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TOPIC: The ability to admit I have sinned! 9830 Views

The ability to admit I have sinned! 17 Apr 2018 20:02 #329901

ieeyc
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Part I
I heard from a certain Mashgiach Shlita,in the name of Rav Hutner ZTL,from the long list of al cheits the first one is AL CHEIT SHECHATANU LIFANECHA ,BI`O`NES UBIRATZON -ON THE SIN THAT WE SINNED BEFORE YOU UNDER COERSION, AND WILLINGLY. Its understandable to being sorry for sinning willingly, but what does it mean we are sorry for sinning under coersion , its an o`nes ,we were forced ,so why do we have to do Teshuva on such an aveira?
The answer is ,said Rav Hutner ZTL, we convinced ourselves that WE HAD TO DO IT ,WE HAD NO CHOICE, WE COULDNT HELP OURSELVES.we are/were coerced, o`nes.(until here is Rav Hutner ZTL)

Comes along the vidui and says NO, were admitting that we sinned, but not a sin that consists of an action,but we are admitting that we sinned with a mental attitude by claiming o`nes,by claiming we have no bechira in the matter.
With vidui we are not going to wiggle out of taking responsibility for our actions and going ahead and conviently blame our upbringing,and other things that people usualy blame and excuse themselves,true Hashem may and most probably will look at us with more Mercy and Rachmanes ,the orphaned generation that we are, but after all is said and done we acknowledge we have sinned,we have CHOSEN,maybe in this gilgul, maybe in another gilgul,but we have chosen.

DISCLAIMER:this post is 100% NOT reffering to cases of child abuse ,molestation etc.etc.thats a whole different parsha/story,but im reffering to people like me who have been shirking responsibility through self pity :
"Oy,i grew up with a tv with terrible things.

Oy, we had newspapers in the house .

Oy, during recess time some kid ran past me and my friends flashing a picture from a dirty magazine that he found.

Oy,in the bungalow colony they showed a movie for the families with an x rated scene,some tzadekis covered the movie projector with something ,but i and others got an eyefull, i was just a kid!

but no, with all this , i chose mb, i may not have known what was going to happen , but i know it was something not nice,i may have had a harder time than some sheltered kid, but after everything is said and done,CHATASI, and this cheit snowballed into a good number of years before i had my 11 year clean streak,but i and we have to man up and admit ,we werent coerced/o`nes into any sin, if we sinned we take the blame ,and we ask Hashem for forgiveness,and we are mekabel never to make this mistake again,hopefully forever ,but at least for TODAY.
(to be continued ...be`ezras Hashem)

לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח נכון חדש בקרבי

to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring
. humility ,i humbly thank you

Last Edit: 17 Apr 2018 23:36 by ieeyc.

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 18 Apr 2018 01:00 #329910

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Part II
After Noson Hanavi confronted Dovid Hamelech with the cheit that he commited with Bas Sheva , Dovid Hamelech said ,"Chatasi" but before the word chatasi, there is a space left on the klaf .I was told that the space comes to teach us that before Dovid Hamelech said chatasi, he was fighting with himself mentaly thinking how it really wasnt a cheit,hes really innocent etc...,as a matter of fact ,the Gemara says that whoever says Dovid Hamelech has sinned with Bas Sheva , is mistaken! she was divorced technicaly ,etc. But Dovid Hamelech was thinking there must been something wrong in the eyes of Hashem ,and then said CHATASI! and he was zoche to great things because of this.

To take the responsibility for wrong doing and not looking for excuses...

I heard in a shmooze from Rabbi Brevda ZTL,that when Hashem confronted Adom Harishon on eating from the eitz hada`as if Adom would have taken the responsibility and said ,"Yes, Ribono shel Olam, Chatasi, I ate from the tree that you have forbidden"we would be still in Gan eden until this very day, .What did Adom say?"Ha`isha! "the woman that you gave me, gave me from the fruit.Was he admitting that he ate?Yes. but he shifted the blame off himself.

