Some people have a bad hair day.  I think I'm having a bad gilgul.  40ish, house, married, family, baruch Hashem.  I have always had a strong pull to aryus, but it wasn't until later in life and seeing this site that I realized how far out there my tyvas may be then the 'average' person.  My wife is a tzedaikus, and I am attracted to her.  She had been sexualy abused and neglected as a child, not to mention emotionaly abused by a caregiver.  She is also Bi-Polar II, which is mostly depression with a little fluxuation towards the manic.  My children have ADHD, and a day doesn't go by that I don't worry what will happen in school.  The combo of my freak of nature tyvas and a pressured family life is a bad combo, and I felt like I was going to burst.  This makes the temtation to act out so much harder.  Why do I write this, am I looking for sympathy or a shoulder to cry on?  Does it sound like a big excuse?  I don't know.

Couple of questions for the forum:

1.  I'm having trouble wrapping my head around a comparison between acholol addiction and lust addiction.  Seeing women is always there, and it can't be stopped.  I assume most men look at a women they think is attractive, and fantisize about them on some level.  Is everyone then an addict?  Sure, there are levels, but the idea isn't clicking with me.  Everyone agrees being drunk on the job is unacceptable.  Society doesn't relate to porn like that (they are wrong and distorted- but I'm saying it is not like being drunk).  All women want to be admired, that is how they function.  The man is hardwired to relate to that.

2.What does Hashem want from me?  Why build me and raise me in an environment where by the time I am an adult I am a totally nutcase pervert?  I go to sleep with this and I wake up with this, and almost every woman I see restarts the whole process.  Why, what, and how?

3.For me, it seems more about imagination (dimyon) then lust.  I am imagination addicted, which gravitates towards aryos.  Can anyone relate to that?

4.Has anyone noticed that the major points on this website are straight out of Breslov thinking? Hope, Simcha, Starting Over, Being with Hashem when falling, ect.  Yes, these ideas are all over the Torah, but Rebbi Nachman focused on them and refined them to a science.  I have started learning Breslov for the past couple of years, otherwise I am the cold, learning, yechay, litvak type.  But I find it amazing that when dealing with the issuce of aryos (which Breslov does all the time), Rebbi Nachman's teaching seem to surface.

Thanks for creating this forum and allowing me to get chizuk and understanding from you all,

Black Bigday

bigday

hello

how does it work

its like going on to a boeing 747 and asking the pilot

heyyy buddy how does this work??


come in grab a seat

we will be here soon with a plate of ruggelach and a lichaim (woodford my fav)

stay her we will help you

WELCOME! I'm glad to share a seat with you on this plane.  yes, there are enough of us to fill several 747s.  We're all in the same boat, or plane . Anyway, stick around a while and it will all start to make sense, slooowly.

Here's the official welcome package. Take some time to digest it.

Welcome to our community, you have finally come home!

We're all in the same boat here. Tzuras Rabim Chatzi Nechama   Once you've arrived, there's no turning back. Everyone here will just grab a hold of you and pull you up with them!

GYE Program in a Nutshell: (Right Click the link and press "Save Link/Target As" to save the PDF file to your computer).

'Guard Your Eyes' offers a unique approach to helping people by recognizing that there are many different levels in the struggle for "Shmiras Ainayim" and "Shmiras Habris". After studying the experience of hundreds of religious strugglers over the past few years, we put together the suggestions and recommendations that we feel are best for the various levels. We divided the tools, features and services that GYE offers into 8 different levels. This "GYE Program in a Nutshell can help people quickly identify at what level of the struggle they are at, and which tools and features would help them most at their particular level.

Here are some quick things you can do to help you jump straight into recovery:

1) Make sure to install a strong filter. It will be almost impossible to break free of this while having all the garbage within a mouse click away. See this page for one good filter option, along with instructions on how to install it best – and give away the password to our "filter Gabai"… See this page for another 20 (or so) filter ideas and information… We also highly advise installing "Reporting Software" such as webchaver.org to give you some accountability, because filters alone are usually not sufficient and they can often be bypassed.

2) Join the daily Chizuk e-mail lists to get fresh chizuk every day.

3) Scientific studies have shown that it takes 90 days to change a neural thought pattern that was ingrained in the brain through addictive behaviors. Did you join the 90 day chart on-line? Sign up over here.

4) Post away on this forum! You will get tons of daily Chizuk and support. This disease can't be beat alone. It works best when you get out of isolation!

5) GuardYourEyes also offers many free anonymous phone conferences where you can join a group of other frum Yidden, along with an experienced sponsor. See www.guardyoureyes.org > Tools > Phone Conferences for many different options. Our conferences are taking place every day, morning, noon and night… Joining a phone group would be a tremendous step in the right direction for you and help you learn freedom from this addiction. Not only will you learn the secret of the 12-Steps – which is known to be the world's most powerful program for beating addiction having helped millions world wide, but the daily call will be another way of GETTING OUT OF ISOLATION and connecting with others who are going through what you are.

6) If you need more general guidance, write to our e-mail helpline at gye.help@gmail.com or call our hotline at 646-600-8100.

