When I say I have peaked...I mean I am not growing...the exchange on this forum for the first several weeks has been eye opening for me. It made me really think through what I have done, why I am (was) doing it, and how can I stop it. I am just not sure what I should do next...I have spend a bit of time on the site clicking around to try and pick up pieces that will help me stay clean and out of woman troubles. Perhaps the site is overwhelming and not clear what my next move is.

More importantly am I an addict and should I start on the 12 steps or am I just a normal guy with normal desires....that I have to control as they are serious sins? In the back of my mind I have always known they are serious sins...so why haven't I been able to stop in the past? Does that lead me to the conclusion that I am an addict?

Sorry if I used the wrong term "sponsor"...I do think I need to speak with someone to work this out with. As I mentioned in previous posts...I think I come from a bit of a different back ground than most on this site...my friends would think I am nuts for discussing stopping MB...they think it is normal. I don't have that "Rebbe" relationship...and my rabbi is just not the guy...

Day 9...still feel pretty strong...just directionless.

maybe join a phone conference or call someone from the forum. You could PM back and forth first.

Do you get PMs nachshon?

Got it and responded...thank you.

Day 13 B second solid streak...had a 14 and now on 13...I know others don't like to count...for me is helpful to keep motivated not to fall

I do need to correct something...a few weeks ago Dov asked have I had enough pain...I responded with the pain was always tolerable (something like that)...boy was I wrong...since I posted that (have to go back and delete)...its been one whack after the next. When thinking through this a bit more...perhaps I just forgot the pain....so in case god reads these message boards...I take back what I said about the pain...I get the message. What is odd is that the whacks have kept coming even though I am on a solid streak. I know childish...but I always feel when I am on a solid streak things are on the upswing...

This streak is a bit different than first one...less desire to slip...last one was playing around the edges. I did have one detour...but pulled out of it before too late.

On practical steps...reached out to join a group and for a sponsor...

Have to stay at this....

Hi Nachshon,

I think Dov means the pain that comes from acting out directly or indirectly. Not general pain in your life that you attribute to G-d punishing you or something.

Does it affect your work, friends, relationships, always feeling out of control, feeling generally crummy about yourself?

How would your life be different if you were not acting out (or even battling with the urges to act out)?

Is acting out something you can live with, or does it make your life unmanagable (or at least very uncomfortable)?

Been crazy busy at work sorry for not posting (I hope others are gaining from this dialogue as well).

I always thought Dov meant have you had enough pain meant have you had enough god punishing you for these sins? Do others feel that something bad happens to them with 24 hours of an episode? Is that a childish view of how god works Din and Chesbon?

My life never felt out of control or crummy as you put it....I was/have the ability to segment these very different parts of who I am. Yes there are times I feel awful about what I have done...usually those are when being with other people...not necessarily the PN. A sense of depression and thinking I am so much better than this...why keep going back here if I know this is wrong and I know how I will feel right after it is done. I try not to get sucked into the depressive feelings and for the most part am successful.

I did hit day 15B before falling (twice)...it was obvious what the trigger was...kept getting phone calls from old friend...ignored...text messages about how important it is we speak...I did...not sure if true but told me what trouble she was in...and some of the things she did...started me down a slippery slope that ended with 2 falls...on the positive...I didn't see her despite her pleas.

SO I pick myself up again (on the one hand feel like a never ending battle...which makes me feel sad)...on the other hand...had 2 2 week streaks....which may not sound like a lot to you....but is for me. Also, the second streak was easier than the first so that is positive.

I did reach out for a sponsor that I think can be a good fit for me...that really scares me to have to "face" someone for the first time and admit all I have done. I am trying to prepare myself to have my self image shattered.

Day 2C...I pray I beat this before I hit Z....that would be really sad if I couldn't.

A battle weary soul marches on....

Haven't posted in a while...not sure why. Partially because been so busy....and part of me just feels the futility of this battle. Don't get me wrong....I think so important....but it seems like 2 steps forward followed by 2 backwards.

Had a major fall last week...wish I could blame on someone else...to be honest I initiated it with friend....she was only too happy to oblige. I had been getting better...and had been avoiding...cant even explain why I did. Afterwards same feelings of guilt and shame...swore her off (again)...had a heart to heart saying how bad it is for both of us. She shakes her head in agreement but wanted to know if we could see each other the next day. Hope I can just be stronger! Been a solid few days...so that is positive.


