Hi all

I'm calling myself lehavatyosef. Rashi to Breishis 30:25 will explain why.

I have a question which I'm hoping someone will have some input to share, that will be general enough that I won't need to get into all the details of my 'story'.

The question: what constitutes a fall on the 90 day challenge?

Some of the details: I first discovered pornographic material when I was 4 years old, when I was digging around my father's study and found a some postcards. I then found a video tape in his drawer when I was about 7. I was hooked from that moment although I didn't quite understand what was happening. It wasn't until I was 11 that I discovered masturbation and for the next 16 years I don't think a day past without an indulgence with my little secret. Even when I was sexually active with girlfriends, I still when home to my dear old friend. It became the only way I could fall asleep.
As part of my teshuva process, at around age 26, one day I took every magazine I had in the house and threw them out - what an exhilarating, freeing moment that was!!! - and I didn't use real porn again for almost 13 years. I fell hard a few times since then but have kept on fighting. GYE has been an amazing resource for me during that time. I've never returned to full masturbation but looked around enough shmutz for long enough till I had an accident.
Now here's the thing, during that 13 clean years, although I did not 'use' directly, I nonetheless did lust. Sometimes it was when I was on the street, sometimes it was when I was looking at a 'clean' magazine in the waiting-room of a dentist, sometimes it was just in my mind. Whilst it was not the hardcore stuff I was once into, I have to be honest to say I was lusting, really looking for the rush. About two weeks ago, frustrated with knowing that I wasn't as clean as I wanted to be, I decided to finally do the 90 day challenge. Our devices have filters and all was going well till the 6th night, and after a really stressful day and huge blow out with my wife and dumping on my kids, I escaped to my computer and looked at a wedding photographer's website. Practically speaking, there was nothing 'bad' to see. I didn't have an accident, in fact I didn't even get aroused and it didn't last for more than 5 minutes. 

However, I know that I was trying to escape the pain.

So tell me dear friends, brothers and experts - scarred warriors of worse battles than mine, what do I put on my chart? Did I fall or am I still clean?

Thank you

Hi, welcome!
That's a good question. I don't have a good answer but I'm curious to hear what others say.
If you want to know the "official" rules, look here under number 8: guardyoureyes.com/tools/90-day-chart/rules :



But I would imagine this is something you have to be honest with yourself about to determine what's what, in your situation.

wow, im so impressed by your post and lifes experience , you make me bend my head in shame when i selfpity myself  thinking about the things that i grew up with and saw,tv  newspapers, you are a real warrior! welcome. im sorry that i cant give you a definite  answer (i would say thats not a fall just a slip ), but im sure others would know what to say.hatzlacha in  reaching your goal!

Hello and Welcome to the forum.

you casually write , "I took every magazine I had in the house and threw them out - what an exhilarating, freeing moment that was!!! - and I didn't use real porn again for almost 13 years"
for many of us thats an unimaginable superhuman feat, so although you may still have to fully clean up and probably go to the root of the problem - youre past indicates that you will be able to accomplish that G-D willing.

all the best 

i-man wrote on 26 Feb 2018 04:07:

Yeah. 13 years man. Seriously, that’s quite the feat.
I wonder one thing though,
discovering your father’s porn at such a young age, that’s undoubtedly traumatic?
did you ever speak about that with someone?

and hey my personal opinion is to not kill yourself about the 90 day thing. I personally wouldn’t call looking at a wedding photographers website a fall. It seems like you caught yourself before anything escalated. Look at the big perspective. If anything I’d call getting mad at your wife and kids the fall.. cuz like you said yourself that’s where it started.
but something tells me that the way you did 13 years without using the 90 day program was a far healthier way of staying clean then the 90 day program could ever give you. So think about what was different during those 13 years, what’s changing now that’s bringing back up your old ways, Maybe you can make some changes to get back to Mr. 13 years?

Welcome!  I think you are putting too much emphasis on the 90 day challenge.  It is just a jump start.  It is NOT recovery.  It helps you realize that you can survive without acting out for a time.  But, if you do nothing else, you are not likely to achieve long-term sobriety.

My rule for "counting a fall" is simple.  If you count it as a fall, are you more likely to fall again, or are you more likely to see it as a challenge to start fresh and be more motivated?  Either way, this is not an answer, but only a temporary bandage.  It will not hold long.  Get to the hospital and get it stitched up properly.

Check out the handbook.  Try some of the suggestions.  If something is not working, try something else.  Usually, the things that are more difficult to do, produce more long-lasting results.

Haltzlacha!  Keep posting.