To take the responsibility for wrong doing and not looking for excuses...
(bezras Hashem,to be continued...)

לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח נכון חדש בקרבי

to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring
. humility ,i humbly thank you

Last Edit: 18 Apr 2018 13:02 by ieeyc.

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 18 Apr 2018 15:46 #329929

ieeyc
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Part III
We have promised ourselves that we will not act on lust again many times,but we keep on finding ourselves falling again and again,maybe the following idea will be a little bit of a gamechanger,bezras Hashem:

The Vilna Goan ztl on sefer Mishlei asks:
there are certain aveiros that have no physical pleasure to them ,but nevertheless people could do them for long stretches of time,one of those aveiros is speaking needless talk,devarim batalim.

The question why is this so,there is no physical pleasure, and its a big time waster?

The Torah says "Vidibarta Bahm"-you should talk in THEM (words of Torah),and the Gemara dar`shens,You should talk in THEM ,and not bidivarim acheyrim,not other things ,which are unnecessary,devarim betaylim.

Warning: Spoiler!

So we see from this Pasuk/ Gemara that devarim bitaylim is an aveira,and says the goan, when a person does an aveira he creates a malach/ruach/spirit which pushes him to do the aveira again and doesnt stop until he does it , and thats the secret of aveira goreres aveira-a sin brings (pulls)with it another sin,therefore its true that devarim bitaylem has no physical pleasure but the spirit that he created is pushing him to do it again.

Now thats by an aveira which has no physical pleasure, what should we say on an aveira that does have a pleasure like lust ?

so now we have a problem ,we have created a spirit thats pushing us to do more aveiros ,EVEN THOUGH AFTER THE AVEIRA WE SAID IN OUR MIND NEVER AGAIN,and soon after that we can find ourselves doing it again ,what are we to do?

BH, there is a solution! and that is the power of saying a heartfelt vidui-chatasi(taking the responsibility for your cheit and not shifting the blame on anyone else),when a person says chatasi, HE BREAKS THAT RUACH! (Rav Shlomo Brevda ZTL) and after the ruach is broken, he may still have urges to act out ,but he has broken that shtup/push

Warning: Spoiler!

we learnt from gye that besides the ruach,there is also the addiction which is pushing us to do it again,and the 90 days is supposed to help us with that, but doing 90 days without taking care of the ruach might be the reason why many of us keep on falling before we reach 90 AND even after we hit 90 we still have not taken care of the ruach and find ourselves falling.

this idea from the Vilna Goan ZTL might be the answer to our problems,hatzlacha!

bezras Hashem,t.b.c.,sorry,

Warning: Spoiler!

לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח נכון חדש בקרבי

to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring
. humility ,i humbly thank you

Last Edit: 18 Apr 2018 15:48 by ieeyc.

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 18 Apr 2018 17:08 #329931

Markz
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In happy if it works for you long term

Before gye when I was in in low lust mode (acting out once every 2-3 weeks) confession only exacerbated my problem. It gives a feeling of freedom from responsibility because 'Hey I said sorry about killing 4 hours", and now I feel good.

For me, quitting a Teshuva cycle can help focus on where my problem truly lies

Before I have a good 100 day streak again and can "admit I have sinned!" as this thread Title, I'm working on "The ability to admit I have a problem!" and as I told LK in text this morning, having a therapist by my side can help ;-)

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Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 18 Apr 2018 19:01 #329945

ieeyc
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hey, i have no problem with that, i was just following the title of the thread :

The Torah & Chizuk ApproachA Board for Yidden who are not as addicted, and for whom Torah/Chizuk/Chassidus can still help them stop.

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Last Post: Re: The ability to admit I hav ...by Markz 18 Apr 2018 05:08

and i was just quoting a GOAN,
although i dont know if a theripist ,if hes not frum, will say anything about a ruach urging more sins,if anything, he will tell such a person who believes in that ,"you need to see a theripist (quick)!"
anyway hatzlacha with whatever works for everybody!
(i dont know why this box came out so big)

לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח נכון חדש בקרבי

to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring
. humility ,i humbly thank you

Last Edit: 18 Apr 2018 19:05 by ieeyc.

