No matter what's going on, acting out is never the answer.

72 days

As Dov is repeatedly saying we have to open up, yet we are all worried who might be reading our posts. I am certainly guilty of not opening up.

This week has been somewhat hard.

Firstly, we (meaning my wife and I) are making a wedding for one of our children in Kislev. Not our first but every wedding has its many pressures. However, when it’s one’s youngest daughter it’s much harder. My wife is literally freaking out at being left alone with no daughters in the house. By the way, my wife suffers with a very big depression issue. Meaning there are days she will stay in bed and do nothing. There are also other days when she is like superwomen and does everything.

Second one of my son’s has dropped out of Yeshiva and spends most his time doing nothing, or at least not productive, whether he really dovens is somewhat questionable. He has an iPod and at times a galaxy although the sim he uses has no internet access, but he can use Wi-Fi from neighbors. I live in a frum area and warned everyone to password protect their Wi-Fi. I zapped a one neighbors connection who didn’t listen, (they need a technician to reconnect, yes I’m an expert in these areas).

My son’s behavior added to the wedding tension sending my wife bananas. She’s continually depressed, angry, and thinks everyone is against her ………. She is very vindictive and unforgiving to our family, (meaning our kids and me, especially me).

To the outside world she is considered a special person doing a lots of chessed etc, most would never dream of how she behaviors at home.

Anyway, this is a very short overview of my family issues these days, Add to which I took my car in for its annual service and was hit with the biggest bill ever? That really set me back.

Today, on the way to work my wife called and racked me over the coals for not leaving her enough cash, (she does have a credit card). If you heard the way she speaks to me, you would thing I was some dumb dog. Then as Rav Arush would say maybe, I am a dumb dog!

Now with all this going on I have to stay clean, not look at women and control my thoughts.

As far as clean goes, I’m now in my 73rd day and 1135 clean days since joining GYE.

THANK YOU GYE guard, Dov and all you guys

Looking that’s another story, normally I’m quite good, but when I have a tough week I tend to loose it.

My thoughts have been much better.

Wishing everyone a clean and happy day

My name Reb Dov I love you but .................................

I wouldn't write my name and I also would not describe upcoming events etc. because your neighbor down the street can be on GYE and spot you. This is not a problem if you and he both see themselves as addicts, because then they wouldn't dream of using that knowledge against you, but on GYE this is not the case.

The chance of a neighbor even knowing about GYE is very remote, most charadim have no clue about GYE, add the fact I mix in a very Hebrew speaking environment and this forum is in English.

Even if someone is looking at these posts why would he look if he was not an addict himself? Or at least with some kind or issue?

In addition I think there should be GYE meetings, where we can meet and talk face to face. Could be there are SA meetings catering for this.

If I understand Reb Dov correctly, part of the process of getting well is opening up to our fellow addicts.

Think wrote on 24 Oct 2012 09:11:


Dear Think Good,

It breaks my heart to read what you're going through. You're a real tzaddik for hanging in there in spite of it all. You must be an einikel of Avraham Avinu, to be able to stand up aginst all those nisyonos. May Hashem repay you with gezunt, parnassah and nachas from your entire family, including yourself. May your upcoming simcha be a true and whole simcha, and may it be mashpia simcha and hatzlacha in all your endeavors. (BTW, when and where's the chasuna - maybe some of us will drop in - so we can have your GYE meeting

B'lev vanefesh,

MT

Think wrote on 24 Oct 2012 12:30:


Really, wow. I would think at least some of our neighbors are on GYE. It's a very common problem.




As an example, in SA many people stay for a few weeks and then disappear forever. They come to see if they are addicts. If they think they are not they leave. In GYE it's even more likely to happen.




GYE is a web site, so by definition it will never be in person (avatars, maybe?)

SA is available for in-person meetings.




Part of the 12-step process is to open up. There is no cosmic law that recovery requires addicts to open up, no. The critical things that an addict needs are to give up the belief that his worth has something to do with his choices, and that because he has always chosen to sin in the past he is doomed to never reliably stop. Meetings address both beliefs because when you open up and you say the worst that you have done and you watch people sit there and listen you tell yourself (correctly) that you are still worthwhile even having made these choices, and by seeing people stay sober you tell yourself that it's possible to say sober (but only with the help of others, which is incorrect.)

If you acknowledge these beliefs interaction with others is not required. However there is another price to be paid.

MT thanks for the support. Its not always like this, there are always ups and downs in life

Think wrote on 24 Oct 2012 12:30:


Personally, Think Good, I feel that nederman is right. Sharing personal details about family plans, simchas and stuff like that are to be done with care here on the forum. More people than you imaging may be reading this forum and as I have writeen here dozens of times already, only a minority or the GYE readers are actually addicts. Most just have a yetzer hora, a computer, and genitals. So naturally they get in some occasional trouble. So it stands to reason that many (possibly most) readers here are curious onlookers.

