Hi everyone,
I joined on here to make me break this habit and these thoughts! I'm sorry if this too inapproriate. It was not on purpose- I had to write it down in a very general sense at least. The playback is fully playing through my head.

All the way back in the beginning of high school, though I was attracted to women, I became curious about men and their bodies . . . Later in high school my curiousity and lust got the best of me and I arranged to meet up with an older man I met on an online dating site.

For the last month and half I have decided that I am strong enough to fight this once and for all. However it seemed like every time I came to my friend . . . Finally two weeks ago we said that's it and we will not do anything anymore together or MZL. I hope I can make it through. Please help me. I never want another sequence like those that happened to me to ever happen again.

[Moderator's Note: Unnecessary details have been removed].

Shalom Achi,

In my humble opinion . . .

[u]Moderator's Note[/u]: Remainder of post is in violation of GYE forum rules and has been removed. Your account will be deleted if this happens again].

I want that kind of love to only be with my wife- whom I try so hard to do everything I can to make her happy. Sometimes I feel like any challenges we have in our marriage is because God is punishing me for not being honest with her and acting on attractions to men.
Thanks for the encouragement.

Welcome to Gye,

I really hope you can finally succeed in overcoming this. I dont have any personal experience with SSA but I do have experience with doing things I dont want to do

Coming to this forum is a terrific first step, it may or may not shock you to know that there are others here who have similar issues. They are overcoming it and im SURE you can to.

Step 1: Want to change- check
Step 2: Direct your "want to change" towards practical real and concrete actions to overcome this.

What are the situations that you fall in and what steps are you taking to avoid them? Being alone with your friend is NOT a good idea, and it should be avoided the same way you avoid yichud with a woman. Im not saying a psak, just practically speaking, dont set yourself up for failure.

Also about being honest with your wife, generally the wiser people on this forum say that opening up to your wife and close relatives without being in recovery for some time and talking it over with a friend who has experience, is not a good idea.

How to say it and what to say, what to NOT say is a delicate topic and being honest with your wife about it could cause more harm than good.

Hatlzlacha

Welcome Overcoming...

I have so much to say, and I am too overwhelmed to say it. Your struggle touches me deeply. All I can say is you are not alone, you have come to the right place, maybe the only place, where you will find the help and support that you need. Chazak VeEmatz!

Gevura!

When i see my friend am I allowed to say congratulations an give him a hug? Something really great happened to him? The problem that still keeps coming up is when I see a good licking guy I automatically gaze down to their belt area- front and back. And then if I like what I see I get a better look at their whole image. How do I stop doing this?

Listen I dont know exactly if you can give him a hug or not, that probably depends on if that will be a trigger for you and you alone know that. A second issue is maybe your afraid to hurt his feelings by not congratulating him and giving him a hug, maybe he'll be offended. But to that you have to realize that if your sick you have to stay away, your own health comes first. Ill give you a smaller example, Melava Malka in my house we like to pick up pizza here and there, and even though I'm probably the one that should go, kibud av vaem etc. I just dont want to go to the packed and crowded pizza store on a motzaei shabbat. So I would rather make up some excuse and be called lazy (lol maybe it really IS just laziness) than go and see things that are going to ruin things for me.

A guy who has a deadly contagious illness, no matter how good of a friend he is and no matter how big the simcha, you have to stay away.

You could maybe explain to him why you think its best if you avoid physical contact. you mentioned that both of you want to stop. so explain to him that from now on your going to make fences and not hug etc. A handshake IDK to see him and speak to him IDK B'ezrat Hashem one of the guys from the forum who has some more experience will be able to help you there. (and I mean experience as in theyre going/gone through the same thing as you, your not alone!)

Regarding the last point about looking, I think it makes no difference which gender your attracted to, watching your eyes is watching your eyes, and you need to start to do that. Pray to Hashem that he should help you watch your eyes, and read the Handbook it Has many many tools to help with this.

I wish you much continued Hatzlacha!

Overcomingnisayon wrote on 20 Jul 2012 11:02:


Where do I begin?
I guess by saying welcome, and yasher koach for opening up about this so honestly

My gut reaction is that you need to break up this friendship completely. If I had an affair with a woman, over and over again for years, and I had any hope of saving my marriage and my sanity, I can't expect to be friends with her and see her once in a while.