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 18 Apr 2018 23:26 #329955

ieeyc
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Markz wrote on 18 Apr 2018 17:08:

Im happy if it works for you long term

Before gye when I was in in low lust mode (acting out once every 2-3 weeks) confession only exacerbated my problem. It gives a feeling of freedom from responsibility because 'Hey I said sorry about killing 4 hours", and now I feel good

thanks for the feed back,again hatzlacha for whatever works for you,
1.but maybe the focus should be on killing your seed,

2.maybe it works better once every day , and not just one time,i know that works for me,maybe you did do that ,but didnt mention it in your post

3.as i said in one of the "spoilers"-"2.sorry, but maybe you didnt say it as heartfelt as you should/could"

4.as for me, there are alot of things in yiddishkiet that made me feel good ,saying tehillim, learning a good learning ,davening a good Shacharis/Mincha/Ma`ariv, hearing a good shiur, did it exacerbate my problem?maybe ,but im not going to stop any of those things ,i will hold onto these things and at the same time try to let go of the lust ,and i will try to lighten my burden by destroying the ruach who is pushing together with my addiction to get me to act out,and THATS what the purpose of the post,adding to peoples awarness that its not only addiction which might be pushing them , but also this inyan of aveira goreres aveira which is caused by this man made ruach which departs after a sincere vidui, something that i was not aware of, and im sure others werent.
but hatzlacha in whatever works!

לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח נכון חדש בקרבי

to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring
. humility ,i humbly thank you

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 19 Apr 2018 01:04 #329961

Markz
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I'm not sure what your definition of "working" is... regardless...

Ok back to the thread topic, so this is what I wrote about ruchos - don't ask me to explain the mechanics, but apparently it's a powerful force, that gets Fall energy from confessions and the like

Markz wrote on 03 Jan 2016 14:12:

The following I'm quoting because it resonates with me in my life - I'm not saying it applies to anyone else at all

R Yonasan Eibeshetz wrote:

בפיוט אדיר איום ונורא וכו' צאנך מיד גוזזים

הרצון שלפעמים אנו רואים אדם רשע שחוזר בתשובה יושב בצום ובכי מתפלש בעפר וכהנה דברים טובים וכאשר יעברו ימים אחדים הנה הוא חוזר לסורו במעשים מקולקלים ונשכח ימי השבע מפני ימי הרעב

וסיבה לזה הוא כמו צאן שמבקשים לגוזו ובצמרו יעשו כל חפץ יתנו לו לאכול מלח וכדומה המגדל צמר למאוד וכאשר יגדל הצמר יגוזו וכן יעשו תמיד

וכן הס"א יונקים מן ישראל העובר שפעת קדושה אשר בו והוא להם למחיה ולכך סביב רשעים יתהלכון אך כאשר הם יונקים וכבר נפשו יבשה ואין לחלוחית קדושה עוד בה כי ה' סר מעליו ומעשיו רעים וחטאים מה הם עושים נותנים ללבו לשוב אל ה' ולעשות טוב עד אשר ידושן נפשו מטוב ה' כפי עבודתו במצות ה' ויהיה מלא טוב בברכת ה' ואז כאשר רואים ישמן ישורון ונפשו מלא טוב אז ימנעו אותו מלילך במצות ה' כפעם בפעם ויונקים ממנו כל שפעת קדושה ובעו"ה נותן חלקו לזרים וכוחו לנכרים

וזהו הבקשה הנ"ל שה' יציל אותנו ולכך אמר צאנך מיד גוזזים שלא יקרה לנו כנ"ל ולכך צריך גדרים ושמירות רבות הן במדות והן במעשים שבל ישוב לכסלה ח"ו אדרבה להוסיף אומץ בכל יום בתורה ומדע וביראה

דרוש א׳

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Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 19 Apr 2018 01:13 #329962

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Part IIII( or V?)
This coming monday /thursday/monday is going to be" b`hab" where there is a minhag to say selichos after shemone esrei,in some shuls ,where they have this minhag, the attendance is a little weaker because its a longer davening, and there is vidui.

