In my journey I’ve suffered a lot from numbers and streaks! I wanna make a thread for it where everyone can share they’re bad experiences with it so we can create more awareness that it’s really not a method that works for everyone..
the first thing I wanna express is, it causes us to forget our whole original goal! It also strengthens the perfectionist way of thinking! Why don’t people count a streak for Lashon Hara? Or krias shema ? Our original goal to keep the Torah as a whole the best as possible is often forgotten. We’re often left off with obsession about something that has nothing to hang on. If someone would lust once a year he’s not in a worse of a state then someone who does another aveira to a similar severity once a year.. Yet, because our brains got so drenched in this idea streaks become a huge monster someone who falls even on day 25,000 he’s a bad person in a deep pit Meanwhile someone who never made krias shema and talks lashon hara all day but never ruined his porn streak he’s on a crazy high madrega!


This way of thinking can’t be further from the truth!
does anyone agree? Disagree?

I couldn’t agree more. Streaks are a great way to start to change your mindset. But I’m the end the goal is to be a good person, and perfect your character. Hashem doesn’t care much for the numbers. Who you are is what matters. What you accomplish is what matters. Although I do believe goals are very important. So if you are working towards a specific amount of days, that will keep you going. But numbers don’t mean much other than motivation. But gotta start somewhere. One day at a time.

SAM I love your passion! but just like passion, and everything else, counting streaks has benefits and problems. We need to learn to use the tools to grow, and not let our guard down about the issues. I can list some great benefits of counting days, but I dont know if this is the right thread since you based your thread for bad experiences.... 

Counting days should be a tool, not a moral compass.  Remember – no matter what your day count – YOU count!

Practically speaking, a person should count days if it helps them achieve their goals.

Counting helps when:

• It provides motivation for sticking to one’s plan.
• It gives a sense of achievement for achieving one’s goals.
• If a person decides to share their count, they enjoy social support and encouragement.
• The individual is counting out of excitement at beginning a new life, not fear of falling back into old patterns.

Counting hurts when:

• A slip becomes a full blown relapse because the person figures, “I’ve lost my time anyway, may as well go all out!”
• Fear of public humiliation deters a person from seeking help and support after a slip or relapse.
• A person bases their entire self-worth on the number of days on the sobriety calculator. Just as dietitians recommend against basing feelings of self-worth entirely on the number on the scale, some therapists warn against believing that more sobriety equals being a better person. 

I taught about it a lot before, and looked at it like DAF HAYOMI there is the streak, and there is someone who doesn’t have that streak, but his learning is on a higher level.

So is it with being clean, someone could be clean of fantasizing, and be good at home, but had a glitch once a year.

It’s like someone who can’t make siyum on shas but he learned a lot, why is it when we do reset that we are back to square one.

But there is something to see wow 200 days clean, and even more 364 days out of 365 days were clean.

I think the thing we need to be careful of is "hey i'm anyway i'm on day 0 so I might as well masturbate again" or "i'm just on 2 days so it's not such a bother for me to watch again."

Sapy wrote on 03 Apr 2022 19:16:

thanks! Please share here! I wanna try to get as much of a full well rounded approach! 

A few more thoughts : 
I was discussing it with someone and we came up with the following.. 
Each time we stay clean from lust (or specific part we’re working on) we get a very good smelling flower put into a room and each time we act on lust we get a bad smelling flower put in. Therefore if someone would have many clean days and a slip and then many clean days and a slip.. - the good smelling flowers would take over and the whole room will smell so nice and the bad smelling flowers will barely play a role it wouldn’t be noticed yet it would make a small difference… if however one has a few days clean then a fall a few days clean then a fall over and over. The room will smell quite bad! there wouldn’t be much good smell taking over… thats an example to someone who falls on a more consistent basis. The good flowers are still there! Yet they’re not noticed so much since the bad smell is more powerful cuz he’s been doing aveiros more frequently. The same would go for a guy who filled up his room with so many good flowers for years yet there was some bad smelling flowers very rarely throughout the journey.. the room would still smell so good! (Even with the break in the streak) no way it impacts on thousands of good smelling flowers! It’s a unique comparison but helped me understand the proper approach better. Additionally, it’s not only a spiritual thing with the good and bad smells rather This for example this also fits in line with the idea of retraining too when one falls into the same behavior he’s adding bad flowers. The more he adds the more smelly it’s becoming And the more he’s taking away the ability to smell the good smells (However one bad flower doesn’t ruin thousands of good smelling flowers! That’s the most important point!) However, regardless the good flowers Will always be there. This fits in line more properly because each flower is against each action and that’s what causes the good/bad smell. And that’s what counts after all.. -the action not the day.