Had a phone meeting set up with my sponsor (first one)...was super awkward...I didn't realize I was dialing him....my staff gives me a list of calls I need to make....I had them put him on there....didn't realize I was calling him. He was on the other line...as I introduced myself with my full name...thinking he was a patient whose name I didn't recognize.

Not sure what else to do...I did PM sponsor again to try and set something up....

A skeptical soul marches on....

Hi Nachshon!

One important thing we sometimes need to remember to do: BREATHE!

Falling is not failing.

The important thing is what we do after the fall. Do we dust ourselves off and continue heading where we were going, or do we sit on the hard, cold sidewalk crying?

Get up and keep moving!

Hatzlacha!

See the posuk in Yirmiyah 8:4

כה אמר ה': היפלו ולא יקומו - אם ישוב ולא ישוב

Hashem complains about the Yidden. Why is it that they fall and don't get up? Do they think that if they return to me I will not return to them?

Hashem is infinite and so is His compassion and patience. The YH tries to fool us into thinking otherwise. Let's not "fall" for it.

Hatzlacha

MT

As others have emphasized-falling is not failing. You have mentioned that you have a wife and kids, and are regarded as an Adam Chashuv. If that is so, think of Rashi's comment when Yosef was confronted by Potifar's wife. Think of your zcusim-a great wife, kids, etc-=why would you throw it all away for a cheap substitute?

You wrote in part:

"old GF...that is available to me at any time...is a sick relationship...never accepted that I got married"

How come you don't just delete this person from any contact list on any of your devices, and ignore and delete her past from your life as simply something that wasn't "shayach" and remains that way?

SIB101854 wrote:


It's funny how I understand Nachshon very well. There is something in me that doesn't listen to logic. It doesn't care for simple consenquences. It doesn't let me "just ignore" lust. If there is an oppotunity to lust, that part of me will never just look away!

Nachshon wrote:


What are you fighting for? What is your goal? Is it to stay sober no matter what, or is it to stop having desires?

Dude, don't give up, stick around, keep on posting, many others have prooven that there is a way out!!! You deserve it, you're worth it!!!

I haven't posted in a while...since I hit a bad streak. Work has gotten insane....a tremendous amount of pressure....and lately I use this as an escape. I literally shut my mind off and either speak with friend or P@^N

I appreciate the advice others have left for me especially recently...its just not logical...I wish it were and I could make a rational decision saying this is nuts....I have so much good in my life why is it that I cant walk away from this horrible sin. It sounds so easy when you do a SWOT analysis. All arrows point towards just cutting this from my life...and yet I cant...or wont.

Regarding friend not so easy to just cut out of my life...long history...I have tried going very long stretches without speaking with her...and plead my heart out how wrong/bad this is for both of us. But I assume no different than most flipping on their computer...I can just make a phone call and can fulfill that way. Perhaps a part of me doesn't want to let that go...no different than someone not wanting to really put a lock down filter....hidden bottles as Dov once mentioned.

I am a bit down as I feel like I made progress to the point of finding a sponsor...I actually called once accidently....and then I just let the boulder roll back down hill....

Regarding pain....Not sure that I feel what you mention....I can live a productive life while partaking in this...to me the pain is when god send a wake up call in the form of some punishment that you cant have your cake and eat it too...do others get that same message?

Regarding internal pain I have this ability to literally shut my mind to the horrible things I have done....and move forward with davening and learning and community projects. Does that make me worse? that I can just wipe away from my mind what I have done?

Just rambling now....sorry...past my counting days....so desperately want to beat this....just don't have the tools.

Nachshhon wrote in part:


"Regarding friend not so easy to just cut out of my life...long history"

Let me share the following story. Before I met my EshesChayil,while I was in college I was involved with a young woman on a fairly serious level.I would call it a nice spring and summer relationship. She dumped me when I was senior in college and I heard from her once after her quick on the rebound husband dumped her and then about 30+ years later last fall. Last winter, this person called me. I informed my wife that she called me, my wife granted me permission , and I called her back and let her ramble for about 45 minutes as a means of closure and telling me why we were not "shayech." She told me that she had gone thru two other bad relationships, and a lot of therapy and after she hung up, I realized with a huge sigh of relief, that her need for closure was far greater than mine, which was nonexistent, and that my family, children and eineklach and friends were my main sources of happiness, which enabled me to survive a rough boss. Perhaps, you should seek guidance from a mental health professional about to get to closure with this person whose presence is obviously preventing you from oobtaining any Menuchas HaNefesh.