A show of support for GYE makes sense to me. I can't give much right now, but I should give something. guardyoureyes.com/index.php?amount=&option=com_jdonation

Hi I'm a sexaholic. I spent a lot of time figuring out whether or not I am an alcoholic. Once I learned that there was such a thing as a sexaholic, I knew I was one. It was a relief for me to put a name to my condition and to realize that I am in fact not unique. Along with a name to my condition came a solution and a community. I think that in addition to my sexaholism I have a compulsive disorder which feeds into and makes the addiction even worse. I am also diagnosed ADD which causes disorganization, procrastination and indecision among other things which in turn causes unmanageability and stress. The unmanageability and stress also feeds into my sex addiction. So when SA people say "We saw that our problem was threefold: physical, emotional,
and spiritual. Healing had to come about in all three." SA Whitebook, I was right there with them and I just had to add psychological .

wow I'm tired. Thanks for listening/reading.

There has been some discussion lately about the definition of an addict. I think the main thing is that we find what works for us. The only way to find out what works is by doing. That includes taking suggestions and doing things that we may not think will work. Those suggestions should come from people that are sober. They be suggestions that people have implemented in their life and that work. As Polar Bear writes, his goal is to find the cure. Debating what works and what doesn't work, isn't going to get us anywhere. The things that work for many of us often defy our own logic. I may for example disagree with or not understand a suggestion given by Dov or Skep. I may even argue about it with them. Still, I do try to take and implement those suggestions, whether they make sense to me or not. I do that because they are coming from people with a lot of sobriety and they worked for them. That is my we share our experience, strength and hope with others. It isn't to boast about our accomplishments or to tell an entertaining story, it is to give people suggestions of what may work for them in the hope that they will actually take the suggestion and give it a go.

As for the definition of an addict, please read the first 4 chapters of the AA Big Book. It's legally available for free online. It's all summed up in this line: -"If, when you honestly want to, you find you cannot quit entirely, or if when drinking (or lusting), you have little control over the amount you take, you are probably alcoholic (or sexaholic)." AA Big Book P. 45. Parenthesis added.

I have to go to work now, but I have an example relating to eating treif, which most of us have no desire to or if we do it's easily overcome. Even us compulsive eaters, don't go for the treif, why not? Is it that we aren't treif addicts? Is that we are perfect in our avodas Hashem? Is it that we just don't take that first bite? Is it that treif is appalling to us, because we were taught that? Is it because we just never consider eating it and don't even think about it? Is it because it's something out in the open and honest? Something that we agree publicly not to do? And we all support a kosher life style? What if there were stores all over, that said "thinking about lusting, stop in here for some fellowship and understanding? What about the guy who took that taste and now he can't do without it? Or he slips and eats something treif once a wee or once a month? How about the guy who holds of cholov yisroel, but once a week he caves in and has that Baskin Robbins ice cream and regrets is after every time. Is he an addict?

I dont like debatin' for the sake of debatin', but two points please:

1. I'm not sure if you should do soemthin' just because someone your senior said it, especially when you don't agree. it might have worked for him. perhaps you should consider it and mull it over. Even with what has been written about goin' out of comfort zone to recover, but it's gotta be for a reason, and somethin' at least you feel might work or have a chance, or whatever.

2. regardin' your mashal....Una always asks me: if i'd be standin with my wife and a nice-lookin' woman dressed the way i like would be walkin' by, would i take that second and third look? Most would answer, "No," yet, many of us are addicts. There is an explanation.

b'hatzlachah

1. Makes sense, thank you. I'm more referring to someone who has a quality of sobriety that I like. There are just some things that I wouldn't think of on my own and that don't necessarily make sense to me. If it's coming from a person who I think has good sobriety, what's the harm is taking the suggestion? The one thing I know for sure is that my way wasn't working.

2. There was a time that I would take the second and even third look. My wife used to call me out on it all the time. I don't think that makes me anymore or less of an addict though. Many alcoholics successfully hide their drinking and refrain at parties etc. This is part of the self-protection, hiding, deceit and double life, isn't it?

I'm not sure what you're referring to "There is an explanation."

