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Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 20 May 2016 04:32 #288329

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Yesod wrote on 19 May 2016 13:58:
Well said Simcha.

I am thoroughly convinced that life is NOT necessarily more enjoyable for someone who isn't jewish and can do whatever they want, etc.
For 1, look at how many jews who were secular leave it all behind and come to torah and mitzvos etc.
Both my parents are BT, and i heard over the years how nothing is as appealing as the truth. 

In the holy books it is said that all which is wrong is inherently dark, lifeless and devoid of life,  hence it must leech onto holiness and harvest that energy for its own designs. 
(As sometimes we experience that after particularly holy times (ie shabbas, learning) we can find ourselves in the midst of very difficult challenges) In the same vein, this is also why the jew can outdo his peers in perversion of mind and heart,  when that potent energy goes awry, it goes awry.

So in essence all of the lusting and passion and pleasure are twisted manifestations of holy energy stolen and expressed out of whack. 

Were one to throw away these sources of energy by living apart from torah and mitzvod,  there wouldnt be much supply of energy sustenance for our enjoyment of sin. 
It would quickly descend into empty and lifeless activities,  a frantic pursuit of an elusive thrill that once captivated us. 






(Man i had better snap back to reality, this post is a bit "out there".................................  need a morning coffee)

Great piece - good points and well written -
However, Hashem who is all knowing decided to create us Jewish with our own respective nature and environment(nurture)
Therefore -Any and all challenges we face is for our betterment.
Let's just take the cards that the Almighty dealt us and play the game as best we can. Overthinking here won't enable us to develop where we ultimately want to be.
 

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 20 May 2016 04:44 #288332

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feh.. I don't find it hard to believe. I'm pretty confident I would do the same with little hesitation.

I do feel SOOOOO appreciative about being Jewish. I just can't say "Shelo Asani Goy" with the same kind of ecstasy that I used to because I feel like a shaigetz jew sometimes anyway

Only question is - Finish Asher Yatzar first or do the geirus?

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 20 May 2016 13:58 #288369

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Yesod wrote on 20 May 2016 04:19:

Workingguy wrote on 19 May 2016 23:19:

Yesod wrote on 19 May 2016 13:58:
Well said Simcha.

I am thoroughly convinced that life is NOT necessarily more enjoyable for someone who isn't jewish and can do whatever they want, etc.
For 1, look at how many jews who were secular leave it all behind and come to torah and mitzvos etc.
Both my parents are BT, and i heard over the years how nothing is as appealing as the truth. 

In the holy books it is said that all which is wrong is inherently dark, lifeless and devoid of life,  hence it must leech onto holiness and harvest that energy for its own designs. 
(As sometimes we experience that after particularly holy times (ie shabbas, learning) we can find ourselves in the midst of very difficult challenges) In the same vein, this is also why the jew can outdo his peers in perversion of mind and heart,  when that potent energy goes awry, it goes awry.

So in essence all of the lusting and passion and pleasure are twisted manifestations of holy energy stolen and expressed out of whack. 

Were one to throw away these sources of energy by living apart from torah and mitzvod,  there wouldnt be much supply of energy sustenance for our enjoyment of sin. 
It would quickly descend into empty and lifeless activities,  a frantic pursuit of an elusive thrill that once captivated us. 






(Man i had better snap back to reality, this post is a bit "out there".................................  need a morning coffee)


I am thoroughly convinced that life is almost certainly not more enjoyable for one who's not Jewish, for a million reasons. I too have thought about what it would be like to be not Jewish and be able to do what I want, and it ends at seventy something and lonely, having slept with a lot of women and no long term relationship, a few divorces, and no kids or estrangement from them. I wasn't even trying to convince myself that our way is better, but I couldn't possibly see a way that not having a guide to life could end anyway but pretty miserably, especially for someone who probably would act on every impulse if they weren't Jewish.

So I'm sticking on this team even if I get the
"Switched at birth" phone call!

Yeah, we'll see when you get the call,.......
"Sooooooooo mr working guy,  your last name is actually Rockefeller. ..., wanna come home? "
Working guy response 

"Noooooo!!!, chas vchalila, feh, and besides can't you see I'm gratteh in the middle of asher yotsar from a siddur, leave me alone!, oh no, i talked in the middle,  oh no,  oh no,  someone give me malkus, please, ok gotta go bye, thanks anyways for calling",  click

Yeahhhh, riiiiiiight


Are you kidding? For money? I thought we were talking about giving it all up for taavah, sexual stuff. That would be a struggle and I wouldn't do it but it would be tough.