I heard from a chosheva Mashgiach/Talmid Chacham ,people think they are running away from the long davening,a mistake,they are running away from saying chatasi...

To take the responsibility for wrong doing and not looking for excuses...
(be`ezras Hashem t.b.c.)

לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח נכון חדש בקרבי

to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring
. humility ,i humbly thank you

Last Edit: 19 Apr 2018 01:19 by ieeyc.

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 19 Apr 2018 02:08 #329968

ieeyc
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Markz wrote on 19 Apr 2018 01:04:

The following I'm quoting because it resonates with me in my life - I'm not saying it applies to anyone else at all

R Yonasan Eibeshetz wrote:

דרוש א׳

R`Yonasan Eibeshetz ZTL is writing that the sitra acher gets a rasha to sin and through that the s"a is allowed to hack into the kedusha account of the rasha, once the s"a gets the rasha to sin so much that there is no more kedusha in the account, what should the s"a do, he has a mortgage to pay! so the s"a gets the rasha to do teshuva learn torah do Mitzvos which causes the account to get filled up with more kedusha ,ah! now the s"a causes the rasha to do aveiros again which gives the s"a to go to town again and put it on the bill of the rasha's kedusha account,until the account gets dried up again ,then he allows him to do Teshuva,Torah etc...

what does Reb Yonasan ZTL suggest, stop doing Teshuva ,Torah and Mitzvos because your giving kedusha to the s"a ?! NO!!!hes saying put on better malwarebyte,so he cant hack your account anymore ,in his words THE RASHA SHOULD DAVEN TO HASHEM THAT HE DOESNT GO BACK TO HIS SINS ,
וזהו הבקשה הנ"ל שה' יציל אותנו "And this is the above mentioned request (tefila),that Hashem should save us "

and adds R` Yonasan ZTL,

ולכך צריך גדרים ושמירות רבות הן במדות והן במעשים שבל ישוב לכסלה ח"ו אדרבה להוסיף אומץ בכל יום בתורה

ומדע וביראה
"Therefore a man needs many fences and gaurds whether in midos whether in ma`asim,that he should not return to his fall c"v aderaba,he should increase his strength in Torah and (? )Mada and yirah (and vidui-a heartfelt one that is )

of course keep up with the Teshuva and Vidui ,Torah and Mitzvos , but dont let him hack you again by going back to the aveiros and for that he davens to Hashem to save him.
i dont think its a contaradiction to what i wrote ,im talking about something else.

sorry if i missed your point.

לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח נכון חדש בקרבי

to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring
. humility ,i humbly thank you

Last Edit: 19 Apr 2018 02:27 by ieeyc.

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 19 Apr 2018 03:37 #329977

ieeyc OFFLINE Banned Soaring to Har Sinai on the wings of an eagle! Posts: 572 Karma: -9	just one more added point, imagine after a 120 the Bais din shel ma`ala asks,' where are your torah and ma`asim tovim?"what will be the reaction if the person answers ,"i didnt do any, because i didnt want the s"a to have what to eat'
	*לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח* *נכון חדש בקרבי* to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring . humility ,i humbly thank you

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 19 Apr 2018 10:50 #329991

Markz
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ieeyc wrote on 19 Apr 2018 03:37:

just one more added point, imagine after a 120 the Bais din shel ma`ala asks,' where are your torah and ma`asim tovim?"what will be the reaction if the person answers ,"i didnt do any, because i didnt want the s"a to have what to eat'

No one said that...

Note: I believe "rasha" mentioned below can refer to 1 bad trait, even if on the whole the person is ok.

Now, R Yonasan's point is quite simple - there are those who are in a not good place and instead of taking recovery actions they are hyperfocused on the sin and it's repercussions

Until we are in a long term recovery road (100 days?) "Teshuva" should be shelved. As R' Yonah says quite clearly. יעזוב רשע דרכו ואיש און מחשבותיו, and only when he's had a good streak on the Trucking highway then וישוב אל השם...

