Yosef Hatzadik wrote on 16 Nov 2011 22:01:

Totally cracking me up.

Hey Zem,  Thanks backatcha

two thoughts buzzing around my mind lately.

one is that the RBSO does not need my help. even if i worry about the economy, middle east peace, occupy wall street, world population, chinese military prowess, iranian dinner jackets and other sundry problems it won't help Him much. so i should quit whitewashing my scalp by worrying. right?

two is about what we say in davening many times how the RBSO is 'avinu av harachaman', our loving merciful Father. the other day i was davening and had a mental misfire. i was trying to imagine a loving father and i couldn't come up with the right picture. which led me to question how i was supposed to relate to the RBSO as a father-son if i cannot find the correct mashal and example in my life. then it occurred to me that just as we say והשיב לב אבות על בנים ולב בנים על אבותם, sometimes the process starts with the kids and sometimes with the parents. maybe i need to start with my kids. and be a father to them such that they - and i - can use the image to conjure up the meaning of davening when needed.

Nice thoughts ZS.

If you are a rabbi tatz fan, there is a great one about the eisav vs yishmael personality (we all have a dominant side).  It relates to the first thing you said, worrying about world news.  I also have thought for a while, you might like it, if you like personality type stuff.  It explains a lot.

I have another comment on the davening front.  Maybe I'll post a bit later.

sounds great gibbor, any idea where i can get that shiur from R' Tatz?

I think I know someone that can send it to you .

Adlai Stevenson?

You are sending hidden messages.

see this en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adlai_Stevenson_I



No joke. wow!

no hidden messages intended just a plain old joke, but woodford is always nice

i listened to the shiur you very kindly sent and it is great! thank you very much for sending it.
(basic synopsis: Naaseh ve'Nishma, practical action vs. meditative reflection, sensitivity and appreciation of beauty vs. drive and determination to implement, Esav vs. Yishma'el. male and female. Torah and mitzvos. in spirituality, personalities and in the world.)
i searched online for a copy but could not find it. it may well be in one of his books.

zemmy, did you learn "chovos halevovos" recently?

no  :-[

is it showing?

you wouldnt question if hashems loving you
if you or anyone is seeking for profound advice to keep mindtracked in these troublesome times, they should study chovos halvovos daily in order

ZemirosShabbos wrote on 23 Nov 2011 16:50:

I originally got it from simpletoremember.com.  I always forget the name .  I looked for it also, and couldn't find it, so I just emailed it.  I don't think it's up there any more, but they still do have a lot of his stuff.  I don't know how many people are familiar with rav aharon lopiansky, but he has a lot of good stuff on torahlectures.com, here's his page torahlectures.com/c-125.aspx .

gibbor120 wrote on 23 Nov 2011 17:17:

thanks for the link to rav lopiansky!

Shmeichel wrote on 23 Nov 2011 17:03:

point well-taken. thank you!
just to clarify, my issue was not to question if Hashem loves me, though i do welcome any and every assertion of that love, rather i was seeking a concrete illustration of a father-son relationship to use as a springboard for visualizing how the RBSO is our loving father.


recently learned in Bilvavi Mishkan Evneh vol.2 about the difference between what we know in our mind to what we feel in our heart and the great distance between them. he compares it to a father teaching his young son. even though the father's intellect is way above the child's level the father will repeat and clarify a simple idea on the child's terms. so too, we need to 'talk' to our inner child in simple basic language, not with the sophisticated and clever ideas that is often so much more appealing. and the key is to review these basic ideas often, in contrast to a natural desire to always seek a new and novel idea.

there is a major difference between learning missur and learning hashkofo!
missur is adjustmants to your behavier
hashkofo is rather laying foundations, giving you the correct "mind concept"
chovos halvovos is the father of MOST hashkofo seforim, its also the MAIN SOURCE for most yidishe therapists

ZemirosShabbos wrote on 23 Nov 2011 17:46:

Now that's novel .