But for money I would never even entertain it. Perhaps because I Baruch HaShem don't have financial worries and if I did it would be different- but if you would give it up for sex and for money, what's keeping you in? Just the accident of being born Jewish? That's very uninspiring.

And interestingly, although I had a choice to go into the for profit sector and join a successful family business, I chose to become a rabbi because I like to learn, teach, and have a push to grow in my own yiddishkeit.

Sorry for sounding corny but I would never give this up- not for a billion dollars, forty virgins, or every porn star in the world.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 22 May 2016 15:13 #288519

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I'm a little lost here which is funny because this is my home thread lol. - I'm happy I'm a yid (if that's the discussion), Addiction and the problems I have because of it would plague me if I were not a Jew also. - Billions of healthy non-addict normal non-Jewish people live with porn in front of them all the time and use it or don't use it as it suits them. Whether they are role models I would want to be like or not is not important, the bottom line is they don't get sucked up into porn like I do. Being a yid I DO feel we have a certain ingrained experience that helps us with certain steps. For example, step 11 is connecting to God in prayer. Since we are mandated to pray 3x a day, I think we have an easier time working that step. Same would go for a devout Muslim, and any faith that spends time regularly in prayer as opposed to once a week or something like that. I have some more thoughts on this topic but not that I feel is appropo to sharing on the WWW. 
  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 23 May 2016 15:57 #288652

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Ok I am in seven days now so on the one hand things are a little easier knowing yemei heter is coming. But on the other this is usually where things get a little heated up in anticipation. I have not acted out, but have been lusting. Watching youtube videos which is bad news... and entertaining lustful thoughts. I was thinking today that I should take on a limited taphsic kaballa not to act out until..... And set something that will get my mind more recovery oriented. Maybe like not to act out until I read a chapter from SA and talk with someone in recovery. 
  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.
Last Edit: 24 May 2016 15:07 by otr-otr.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 24 May 2016 15:07 #288776

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Cumulative Clean Days: 184

I listened to some things I should not have listened to last night and watched a bunch of things I should not have watched yesterday. Amazingly today I woke up and after reading on the forum through other threads and some of my own, I am feeling more committed today to staying away from those things. I also (as noted above) realize that in the seven days things can in a way get more challenging for me, as selfish and infantile as that sounds. 

Today, probably as a result of reading these thigns in the past and having these good thoughts bounce off the hollows of my empty skull, the idea popped into my head that I should pray for my wife whenever I get a lust attack associated with the present situation. It helped immediately to begin thinking that way, and helped more profoundly than when I tried praying for others for whom I lusted. This is probably because I know and understand my wife's challenges and identify with them more than with others. But the power of this tool was really something new to me and something I hope I will do more of. 

Although I woul like to close out this window right now and open up to porn- I am not going to (bli neder) I am going to go back now to the work I need to do. My TAPHSIC till the end of the week should be that before I open any porn, I will read or post on the forum for 10 minutes. I have to make this tye of geder more permanent but I want to try that. I thoguht about it yesterday, btu was not willing to commit to it. At least today I wrote it out.... 
  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 24 May 2016 17:38 #288790

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Dov wrote on 24 May 2016 17:03:

quiet wrote on 04 May 2016 21:07:
I am jealous of your 35. I am to 19 days. That is my best since 47 days in September.

The numbers alone motivate me. I click on the "diary" to find this information that I have tracked.

Now your turn, Perseverance. I have troubles in 2 major facets of my live. Don't I deserve to have I nice fall?

Building my current streak will IYH stop me.

If numbers are so great a motivation, then why the need for so many restarts? It must not be working that well, no?

I think counting the days is very often the very worst way to stay clean. My sponsor helped me get over the whole counting-thing, and it worked for many clean years so far, one day at a time because (among other great things) it enabled me to start getting out of Hashem's way. And i mean exactly that: one day at a time. A concept little used by WOH people. They are picking the hard way, and it is is sad to see the suffering of my good friends here.

And the restarts.


