Reb Yid wrote on 22 Sep 2011 02:52:



I was doing not so well this week, so I was trying to limit my time on the computer. When I posted my comment, I just quickly read Gersher’s question & did not realized that he is working in frum environment, which is of course is a little bit different. Also I should have explained what I wanted to say in more detail. I thought he moved to non-frum environment, where calling co-workers by Ms. / Mrs Last Name would be considered weird & in my humble opinion I would not recommend as a first response thing. But of course if it ‘s a trigger for someone  to call someone by first name & then of course he should call his female co-worker Ms. / Mrs.  Last name.

Obviously, there are different approaches within Orthodoxy about how to approach outside world, which we should probably not debate on this forum, but in my humble opinion doing things that are not cultural norm just in order to stick out more than halachackly required (kippa, missing tons of days for holidays, hand shaking is a little bit more complicated) is unnecessary & leads to hillel Hashem. So for example, just because someone needs to daven mincha does not mean that he should daven in the middle of the room filled with non Jewish / non –frum people.

As far your questions, as far as I know & in my limited experience, dinner w/prospective client which involves one female & one male even non-frum environment would not be considered inappropriate/weird. Only creepers flirt with female co-workers. As far as I know most people working in secular / non-frum environment want to have friendly, but professional environment between members of opposite gender. As I mentioned before, this could lead to problems if there is an attraction. Of course, having good middos is important, but in case where is attraction involved I would strongly recommend keeping distance. As Rambam said the derech Torah is in the middle & to avoid extremes, but in cases one gets off balance one need to go to opposite extreme to get one self in balance.   

I had some limited P & M issues for a while, but unfortunately I had some bad experience with non-Jewish female co-worker which made it in to full addiction. In order to make a long story short, right away  I was attracted to her and at first I was keeping my distance & I was doing okay. After while I let my guard down, I got to know her better and develop strong feelings, which of course I could not do anything about, which caused me a lot of emotional pain.

Have a good Shabbos & keep on Trucking!   

To my dear struggler,
We obviously grew up in very different environments, and have developed very different Hashkafos. Where I come from, wearing a Kippa was a Davar Pashut, and the other stuff as well. I don't think this is the place to debate these issues however, and so I will back down and agree to disagree.

Hatzlocha,
Reb Yid

good shabbos

good yomtonv


good job

I never understood the term 'agree to disagree'. If I disagree with you and I believe that my opinion is the truth then I don't agree to your disagreement. And if I agree that your disagreement might be the truth, then I don't truly believe that my opinion is the truth. Or does it just mean that I believe that my opinion is the truth, and yours isn't, however, I understand where you're coming from and I don't think I can convince you of the truth so therefore I am allowing your argument to stand untouched, although I disagree with it.

Agreed

Yossi.L. wrote on 23 Sep 2011 15:38:

It just means that rather than endlessly arguing our points back and forth, (since neither party can convince the other of his position) we will just "agree" to the fact that we "disagree" and move on.

That's meaningless political jargon....empty words..

Yossi.L. wrote on 23 Sep 2011 15:53:

no, just a way to move on to another topic.

Yossi.L. wrote on 23 Sep 2011 15:38:


I don't know what it means. I can only tell you what it means to me, and what I meant when I wrote it.

Different people grow up in different environments. We would all agree that someone who grew up in the "Alte Heim" would be appalled at just about everything that we here in the 21st century consider to be frum. Does that mean he is wrong? no. Does it mean we are wrong? Also no. Could be he is, could be we are, and it could also be that for him in that world he was right, and for us in our world we are right.

So, when a topic comes up that I feel is influenced dramatically by the specific demographics of the different parties involved, I don't feel like it's beneficial to waste my time or his by debating or defending a position that may be right for both of us in our own environments. So I meant to say that it would be better to keep to our own beliefs and not slug it out, recognizing that not everything is black and white.

So I would like to "Agree" that we are different and have vastly different views which may both be correct for us, so it's ok to continue "to disagree" about the issue, without attempting to prove the other one wrong.

I hope that is clear now.
If it's still not clear, then you may just be different than me so I will once again agree to disagree. 

Much clearer Reb Yid! I have to stop putting value to the meaning of the 'english language.' The alef beis has innate meaning in every letter uttered. However, the english language is not so. So I'll leave it be, although the inner OCD in me wants to rear its' ugly head.

Good job yossi l. Tell that inner ocd where to go...(I'm sure he'll agree)

good shabbos

good yomtonv


good job



masskim??

Good day

I posted a nice piece about someone who comes into contact with women on a daily basis and is misgaber.  www.guardyoureyes.org/forum/index.php?topic=4337.msg120290#msg120290

For me, I think the draw to P+M is about frustrated giving.  In the chasidisha sefarim they call it "Ahava HaNofelles - Fallen Love".  This is when the vessle of love is broken, and comes out all distorted.  I want to love, I want to give- but I must restrain myself.  I feel like I can't share and have a love, a giving that pleases the other person, so I resort to seeing and imagining it in all ways (including P+M).  Can anybody relate to this?