And yes, your use of people is a great idea. Opening up is the way, as Rav Elimelech zy"a and many others have written. But they were all referring to normal people (the yetzer hora people). For addicts it is even more important, and it is quite obvious why. Just ask Captain Kirk. (Do you know the post I am referring to?) He'll tell you all about it. For addicts, it is not the wasted sperm that is the problem - it is the lying to others and the culture of self-deception that ruins any chance of success. Staying in a corner with a our 'self-help thoughts and hard work' is still just isolating. People isolate for a reason. And it is a choice that I believe is usually suspect. Sure there is a place for hisbodedus - but Hashem clearly wants us to be a part of a tzibbur. And for me as an addict, pretending I am just like everybody else at shul...? That's just more loneliness in a crowd - more self-deception. Self-deception is a real jail - perhaps the only real jail. And Chaza"l told us ein chavush matir atzmo mibeis ha'asurim. It is what I always did even when I was regularly acting out! My Jewish heart tells me I aught to have a chevra somewhere who I can be truly open with. And I have that, b"H.

I spend a lot of time alone in quiet to think - people desperately need thinking time (as Mesilas Yeshorim writes about Par'oh)! But that is not 'living in isolation'.

And once I have progressive sobriety, my participation in shul etc, is suddenly real! Since I have been sober, I was finally able to know that I am part of regular Jewish society. Nobody could have convinced me of that before - cuz I wasn't! For today I know that tonight I will not be leaving after learning real well with the other guys in the shiur tonight - to find a hooker or a dirty book to masturbate to. That is a huge chidush in my life for the past 15 years. And I have not forgotten how bad it used to be and still could be - if I once again need to take the luxuries of lusting again c"v. That is how it works for me and others I know.

The idea of not writing your name, though? I think that is just fear...unless your name is something like Chuna-Feitel Jr. Then I fully understand.

And the point nederman made about not specifying life events on the forum is even more true regarding a person who writes their name on the forum. My name is Dov. It's what my wife and friends call me. So I don't write that "I am going on this or that trip tomorrow for a week," or that "my daughter had a son yesterday and the bris is next week," etc.

But personally, if I didn't write my name here, I'd be a lot more liberal with writing some personal possibly identifying details (if they had something to do with my recovery). For the risk of ID'd based solely on events that happen to everybody is basically just a silly fear...I think.

Enough spewing.

Guteh nacht Think Good!

Reflection doesn't just mean the one that you do by yourself. Reflection is also when I am in shul and I don't say hi to someone because I am telling myself that this person thinks I am not worthy (mind reading,) or because I am afraid that he won't say hi back (fortune telling,) etc. Another reflection which _is_ done by yourself is when I work through what might happen if the people in shul made fun of me because I didn't go to yeshiva and I figure out what I would answer (rational emotive imagery.) So reflection helps in all aspects of life. If you like the people in shul it can make you close to them. If you don't, then you can be happy by yourself.

The Mesillas Yesharim even says that introspection must occur at every moment as well as at a regularly appointed time of solitude. The reflection that happens at every moment can get you out of your shell and into shul, if that is what you desire.

That was nice, thanks. Really.

Later, amigo!

73 days

hisbodedus , Reflection , introspection!

Thank you Reb Dov and Nederman. Doing a lot of thinking right now! Need time to consider your replies.

By the way. I just took a quick count on of the 90 day chart, of 133 on the list, only 15 have a link and most do not post very often.
Where is everyone?

Think wrote on 25 Oct 2012 08:14:


I haven't been posting on my 90-day chart because I want to de-emphasize the counting-days behavior. A couple of weeks I thought I was going to leave GYE so I figured I'd better make sure I am not using the honor wall as my commitment (like when you go SA meetings and you want to tell them you are still sober,) so I finally wrote up my rational decision to stop (see link below.) That has been very motivating, so I stopped counting.

I am on the 90 day chart (down below in the small numbers) but I didn't post my thread since my thread isn't so active but I log on almost everyday and write on other people posts.

Also the reason is because the 90 day chart doesn't interest me so much the only reason I do it is because sometimes after being clean for a while I think I am in control and I start to waver with my GME (guarding my eyes) etc. So I keep my 90 day chart to keep me in check and keep on reminding myself that it wasn't so long I had a fall/crash.
I don't see 90 days as anything I see every day as a day and I would love it to be 90+ in one go but I don't see 90 as my goal.

Yitzchok

Think wrote on 25 Oct 2012 08:14:


Hi TG, hope it's Good Thinking

As far as the chart not everyone puts a link to their thread. And some of them may be posting on the Yiddish or Hebrew forums.

Neddy, TG was referring to people who keep their 90 day chart up to date but don't post on the forum.