Same exact thing with you and your friend. I don't care what his gender is. You've fallen too many times with him. He's simply got to go. Any reason to maintain the relationship at any level is just your lust addict forcing you to hold onto your favorite source of drug. Forget teshuva gemura, forget hurting his feelings. Your sanity, your marriage, your children, your very life are at stake. Maybe after a few years of sobriety you can visit him WITH YOUR WIFE.

This isn't a psak. It's common (addict's) sense.



[interesting slip]

The only way you're going to be able to do this is by not looking at them in the first place.
My friend, we've all indulged in things we shouldn't have, and became addicted. We need extreme measures to dig ourselves out. Your first step out is to stop gazing at men. This will be very challenging considering which side of the mechitza you live on. But it's the only way.

OK?

Welcome overcomingnisayon!

Alex is 100% right. By your own words, you have clearly lost control. You cannot help your friend, and he cannot help you. You need to help yourself and let your friend help himself. You CANNOT help each other. The only way to "overcome nisayon" is to avoid it completely. Seforim say the main bechira a person has in this area is TO AVOID IT. Once you are in the situation it is MUCH more difficult if not impossible to overcome.

Stick around and learn from the people here. There is help and there is hope. Many people have overcome this, and so can you. BUT, you need new tactics.

a gitte woch, chevra.
huh, where is my post from before shabbes?
well, if it was never "published", so lets do it (and if it was deleted, so whoever did it for whatever reason can do it again, i guess.)



well. boduk umenusse, try the following thing:
be mekabel on yourself that each time you look, stare, even glimpse (2nd look) on this kind of things, you will close your eyes for an appropriate amount of time.
i tried with 5 sec. did not help much. now i am trying 10 sec. helps better. now i think twice before i look on a girl.

hatzlocho and a gitte woch.

Telling my friend that we cannot be friends or see each other ever is the hardest thing for me. I can't do it. Since he is moving I will barely see him can I just tell him that I'm really working on myself without telling him I cannot be his friend? I do see the problems with this because in the past when I would tell him about the hardship we would sometimes end up doing things together that we shouldn't. I think I want to not see him alone but I don't need to tell him.
Being on the same side of the mechitza makes everything soo much harder. What do I do if a really good looking guy sits right next to me in class or the beis midrash, how do I set up fences? He's right there in front of me! What can I do for this?

So, I have lusted at men as well at times, mainly I think because they were the only live people around, B"H. The moment I started applying any sort of lust gedarim, my lust after men dissapeared. Obviously, this has nothing to do with your situation.
My gut feeling was with Eliezer and Gibbor, as I was reading your story (and yes, it was a bit triggering, but I don't think you can help that. I'll only read it once). However, I can relate to your problem regarding breaking up. So, I would go with one of the other suggestions already made, and start keeping Hilchos Yichud with him. Tell him so, and tell him why, too. Maybe send him to GYE as well, that can't hurt.
The Gr"a says that a person may do anything to fix a midda or habit provided it falls within the boundaries of Halacha. He says this is even if others will think you are crazy. Kal Vachomer when this guy also wants to stop. But take whatever measures neccessary to stop being triggered.
Ignore anyone who says it is okay. Ignore anyone who says it can't be fixed- of course it may not be fixed, but that doesn't mean that all is lost. Read some of the other stories here, maybe you'll be pleasantly surprised!

Wishing you much Hatzlacha in all good things,
Meir

[Moderator's Note: Much of this post responded to the comments of another poster that were not consistent with the Torah. Because the latter post has been mostly removed, I have removed the responses as well].

In other news...




You could just not tell him and eventually after a while of not talking and speaking you would become less close and your nisayon easier. Theres no need to tell him that your not going to talk to him if you dont have to talk to him anyways. From personal experience its not that big a deal, plenty of people I just didnt talk to when I was in israel and I didnt have to deal with telling them "sorry I wont be speaking to you anymore" I just didnt

Thanks justkeepgoing. I think I can do that! I think I have this under control- 13 days and counting. Baruch Hashem. I guess my friend moving away is hashgacha that is the best thing for the both of us. Today I had a big nisayon with a good looking friend of mine sitting in front of me in class, but reakky did a pretty good job for most of the time getting my mind and eyes off him.
Thank you all for all your support.

Welcome and wow. It's hard enough for me with "regular" nisyonos, to be so dedicated with such a hard nisayon is truly something.

All the best!