I went to an SA meeting tonight and found it to be very helpful. There were several frum people there with decent amounts of sobriety. One guy celebrated 4 years. The honesty and humility of these people was really wonderful to see. The mutual respect they were giving to and receiving from other people of varying religions, races and nationalities was heart warming. In that room we were just people trying to get recovery. There was no elitism or condescending attitudes.

The topic of the meeting was rigorous honesty. Part of rigorous honesty is not sugar coating the way in which we act out. Dov discussed that idea on his call today as well. Obviously everything in right place and circumstance and to the appropriate person. Is my problem that I was motzei zera livatalah? Or is my problem that I chronically and compulsively masturbate, fantasize and lead a double life etc? For many here I'm sure the problem is an occasional falling to temptation, but for others it is way beyond that. Am I holding myself out to be something I'm not, is that my problem?

Personally, I sugarcoat the ways I act out every time I state them. Not that they aren't bad enough even sugar coated. But to label the way I act out instead of describing the behavior is not being honest. This isn't the place to do it, but I did describe it at the meeting. I had to force myself to say each shameful word. That in turn forced me to look at the behavior for what it is.

On another note, I had basically come to the conclusion that I am a dishonest person. I always considered myself to be an honest person, but my actions dictated otherwise. The fact is that I behave dishonestly, so I must be a dishonest person. What I realized tonight is that what I really am is a fearful person with a poor self image and the constant need for validation. My fear or lack thereof was dictating my honesty or dishonesty. All things being equal I'd rather be honest, but fear would cause me to behave dishonestly.

Thanks for listening.

Hatzlacha!

serenity wrote:


1) to state that even on a forum shows a level of courage
2) even as a fearful person you've accomplished a significant degree of personal success(on multi-fronts)and been an inspiration to others
3) One can only imagine the degree of accomplishment you will have when you tackle your fear
The fundamental question: If you are fearful - and you have said before on the forum that you are fearful of sobriety itself - what are planning to do to tackle your real underlying issue - which is FEAR?
(By the way - are we not all to some degree fearful? who doesn't have insecurities?)

Thanks for the share

serenity wrote:


Wow. This is another post that should be linked in a signature. Or put on the emails.
Serenity thank you so so much for that share.
I'm tempted to take issue with your assertion that you're dishonest. I'm not sure acting out and covering it up is because you're dishonest.
But I wouldn't want to take away what you sense about yourself. And maybe the truth is that you have just stripped away some of the layers that we clothe ourselves with - but fortunate are you for having doing it in this world rather than the pain of it in the next world. And I suppose the 12 steps is all about that honesty that when we stand before Gd there are no surprises, we know who we are. You must feel wonderful having made and faced these realisations.
Thanks for what you said about holding yourself out to be you're someone you're not. And about being a fearful person with a poor self image.
Every word is just so beautiful, the warm smoothness of rich butter that I I just had to roll it on my tongue and say it again.
I feel that with your honesty you are smoothing the path for us. I have so much to copy from this. And I'm pretty sure every bit could be repeated for my circumstances. Plus a bunch more of course.
Thank you again so much.

Thanks for your kind words. Just to clarify, I meant to say, my conclusion that I'm a dishonest person was probably not correct. What may be more accurate is that I'm a fearful person. In the face of fear, I would act dishonestly. Fear of economic insecurity, fear of failure, fear of confrontation, fear of people, fear of inadequacy as a person, husband father etc etc would cause me the act dishonestly.

serenity

There is a fine line between fear, and common sense. Someone who acts with courage, could also be called a fool. It depends on what the fear or courage is based on. Fear of getting caught, I do not believe is a foolish fear. We all know what the results are. Although many here will say that their being caught was the beginning of their recovery, still and all I believe that it doesn't make a person an especially fearful person. Fear of economic insecurity is also not an unreasonable fear. Just like the other things. True, living a life with serenity ( ) and full trust in Hashem, will mean not having any of these fears, I still don't think having them labels a person as a "fearful person"
then again, what do I know.

I don't know what "having them" labels someone a fearful person, I'm only speaking about myself.

me too. (sorry, I'm a little confused on your response)

Me too