

Hatzlacha Rabbah!!!

Since joining Sunday I have learned a lot.
I started thinking about a real plan based on what I've been reading and trying to understand my issues. I'm not sure how much control I have or if I'm even truly an addict so learning right now is the key.

So far this is what I got.
Log in everyday to learn more about the addiction and as a reality check, so everyday I'm being honest with myself about what I have to deal with.
Update the 90 day chart, not because 90 is a goal but so I can look back and quantify what I've gained.
Take notice of the times the urges start to learn the symptoms so I can nip it in the bud.
Am I way off?

[quote="hasttir" post=what is your plan?I was talking to Menachem[/quote]
I'm pretty new here myself, that was my very first post (hooray!).
For me, the knowledge that I had an addiction was HUGE.
I used to think that a good part of my tachlis was to fight this yetzer hara which left me feeling like my life was worthless because i couldn't possibly fulfill this tachlis. Of course, when I felt like that I turned to porn to make me feel good again. A vicious cycle.
Recovering from my addiction, however, doesn't seem to be my tachlis. I don't think Hashem gives anyone an illness with atachlis to recover from it. It's merely a tool to help him reach his tachlis.
So now I don't feel so worthless anymore. I will use my addiction to pinpoint my character flaws And fix them which is probably my real tachlis.
This has helped me stay sober for now because I am not fighting anymore instead I am figuring out how to use it to my benefit.
My plan? I hope (sorry Cordnoy) to join SA or at least a phone group but right now not logistically possible for me. But for now I'm focusing on my character flaws one at a time.. Mainly overcoming selfishness by giving giving giving especially to my spouse.
I hope this makes sense and can help you (or anyone).

Sounds pretty good, Menachem.
Welcome, by the way.
Why don't you start your own thread?

Hi! welcome and thanks for sharing your thoughts.
I think that a person's natural leaning to porn is certainly a flaw that we were born to work on. Hashem knows all too well the generation he put us in and the challenges we face daily because if it. So I think it is a tachlis. Is it any less than not being lazy and get up for schacharis? or holding back our temper? or being generous to those less fortunate? or being l"kaf zechus etc.?I do agree that at some point we should not stop at just this. In fact our success in working our personal program gives us the wherewithal to then go on and succeed at a # of different and exciting things.
However, working a program and accumulating real time being sober is in and of itself a HUGE BIG CHECK in our favor - and one to be most proud of.
Remember the famous GRA that says that the areas in life that you find you just keep on slipping - is most probably what your in the world to improve upon.
Don't underestimate the accomplishment of sobriety!

yiraishamaim wrote:


I don't know what your level addiction was but for me those bad middos were like little mice in a cage that occasionally got out compared to the huge lion of porn etc that drained the living daylights out of me trying to contain it. Not little slips that the Gaon was talking about. I had to tell this lion "I'm going out of town for a while I can't fight you anymore. Hopefully when I come back you won't recognize me anymore and you'll stop bothering me do much" Sorry for the metaphor. Ty for the feedback.

Ironic how quickly an opinion can change.
A couple of hours ago, bein hasdorim, I got home and had the empty urge to fall. I'm not sure if I would have recognized it so quickly and confidently had it not been for the time I've spent on GYE over the last few days.
I had opportunity and no real chance of getting caught, which means that on a normal day I would have no chance of winning the battle.
Because I was aware of the vulnerability so early on I kept busy and without my phone on me. I killed time by doing the laundry, which made me feel somewhat accomplished. And I kept it up till the wife got home half hour later. Eat that YH.
Cynical, not so much.

Cordnoy, my turn to apologize.

No problem whatsoever!

Lookin' forward to hearin' more.

b'hatzlachah

I hear ya

I remember getting up in the middle of the night - as if someone was just tugging me and drawing me to the basement - there I made phone calls and had phone s__ where I knew nobody could hear. how truly pathetic- It was as if I was a zombie being controlled. I wonder now if I was really that much out of control or it was just wishful thinking so I could rationalize that I was not responsible. Now I am clean for a few months and Hashem has taken this zombie attitude away from me. It is scary to think that chas v'shalom it could come back anytime. I daven hard that it doesn't.

But I was really born like an out of control animal? I had a strong leaning towards lust and I am sure with some other underlying causes that led me to become at times - a robot like lust seeking individual-by constantly seeking out this self-destructive behavior. In other words I developed a habit over time that was over simply whelming. So I think it is fair to say that after a while the pull towards this kind of behavior is not a simple as a regular tachlis.

Your right.

However, is it really less than a tachlis? - or is it really something even greater? and if we work a good program and Hashem helps us so we don't fall and we indeed accomplish many things in our lifetime - won't the very fact that we did not "act out" for so many years be an enormous achievement just of itself?

I totally relate to your "zombie" description. And I'll add a prayer for you when I daven.


My main point was just that my tachlis is not to "fight" this yetzer hara head on. That's a fight I can't win with will power alone because it's (become?) an illness. So I believe my tachlis is to fix myself.


Will it be an accomplishment if I die without acting out anymore? Maybe. Possibly. To me that will be a gift from Hashem. Like all refuos are.

thank you
I will bli neder daven for you too.
and what is any and every accomplishment if not a gift from Hashem? That's peshat -yagata umatzata ta'amin. because at the end of the day - with all the effort it is still a metzia- a find- a gift from Hashem.

But our trust in HIM and our tefillos and yegiyos help get us the seyata deshemaya to succeed. not that we really deserve it. we do a millimeter and he gives us millions of miles.
no matter what you want to call it- we need a geshmak every time we have but a moment of sobriety. I know - I need it to go on.