Had to share this post as I feel myself falling into the idea of counting and not focusing on ODAAT. So here it is... 
  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 24 May 2016 17:40 #288791

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Lol... the instant I posted that last post I instinctively clicked on the user profile page and scrolled toward the "I'm still clean" button... Even though I know I clicked it already this morning.... about 3 times YEP... I definitely need a booster of ODAAT... 
  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 24 May 2016 18:00 #288795

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If I may comment with my very uneducated and not very long sober two cents. And at risk of getting bashed over the head...Numbers are not a motivator in itself however it might be helpful as a extra push. If you're doing certain steps and trudging along in sobriety it sure helps to look back "hey I may be doing something right" and that adds to the motivating to continue doing what's right. 

One of the first steps to sobriety is to stop acting out our lust. So counting days at least gives us that. That we stopped acting on our lust.

 
Aka -  Mischadeish075 Email mischadeish075@gmail.com
Last Edit: 24 May 2016 18:01 by mggsbms.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 24 May 2016 22:01 #288813

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A lot of this is subjective. The question is not whether it works... but whether it works for you.. 
  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 26 May 2016 03:16 #288925

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Dov wrote on 16 May 2016 20:43:

As I have heard Rav Twerski admit, no one normal will be motivated to actually work these steps as simply and as honestly as they need to be worked in order for them to actually work. Without a broken addict's humble admissions of Unmanageability and of Powerlessness, there is no Program, no real personal need for G-d. 12 steps is not religion, of course, where one's 'need' for G-d is religious and mandated from Sinai. Recovery is a whole other ball game, b"H. That's why it works when you work it. 


this one was too good to not save... and this one too....


 Sobriety is worth the risk of walking through our paranoia and denial and fear. And we cannot do it alone. -Dov
  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.
Last Edit: 27 May 2016 04:19 by otr-otr.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 01 Jun 2016 19:13 #289432

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CUMULATIVE CLEAN DAYS: 192 Days

I had a really important thought that I wanted to write down. When I first started doing 12 steps and trying to work on recovery, I felt that to be really committed I NEEDED to speak face to face with people. I think there is definitely an advantage to that. But I am seeing that in truth, this was just a 'show of dedication' as well to a degree and that I was thinking, 'I have to embarass myself if I want to get better.' While true recovery is hard to do, adn does require uncomfortable self disclosure, the embarasment or fear thereof is not what motivates me. Maybe a few times I thought to myself, "Gee I don't want to act out because I don't want to have to tell people in my call, or on the forum..." But the reality is that this is not the fiber of what I feel is going to hold me in sobriety. Happiness and contentment that results from that honesty and self disclosure is what helps me. I don't have to 'prove' anything, or reach a certain bar to be able to stay sober. I need to make working on posting daily, writing daily and talking daily with people who are in recovery a routine that I don't waver from. However short or long it is.. I don't always have time for an hour long call every day. Once a week though I can for sure do it. But the every day communication is what I NEED to stay sober. And I can be honest in the forum as well as with friends in recovery. 

  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 06 Jun 2016 14:50 #289714

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Have not posted on my thread in a few days. That's not a good thing. BH I am feeling alright now. It's a bit easier for me now in yemei heter. I was reading back some things which i wrote over the last few months. And I see the repeat theme of financial pressure casing me to want to escape and act out. That and some other common pitfalls. I am starting now to work on Step 1 again with realizing my powerlessness. In the last cycle that I went through the steps, I starting doing some real work on relating to my family. I see my family relationships in a totally different place now then they were at the end of February this year. - In this cycle around I want to continue that, especially with regard to one of my kids with whom I have had a difficult time in the past. I also need to directly address this financial stress issue in a more substantial way. 
  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 10 Jun 2016 15:40 #290010

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So here I am with a streak of about 45 days. When I got back on the forum in late Feb of this year, I reached a period of sobriety of 45 days and then acted out. Right now I don't feel a major urge to act out. I am pretty happy. Possibly because it is yemey heter. I feel good and am continuing to work on sobriety. I finished going through the whole 12 steps with my phone buddies and we are now reading through the entire whitebook from the beginning again. 

Somewhere along the line I did some real changing inside. This change is coming out with my kids a lot. I hope to continue with it as I am a much better father and relating to my kids in a much more caring way which they deserve. 
  • I've never been one for signatures.. but sometimes people change
  • I'm seeking the life that I find manageable which may not be the life you find manageable. But let's make a deal. I want you to find yours and you want me to find mine even if they are different.

Re: OnTheRoad is BackonTrack is OTR is.... 10 Jun 2016 16:09 #290015

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Awesome !
Aka -  Mischadeish075 Email mischadeish075@gmail.com
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