firstly, i might say, based upon your analogy, the torah even instructs us to sin, so to speak: after all, one of the major ingredients to the ketores was the chelbonah about which we are told, it had an awful smell. still, the torah commands us to include it and when connected to the other ingredients in the ketores, the chelbonah would find its place and contribute to the sweet smell of the ketores in general. perhaps a fall every once in a while (or once a day) may even add spice to one's day.

secondly, i have a question for you (and to me): gye advocates for f2f programs, sa meetings, 90 days, mentors, etc.; you advocate for self-talk stuff and are anti streaks. ever think of creating your own site?

Trouble wrote on 05 Apr 2022 13:10:

Was just thinking the same!! Trouble, can you help me start up the new site? I just don’t have the time to start up a new website! And, a lot of the mentors also don’t like the streak idea so that’s why I love this site and I’ll stick around for now. In fact GYE didn’t mean for the streak idea to be used the way many use it here it’s a mere motivational tool. It’s not supposed to be a judgment as to where your holding or to feel back to square one cuz you need to start your number again. 

Trouble wrote on 05 Apr 2022 13:10:

Hey Trouble, maybe you could open up a new thread in the What Works for Me section with what has and hasn't worked for you. Or share a link to it if you already have done it. Or if you don't like that idea, I heard naaru.com is still available...

Captain wrote on 05 Apr 2022 23:16:

oh, so it's bonnie and clyde now; ok. you obviously have seen some of my posts. perhaps you should read this thread from its inception and see what it is i share - what i've tried and what i haven't, what has worked and what hasn't: guardyoureyes.com/forum/17-Balei-Battims-Forum/338902-Wife-Issues.

i'll tell you what - as soon as you find one post that sheds some light, quote it and add your comments and i will continue from there.

and when you insensitively tried to kick me out, you spelled nauru wrong, but don't you worry anonymous shmuezers don't stress me at all.

Trouble wrote on 06 Apr 2022 02:55:

Maybe you could quote some of it yourself for the benefit of everyone. Open a new thread in What Works for Me, and write what works for you. It's beneficial to have it summarized nicely separate from your entire story. I think a lot of people would gain from it. Also not everyone has access to the Baalei Batim forum. In all seriousness, perhaps this would be more helpful then just posting sarcastic or offensive posts on other people's threads.
P.S. Sorry for misspelling Nauru. Btw, which continent is it on again?

I benefit from everyone on this site. I don't believe there is a right or wrong way to do anything, and I am all for trying new things. 

If someone does decide to post about something in a way that it comes across as either guaranteed, either that it works, or that it doesn't, know that it will rub people the wrong way. Being that we are all products of our experiences, we all share different views based on what we have tried. There is no one way and anyone who posts a "Try it and you will see the difference" method, it just reeks of emptiness. If it works for you, say that, if you are trying something new, say that. 

Here are some of the things that come to mind. "Easy Peasy" (however it's spelled) was being promoted as the Messiah of porn addiction. If it would have been promoted here as an idea to try it may have been better received. the same goes for the "Self Talk" thread. Self talk is something that works, but not the way it was promoted in that thread. It's a tool, not a method. I am sure that is what the posters there meant, but it was promoted as "try it and you will see" to which I thought, "Okay, maybe you try it and let me know first".

My point is that threads like this one, or the other ones are perfectly fine but be prepared to defend your position. If you cannot defend your position and the only thing you do is challenge another contribution to this site, that speaks pretty poorly on what you are trying to promote. 

For your information, @Trouble has helped me a lot. Not just his whim, but I find his presence bringing a lot of empathy. From what I gather, he has been through it all, and know batter than anyone what works and what doesn't. You gotta have respect for someone who is here for that long, and still stays connected to the chevra here. I mean, you guys are a contradiction, you are booting someone for not being successful in a thread that is promoting not to judge yourself by your successes. Gosh!

 I don't think @Trouble needs my help, that is not my intention. I guess I just want you guys to stand up to the plate when you are being challenged.

wilnevergiveup wrote on 06 Apr 2022 11:10:

Wow, my second time today to one of your posts saying a rather simple thing:

Amen!!