Perhaps a true 'Non addict' that falls once every 3 months can live with "teshuva" alone. But I'm not sure what means 'Non addict', so let's leave that out of the equation. For the record I'm not an addict, rather a "Not-Non-Addict"

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Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 19 Apr 2018 12:02 #329999

trouble OFFLINE Platinum Boarder Posts: 874 Karma: 224	Saw this quote: Not sure if it's relevant to any of you, I know it was to me. "One of the most intense days of my life was when I started to realize that I was praying to my Shame and Guilt instead of to my God."
	i'm all about that (substantial) bass, no trouble .... if you're looking for trouble, you can email me @trouble69gye@outlook.com

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 19 Apr 2018 16:14 #330008

ieeyc
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Markz wrote on 19 Apr 2018 10:50:

ieeyc wrote on 19 Apr 2018 03:37:

Now, R Yonasan's point is quite simple - there are those who are in a not good place and instead of taking recovery actions they are hyperfocused on the sin and it's repercussions

sorry,but i dont see that in the words ,
R' Yonasan is saying that there are reshaim who do Teshuva gain Kedusha and then fall and the s"a is now allowed to nosh on that kedusha,
R'Yonasan ztl is saying "Rasha! dont be silly and fall again and give the s"a what to eat , be mechazek on your recovery ,and dont let him sink his teeth into your kedusha ,dont let up on your recovery .
thats what i see in his words,nothing about being hyperfocused on sin or its repercussions

לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח נכון חדש בקרבי

to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring
. humility ,i humbly thank you

Last Edit: 20 Apr 2018 21:11 by ieeyc.

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 19 Apr 2018 16:18 #330009

ieeyc OFFLINE Banned Soaring to Har Sinai on the wings of an eagle! Posts: 572 Karma: -9	Trouble wrote on 19 Apr 2018 12:02: Saw this quote: Not sure if it's relevant to any of you, I know it was to me. "One of the most intense days of my life was when I started to realize that I was praying to my Shame and Guilt instead of to my God." i hear you,thanks.
	*לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח* *נכון חדש בקרבי* to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring . humility ,i humbly thank you

Re: The ability to admit I have sinned! 20 Apr 2018 10:06 #330055

ieeyc
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Part 5
In the Yud Gimel Midos of Rachamim,which starts with Hashem,Hashem,etc. one of the Traits of Hakadosh Baruch Hu's Rachmonis is"Nosay Avon"-Hashem bears the sin,what does this mean?
Chazal say that when a person sins ,he creats a malach /accuser in shamayim,this accuser stands before Hashem and says,"I am peloni created by peloni,do justice/Din on the one who sinned and created me , AND DESTROY HIM!"now he doesnt say it just one time, and he doesnt say it in a whisper either,but constantly he is saying , and screaming it in a THUNDEROUS voice ,DO JUSTICE TO PLONI FOR SINNING AND CREATING ME!!!!
So Nosay avon -Hashem bears the sin -means that Hashem bears this constant screaming and demand for din, and gives the sinner Rachamim and time for the sinner to rectify his sin.
Its brought down that when a person says a sincire vidui-Chatasi,he closes the mouth of the malach that he created.So we see that besides the ruach that pushes him to sin again disapears after a sincire vidui,so too this accusing malach disapears .one of the benifits of the malach disapearing is that before it disapears ,when this Yid Davens ,Kaveyochel,Hashem cant hear him due to the thunderous screaming of the malach,once he does Teshuva with vidui, he silences this malach and his Tefila gets through to Hashem and answered.
To take the responsibility for wrong doing and not looking for excuses...
(bezras Hashem,to be continued...)

לב טהור ברא לי אלקים , ורוח נכון חדש בקרבי

to all my friends who heeded my request to be so generous and give me a negative karma for the sake of me acquiring
. humility ,i humbly thank you

Last Edit: 22 Apr 2018 18:08 by ieeyc.