Just saw this in today's chizuk email:

VNBDI: I need help

Dov: So do I. What's the deal, chaver?

VNBDI: I spent a lot of time on the internet, now I'm home and am going crazy obsessed. I can't imagine why the guy with that pretty wife I looked at before is not the luckiest guy in the world.

Dov: First of all, we pay a price for what we ingest. This is an important uncomfortable truth we all need to accept, eventually. There is no escape from paying some real (sometimes very heavy) price for feeding the addiction. Sometimes it is the scenes and images that we craved and replayed for pleasure, but are now stuck replaying them in our heads like mental vomit, even though we do not want them any more because they are getting in the way of what we really need to accomplish to function and be useful; sometimes the price is the hiding and lying that we carry home with us - it separates us from those around us and makes us also feel less than, too... Whatever it is, you are now stuck - at least for a while. They will eventually leach out of your brain and the shame and internal isolation will abate. But it hurts for a while.

Second, the obsession is part of the disease. I am just curious, in a friendly sort of way: do you accept that you are just like an alcoholic in this obsession thing? They obsess about getting drunk... do you feel the same?

VNBDI: Yes, by now I think I do accept it very much.

It's very, very painful, I can't imagine living any longer without that skinny women...

I think I have come to accept step one, realizing I am getting nowhere after all these years.

Is it bad that the only part of the fellowship I feel is really helping me is the reaching out to others for help? It always seems to weaken the obsession. Even now, what I thought a few minutes ago was inevitable acting out, it seems like I may manage just because I found the guts to IM you.

Dov: The reaching out to others for help is (I think) ALWAYS the ONLY part of the program that really "works", in the beginning. It takes time to develop any real integrity - integrity means the inner ability to have some accountability to YOURSELF. That self-accountability was worn down and pulverized every time we snuck away to watch porn and violate everything we know is wrong for us and destructive to our trust and relationships. So basically, our addictive behavior has been ripping out our inner integrity for years. It is time to have G-d restore it to us. To get it back, it takes one thing: Sharing with other real live people. So a phone group is good, a real person is better - in person, and hence the minhag of meetings for addicts, etc.

VNBDI: Well, I really appreciate your weakening my obsession tonight. I feel guilty using you without being able to return the favor.

Dov: When have you ever returned the favor to Hashem after using Him? I am in good company. Nobody can really 'return the favor', and giving is its own reward. Schar Mitzvah - mitvzah!

Thanks Guys!!

Chesky, no need to be sorry, as you see I'm not kidding myself here, I know what the stakes are.

The real issue at hand at the moment is what Dov wrote in the chat that you brought down, the pain of dealing with the consequences of my latest expeditions, easiest way out is to just go along with them, If I have a thought about a woman, then fantasize about it, enjoy the thought.

On the other hand, as I wrote, I am reaching out, in person, by phone, chats, and Dov writes that's the only way. I think it's been helping.

I guess there is only that link missing.......accepting that I will need to deal with the consequences......

So here it goes....

Chevra.....The mighty eagle is trying to take off, once again!!!

Don't know where I am holding exactly.

One thing I have noticed, realized, is that if I want to stop this, I need to give up lusting everywhere!! (I've probably written this before, but I'm feeling it again) That "everywhere" includes on the street (duh, that's a simple one), and with wife. Now that's where it gets tricky and I don't thin kthis needs to go in to the BB forum because it's just another manifestation of lusting.

I wrote this somewhere else, but I am realizing just how deep and just how thin the line is, yet there is a clear line. I do know when I am doing something, ANYTHING, for lust, and when I am doing it for her. That's where it gets all fuzzy, because I can be doing the same exact thing in two seperate situations, one of them will be an entirely giving action, and the other, a completely selfish lustfull action.

If I want to really get out of this mess I have to give up doing those actions at the times when they are lust times. I have to be able to do it when it's not lust, and not do it when it is lust!! (was that repetative?) I have to not do it even though my savvy sexaholic mind tells me that this action is not a negative one, as I did it yesterday lovingly, not with lust.

It's another step back, another step away from the ring, I can't get that close, it's too dangerous for me.

(btw, this is the first time that I'm on the computer, since last post, and I haven't used the loophole to go onto youtube )

Dear Pidaini

first of al congrads on not visiting youtube

As a follower of your thread I find it amazing (and comforting)that even you the big eagle also find yourself in tough moments.

it brought to mind what chazal tell us that when we say Krishma שמע ישראל there is a חיוב to say it out loud, השמע לאזנך מה שאתה מוצאי מפיך and the reason behind it is explained in seforim that there is this concept of האמנתי כי אדבר through saying it you will come to beleave it.

so the best advise I would give you will be GO BACK AND READ THE PRACTICAL POSTS PIDAINI WROTE and try to see what could work for you;) to help you pull up!

and in the same time say out loud LETS GO YAAKOV YOU COULD DO IT האמנתי כי אדבר!

looking forward to the coming posts

Pidaini wrote:


that's really gevaldig! but what could be even better?

