laagvokeles wrote on 04 Jul 2011 21:10:


I think that it may be time to tell Laag what the 12 Steps actually are:

1. We admitted we were powerless over lust—that our lives had become unmanageable.

2. Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.

3. Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.

4. Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.

5. Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.

6. Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.

7. Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.

8. Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.

9. Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.

10. Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it.

11. Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God, as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us
and the power to carry that out.

12. Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these Steps, we tried to carry this message to sexaholics, and to practice these principles in all our
affairs.

ur-a-jew wrote on 05 Jul 2011 20:37:


8  9  10 i dont know what they mean to say.
12 im doing right now...

a few steps look the same to me... (wich i gess im wrong)
but seriously dov ילמדנו רבינו what should i do now

laagvokeles wrote on 05 Jul 2011 20:47:


:o

La'ag, I don't mean to be insulting -but if you think that what you are doing now is step 12, then it's not just 8, 9, and 10 that you didn't understand.

See, 12 is what dov is doing with you!

lol?
durdaya u understood my joke once again! bravo!  ;D

any way what i am tryeng to say is:  how much time do u need for every סעיף?
why cant i do all of them at once?
and the trouth is i am doing all the 12 (besides telling my wife I WILL NEVER EVER EVER NEVER) including the 12th im doing now with you durdaya, oh.... and u with me.... :o

No, I'm not up to step 12 yet.

As a matter of fact, I'm working on step 0-1, maybe step .5 or something like that.

Oh, and what exactly was your joke this time? ???

ohh maybe that im on the 12th already....
i know i am not because i am long enough in gye, but i dont chap whats the problem to absorve all the 12 steps in one shot....
soon rabeinu dov is gonna explain it to me. the problem is that he has other things to do in life too....
piano piano
shwoie shwoie 

laagvokeles wrote on 05 Jul 2011 20:25:


No, just separated.

Hey Laag,

I'm really impressed at your persistence here.

--Eye.

La'ag,

If your cup is so full, how will you take anything esle into it?

Later. Gotta go.

Tehillim 23:5?

Yossi wrote on 06 Jul 2011 08:34:


mmmm? why do u make me ask you what u mean....? (i dont have a tehilim next to my pc....)

dov,tell me whats next! what should i do? u have a plan? wich is it? dont mas don po..? ill stick to it... anything allse?

No, not Mizmor leDovid.

A wide-eyed, idealistic American (probably Jewish) hippie schlepped all the way to India, to seek the Truth, at the feet of Maharashi Gupta Vida Sanhajipoopoo. (OK,so I made up the name....it's a story, for crying out loud so shut up and stop interrupting with silly questions!)

OK. So he gets there and is very tired, sweaty, and hungry. The Guru says hello and asks, "My son, why have you come?"

The hippie has been waiting for this moment all his life. Hungry and thirsty as he was, he blurts out his philosophy of life, the problems he has with it and with his society and G-d, and lists the best ideas he could come up with to work it all out and the reasons that none of them work for him. He then starts to explain exactly what he is hoping Mr. Sanhajipoopoo (his friends call him, just "Poo"...sorry, that was another interruption!) will be able to do for him...when he stops in mid-sentence, mouth agape.

While our little yiddle was busy expressing his deepest hopes, Mr. Poo was pouring his guest some tea. the cup was small, the chainik large, and the table round. About half-way through the hippie's litany, the cup filled up. Poo kept pouring. The hippie went on, a bit distracted...Poo went on pouring.

The table was covered with tea and it began to run over all it's sides onto the floor and finally hippie couldn't take the weirdness any more. He just stopped.

He asked the immediately relevant question: "Why is Your Poo-ness pouring the tea all over the place?!" (Mrs. Poo was used to this and had brought in some towels as soon as she saw "another American dumkopf" coming up the dirt road!....sorry. I did it again! :)

Poo responded. "If your cup is already full with your own ideas, then whatever I add can only cause it to overflow and make a big mess. Are you ready to empty your head a bit and make some room for new ideas, or not?"

