Hey there,

Been on and off this platform for the last year or so, and I would love to hear from some of the more experienced members (even if you're new I'd love to hear what you have to say).

I've been struggling for approximately the last 4 years with this issue (porn, masterbation). Although I've had clean streaks, the longest lasting 4+ months just 6 months ago (unfortunately during the covid lockdowns I ended up rolling back all that progress).

I am willing and able to give up my internet access (throw out my smartphone and use my kosher phone w/o internet access exclusively).

My question is, will that help me overcome masturbation? When I don't have internet access for a while, I've noticed that I don't act out as often.

Is masturbation connected to porn, meaning no porn, and my masterbation problem will be easier to cure? Or no, masturbation is the problem, and porn exacerbates that problem?

Please let me know what you think!
Thanks!

Ooooh you ask a good long debated question here and I cannot give an answer.

All I can say is that throwing away your smartphone while it may be a noble thing and even the right thing (I don't know much about you so I can't say) it's not going to be a cure for all medicine.
No one here threw out their phone and poof, 90 days clean, that's just not how it works.

So what you need to do is be brutally honest with yourself about where you are holding (perhaps share it here too), while it's true that throwing away your smartphone may be one of the steps to breaking free (or not that would depend on the person) it is just one of the steps and therefore needs to be done at the proper time.

That being said, if you know that you have no need for it and you struggle with using it for inappropriate content then it's a no brainer. But don't think that afterwards the road is going to be paved in gold.

It took (is taking) me years to break free after I got rid of my smartphone, I think it's over four years now without one and I am still struggling. 

So true. Limiting internet and access to bad apps is a great first step and it helps a ton. But it's far from a cure-all.

I've found that this battle must be fought on many fronts. We must guard ourselves, and increase our motivation, improve our willpower, and use mindfulness and similar ideas to lessen our iimpulses. And much more.

That's why it's a good idea to read through others' posts and see what worked for them. And then try all the ideas together for a significant amount of time.

Doing this will take time and effort. But our most important wish is to get clean and stay clean. It's worth the time and effort.

You didn't mention in your post if you have a filter or not, I use to have a personal laptop that I didn't install a filter with good reasons... I need it for business, It will break my expensive laptop, if will slow down the internet, it costs money, etc etc. Eventually I saw that the majority of my falls started with me knowing that I can access all my fantasies with a few clicks, so I installed a filter on it and I must say it did help a ton for me, now it's more controllable and I can use alot of the techniques I learned on this site that I couldn't even think of using before because back then the נסיון was so strong, once I was sitting in front of my screen I didn't even have a בחירה.
In short, my experience was that installing a filter was step #1 and without that I would never be able to move on and have some decent strikes.
I wish you good luck on your journey

Anonymous1051 wrote on 12 Oct 2020 05:48:

Just my experience:
getting rid of access made me have much less urges to mastubration. That’s why I’m yeshiva I would fall once or twice every zeman, but by bein hazmanim it would be much more often. Obviously there is still a struggle, but it’s been a tremendous help and first step to get a whitelist browser and a kosher phone...

I think you know the answer to the question. Guys masturbate for various reasons. For most it is their self soothing pacifier for dealing with stress, rejection, loneliness, boredom, tension, low self esteem, or any emotion they don't know how to process. In addition if they see something triggering that arouses them, unless they have learned how to distract themselves, it is only a matter of time until they masturbate.

Whether or not one watches pornography to escape the above mentioned stresses (which is usually why guys watch), or because he is a ba'al ta'avah and wants to "enjoy" fake sex, or because he is curious, there is a 95% probability (or more) that he will masturbate. The arousal is just too powerful to fight for most guys.

So to say it bluntly - it is almost impossible to stop masturbating if you are still watching pornography. Turn off the access to porn, get a GYE chaver, start exercising, get an understanding of your triggers and learn to deal with them in a kosher way, and start believing that you are a good guy that Hashem still loves, and iyh you will stop masturbating.

I know of people who can watch porn and stay clean from masturbation and when they don't have acces to porn they masturbate.
​What's better? what's a bigger sin ??
Watching porn awakes your urge to masturbate, besides all the other bad side affects that free porn brings along.

I have learned that in order to break free from porn, masturbation and all the rest, one has to restrain himself from lusting.
To lust, means to look at women in the street, to think and fantasize ..........
​You don't consider staring at women a fall, but by Lusting you'll end up falling.

There is nothing greater that I regret than watching porn in my early days. You can stop watching for many years but the scenes are still in my head.
I wish there was a delete Butten in head.

From my experience, I think porn makes things a lot worse. It has for me. With , m (masturbation) alone, the filthy thoughts would be limited to what i can imagine on my own. I'd still do the deed, but wouldn't waste nearly as much time. 

With p (porn) it's just endless and i'd sit for a much, much longer time. my mind would get more filled with many more garbage images. 

Even a magazine was much better than internet p. Number of pics are limited so eventually get bored and try to finish. 

The way I understand it is like DoingTeshuva so aptly touched upon.

The foundation to all of these desires whether it's porn, images, ogling women in the street, fantasizing, masturbation, arousal of any kind etc. is lust. Lusting is what triggers all of these outcomes.

All of the ways a person acts out are all symptoms of the primary problem. Lusting. If a person addresses solely the symptoms he will remain in a constant uphill battle his whole life.

He can say, I'll work on porn for a year, or masturbation, and move on, but in my experience it is shortsighted. As long as one indulges in any of these areas he is trying to quench his thirst for lust. As long as his lust is being fed and teased it will remain alive and kicking, and will beg for satisfaction in all areas.

I'm not saying it's not possible to be porn free and still masturbate or vice versa, but the root of the problem is still there and will make it more difficult in all areas.

I found that when I tried to work in specific areas only it was practically impossible. When faced with triggers in the areas I "allowed" myself in would inevitably eventually crumble in the face of temptation.

I was a movie adict who would never dream of living without my beloved actors and producers of "harmless" movies, but after stopping because it was out of control I realized like the GYE handbook says, that a huge portion of my excessive constant lusting was triggered by short intimate scenes or an immodestly dressed actor. I didn't even begin to understand the impact it had on totally "irrelevant" other areas of sexual desire.

So what I'm saying is, in my opinion/ experience, going cold turkey in all areas is technically easier than constantly stimulating and inciting your desire and trying to keep it in check.

So to answer your question. You have a lust problem. It manifests itself in many areas including porn and masturbation, but at the same time each symptom i.e. p & m, create a desire for the other porning begs for masturbation and masturbation asks for pornography.

Basically they are independent yet connected at the same time. So each one must be worked on individually, but the effects they have on the other cannot be ignored. 

Hatzlacha!

                                  Grant