Hi

altz beseder?

(I was in middle of posting last night and interenet explorer closed down)

Here's the story,

Sinday night, went to bed at around 11:30, couldn't fall asleep....12:30.....got out of bed to go watch Iron Man, but as I walked out, I thought to myself "you could say Tehillim now, it's a little more productive than watching Iron Man". So I sat down to say some Tehillim. All the while I was itching to finish and get to the movie, not only that, but I had decided that this time when the dating add popped up, I would enter the site.

I finished 20 chapters, and went to watch. At about 2 am I finished Iron Man and went to.....youtube! I saw things there that I wasn't expecting to see (youtube has really become bad) but even though I wasn't expecting it, I had still seen it. I went into bed trying to fall asleep again, Stan woke up, then my sister left at around 2:45, and since I couldn't fall asleep I decided that I would fall. I had enough of fighting, it was time to just get past this rut.

I started thinking about what I had written that the thing that helped me most recently was Talking to Hashem, so I gave it a try. What basically came out was amazing, I wasn't ready to believe that Hashem could take care of the obsession just like porn could!! I thought about that a little, and then got up to go fall.

I then remembered how some of my friends had expressed their disappointment in themselves that they didn't reach out before falling, so I went to gmail before going to ***tube. I emailed cordnoy "I'm doing terrible.......30 sec to fall". Since I was already on gmail, waiting for cordnoy to respond, I sent MendelZ an SMS to come onto chat. We started chatting, and right when we did, I knew that I wouldn't be falling that night. I didn't know how long that would last, but I knew that that night wouldn't be the BIG fall.

Since then I've started opening up more and stopped isolating as much. I still have not completely stopped watching movies, although it is taking up much less time.

I'm certainly not out of the pit yet, but I think I've gotten a grip (didn't I say that already in the past three weeks?!)

Have to run to shacharis, so that was the short version. Thanks everybody for being there!!

Love the reaching out! good work! KOT!!

I like the details.
Great stuff!



b'hatzlachah

cordnoy wrote:


Yup

dms1234 wrote:

gam ani mitztaref lehan"l

and a (25 minute) huzzah for cordnoy

sorry
he should text me next time

Hello everybody!

My Dear friend pidaini seems to have gone on a sabbatical, so I wanted to pm him a vort I once saw, then I said to myself maybe there are other people in the audience that could benefit from it why not post it, so here I am.

The possuk tells us והאיש משה עניו מאד מכל האדם אשר על פני האדמה And Moshe was very humble, moreso than any other person on Earth.
Rashi on the word עניו מאד explains שפל וסבלן,humble and tolerable.

So the Rebbe reb Bunim of Pishuscha asked what does savlonus- tolerance have to do with Anuvah - being humble?

so he answers as follows, many times we see people that when they are בענוה/שפלות - humble it causes them to loose self respect self tolerance and that could lead to loosing all positive aspects of that individual.

Moshe Rabeinu was a עניו ושפל - humble but that by itself is not enough he was also a סבלן tolerable meaning to say that he was able to TOLLERATE his SHIFLUS.

Many times I find that slipping causes regrets which causes a deeper slip which cause more regrets which cause a fall.

It is therefor maybe good to keep in mind that we are not perfect and be TOLLERABLE of our shortcomings as the above mentioned Rebbe once said we have two contradictory obligations 1 to say בשבילי נברא העולם - the entire world was created for me and the other ונפשי כעפר לכל תהי to be humble. so he said it all depends on the situation in what the person finds himself. If the YH is telling him how great he is then he should think אנכי עפר ואפר I am worthless, however when the Yh uses his anuvah as a tool to pull him down deeper then he must say בשבילי נברא העולם - the entire world was created to serve me.

Hoping this will be helpful to some.

Pidaini as soon as you return I will BLN step down;)

misgaber41 wrote:


Well then, I don't think I'll be back, it's a shame to loose your posts!!!

Pidaini wrote:


I think that was the biggest insight that I had from this past descent. Until now I had somewhat felt that I had it all figured out, I knew how to surrender fears and resentments, and how to let go of lust and let Hashem take it away, that was jsut to make it sound good, I really thought that I was doing something.

It hit me then that there was nothing I could do to get out of the obsession that I was in. There was only one of two ways, either to give in or that Hashem just make it go away. But I had to be ready to give it up, and when I went to gmail I guess I showed that that was indeed the case.

That gave me an entire new meaning, an entire new mindset of letting go-completely, just let Hashem!!

BH, I'm doing much better, and the difference now and between the last few times I've felt better is that I am back in contact with all the regulars......don't know how long it will last, but who cares?

ONE DAY AT A TIME!!!