The American said, "No," and he went all the way back to Flatbush where he worked in a dry-cleaning shop until he died. (OK, so I really, really took my liberties with the ending. Sue me! But it was fun, no?)

OK. So, if you are gonna work these things, you need to make some room in the dusty, smelly attic of your head. The same head that produces all these great ideas like: "Hey, I am bored...I know exactly what I can do! Get another dirty video and watch it till I have to masturbate!", and other genius plans like, "Hashem is nice, powerful, and smart...but he really does not know how to make me happy, so I will have to take care of things by unzipping my pants now." and still greater ways of thinking like, "yeah it's a mitzvah to have a wife and children, but my wife is a pain in the neck and my children are a bigger pain in the neck (and sometimes even worse) and I will only be happy by ignoring their needs. The more I will try to care for them and help them, the worse my life will get!" 

These kinds of ways of thinking come from not having a 3rd step.

We'll get there after #2 iy"H.

But do you have #1? Can you answer my PM'd questions, so we know?

dov,
that was beutiful!
you shoul write a book!
beautiful mashul!

i am big time deep in the first step....

its interesting but it scares me the idea that soon i am gonna have to involve hashem in all this.
i would love to be able to do it as a atheist עפרא לפומי

by the way dov i hope its not מעכב anything what i am gonna tell u now, wich is:
before i say it let me just say that i am not 100 % sure about what i am gonna say only 99.99 %

In my opinion its written all over the sefarim that any aveira in the world and בפרט this specific aveira of זנות once u got used to it u are by a few sefarim קרוב לאונס and by other sefarim אונס ממש

But even so they say that we jews can get out of it by coach hatora and by just preventing triggers (they didnt say "and u have to live with hashem... not only do it as a robot.... i wonder why..... ooohh maybe cause thats what they mean when they say torah.....)

the torah dosnt change if they wrote it 200 or 1000 years ago its stil aplicable to us, and we can do it.
לא נתנה תורה למלאכי השרת if in our generation its imposible to prevent trigers because we need to go to the bank and find a 18 year old shiksah who counts our millions of dollars etc its not a excuse, be cause לא נתנה תורה למלאכי השרת and if u really mean it and u do all in your power to do the ratzon hashem youll manage.

No such thing that a person can be taken from him the bechirah, no such thing as addiction that a person is not in control of his maasim.(besides when u put a new suibstance in your body like nicotine or heroine)
this is the way i look at it.
BUT:
Because usually our yirat shomayim is down down down, per example me, I would maybe not hasitate that if I lets say wouldn’t have children etc, I would maybe go live in hawai and drink beer in yom kipur (ח"ו)  so here is when i come to you dov and ask from u „dov please save me! Please give me this goishe idea you have and get me cured, cause my life isn’t life any more”
BUT:
Dov I come to you because I have no koach to deal with hashem! He is way to demanding!  Hashem says:  I can only help you if u really come back to me!  Why? Cause u are in deep kichsa my son, I cant help u get out of it if you only give me two fingers! You gotta give me both hands! (תרי"ג מצוות.... and its hard now wich is a outcome of a bad relation with hashem, cause to be able to do all he asks you gotta have a  good good relation with hashem,  a relation that i enjoy hes company  a relation that i cant wait for maariv cause ill be able to do again a mitzva of קר"ש  and i am so far from this! cause my yirat shamayim is down the drain, hashem is not a joy hashem is a pain in the ass, he disturbs me to have life, he dosnt help me, true if i would work on thinking "ohhh hashem is so nice to me i have health i have kids a wife i have what to eat i have such wonderfool trees out side my house ...." it would maybe change my relation with him but i cant do it now ("cant" i mean  i need a lot a lot of ratzon, so i told hashem  once and for all לא מעוקצך ולא מדובשך  live me alone, i cant give u what u want (what i need… he dosnt need nothing) so asta la vista baby

Now: I come to u dov and I hope you know how to do it without making my life a leaving hell

Cant wait

dov where r u?!
hello?!
this place is dead last few days!
come on pump it up!