5770 wrote on 06 Jul 2011 03:50:
Women like this (including for example my wife-- virulent secular background - now a very reluctant semi-BT)
What was your strategy/plan when you married her? What were her/your expectations, and how did they diverge?
an assault on them personally - or on femininity in general.
Many times, the women are right. Very often, men perceive problems as being primarily "in the women", for example, blaming them for dressing down, dressing up,
frum women dressing too prettily,
goyim dressing too provocatively, hot weather making all women dress... women doing... women not doing... women... women...
And maybe it is a problem.
A tagline that I saw on this forum, which I absolutely love, is "She might be a problem, but she's not your problem". This is one of the most beautiful pearls of wisdom.
If we go out to war at every opportunity, then we are actually obsessing over women, and they rule us as much as much as someone who runs after them in undiluted lust. In the same way that a rebellious teenager is "controlled" as much by their parents as one who is compliant, if s/he is contrary in every respect. When our wives see that we are "at war" with most of the female population, they correctly surmise that we are obsessed, and are objectifying women. I would expect some argument on this from some parts of the
frum world, but I stand by it. Going to war with
pritzus, even just in our minds, is giving in to it. Because we make it relevant to
us. And in turn, this objectifies women - because their human side is not relevant to us when we do this.
Thus, women get upset when they see this behavior, since its effect is quite similar to what pornography does. Instead of seeing people (women), we see problems on legs. If we're lucky, we see only "potential problems on legs", or "doubleplus good, well-behaved things on legs". And then we can feel good about the state of the world, because it was doing its job properly.
That's why wives/women will get upset at that behavior, or outlook.
Now, that said, they most certainly do not appreciate the challenges that we face. And then we make things worse (sometimes), by pretending that we don't have a problem (they're usually a lot smarter than we give them credit for), or that out problem is "something else". Like "all those other women". They hear something like that, and think "self-righteous pig, who does he think he is, anyway?". Oddly, many (not all) women would be a lot more forgiving if we admitted that the problem is in the way we view the world, and we need to work on it. It's amazing - if we identify the problem somewhere else (like in "most women"), they hate us. And hinder us. If we identify the problem as being in ourselves and show them the work we're doing, they respect us. And sometimes even help us. (
Disclaimer: don't try this at home, without adult supervision)
What many people don't understand is that they've already "involved" their wife, when they point out all the "problems" - they've just involved their wives in the wrong way.
A fortiori when we involve them with our actions and not even our words.
I wish I had a strategy for dealing with this. It is causing a lot of resentment - plus my wife thinks I am mental :-)
Aren't you? Aren't we all? Don't we all need help for our own crazinesses?
![](https://guardyoureyes.com/components/com_kunena/template/default/images/emoticons/new/smile.png)
Maybe she's right, and maybe she knows!
Looks like she is already "involved". Whatcha gonna do? (And no, I am most definitely not suggesting "spilling all" to her, least of all before you figure yourself out - like managers, most wives tend to prefer problems with at least some regard to a feasible solution, and some tangible steps)