7) Download and read the "Guard Your Eyes Handbook". This handbook outlines the GYE approach in detail, and makes our network much more effective and helpful for people. The handbook has two parts:

A) The first part, "Attitude & Perspective", details 30 basic principles to help us maintain the proper attitude and perspective on this struggle. Here are some examples: Understanding what we are up against, what it is that Hashem wants from us, how we can use this struggle for tremendous growth, how we can deal with bad thoughts, discovering how to redirect the power of our souls, understanding that every little bit counts, learning how to bounce back up after a fall, and so on and so forth…

The second part, "The 18 Tools", detail suggested tools and techniques, in progressive order, beginning with the most basic and fundamental approaches to dealing with this addiction, and continuing down through increasingly earnest and powerful methods. No matter what level our addiction may have advanced to, we will be able to find the right tools to break free in this handbook!

May Hashem be with you!

Hi black bigday -

Thanks for your post. And yes.. Your life does seem like you were dealt a hard hand. Although never complain... People are struggling with all other problems i.e financial, physical health issues, familial alienation, off the derech. So while on paper what you says sounds pretty bad, try to focus on the parts of your life that are positive (we are not in aushwitz).

To answer your points one at a time. This is my opinion and there are some overly qualified people that can answer better both from a halachic standpoint and psychological one.

1) We call the lust addiction an addiction when you continue the same act again and again cognizant of the fact that this very act is bringing you down. When you are feeling down because of some extranous event and you take it out with pornography and masturbation, you know you are only making the problem worse but cannot help it. Similiar to emotional eating. That is why people say it is so much harder to stop a food addiction that it is cigarrets or alcohol. You need to be exposed to food. The question is how much.

2) You sound like you are blaming Hashem for turning you into what you are today. You made every decision to look at porn and masturbate when opportunities and hardships arose. He did not create a perverted nutcase. He created someone with a hard life and possibly a strong predisposition to lust and addiction.
The only reason every women you see starts the whole process all over again is because you are still trapped in the pool of crap. Once you get out of the pool you can look at crap and it does not smell so bad. You look at a women and the process starts because you are in that mode all day.
At the same time the more you look away from women the easier it is to trigger you. Its life 101. But many people on this site say that after they have been sober for a couple of months they view women differently and are able to walk in the street with going nuts.
3) I cannot relate to that. You know some people in this site said that even when they get rid of all the shmutz in their house they still go to the bathroom and can imagine scenes which they can masturbate to. Or they can draw pictures of different things they remember. One gift I was born with is extremely sub average visual perceptual skills. That means that I cannot recreate images in my head in any great detail. I cannot be an architect or an engineer.
4) Most of this site talks about the 12 steps. If that is Breslov that so be it. Do you know of any other sources which help porn addiction? The only other thing I know of is mussar and that does not work for addicts.
Best!

ninety

hi and welcome bigday,

you have some really good questions. i hope you take the time to read up on this site and absorb some of the wisdom available here. (and to enjoy the rugelach and shnapps while you're at it. sometimes nothing is more of a balm than to have a really good laugh)

wishing you lots of hatzlacha
zs

Thanks to everybody for responding!
Hey ninety- I am not comfortable with blaming Hashem.  I hope I am not.  I would make a difference between a kasha and a shaylah.  A kasha is saying Hashem did wrong.  A Shaylah is asking for clarity.  I want to believe I'm the latter.  I am asking why Hashem would put one of His neshamas in such a situation. Not as defense, but for clarity- since 4th grade I've looked at p*** (as I found my older brother's stash).  Being raised crazy liberal, my mom told me I could keep looking at it!  I think part of my problem in this area is nurture, starting with that type of background.  But part of it is nature- I think I'm hardwired with a stronger drive then the 'average' person.  I'm struggling to understand this.  What does Hashem want me to do.  Ruglach sound good, but day in day out, hour by hour, what am I supposed to do.  BH, with His help, I am not acting out on a daily, or even weekly basis.  I could go 8 months with no acting out.  But why am designed to live like this?

Black Bigday

Welcome to the forum. Regarding your first question, I think that you are 100% right in saying that man is hardwired to look & fantasies at woman that he is attracted to. If we are left our nature devices that how we would act. This is how rest of the world behaves, but according to Torah we suppose repress our natural inclination and limited it to only to one’s spouse. So when it comes to lust, I believe Torah has tall order for us and it’s that we should try to avoid looking at the women lustfully and no masturbation. I believe that engaging these behaviors periodically only is a religious problem and not an addiction.This is different from gambling & drinking where occasional engagement in these activities would not be a religious nor addiction issue, but porn & masturbation would be a religious issue even if done periodically. 

Why did Hashem hard-wire us like this?  What is it about this force that makes it the most powerful in the world?

My opinion to your questions is as follows. First of all to know if you are an adicit is simple  if you can hold your self back from acting out even when it makes you crazy  then you have the power that I don't have. But if u can not hold back and your life becomes powerless and you do it and cry and then do it and cry, then yes you belong. That's in a little few words.

As far as why g-d made it ? And why people are sick or don't have money or do have a lot of money or any other thing you DO understand?

We can only they our best.

black bigday wrote on 07 Sep 2011 20:46:


That's as funny as it's sad  ;D  :'(

In the old days I would have a field-day with all these great (typical) questions of yours, and I would answer each of them in depth, but unfortunately, I don't have the time these days... That's why we created the GYE handbook. All of your questions are answered there, and the latest versioncan be downloaded here.




See Principle 21 in the back of the handbook: "Understanding what we're up against".




That good question too, is answered in the first couple of principles in the back - under "Attitude & Perspective"




Of-course we relate to that! 98% of lust is through koach hadimyon. Rav Nachman says that the name of the Yetzer Hara today is "dimyon"...




Yes, although we quote a lot from everywhere - litvish, chassidish, chabad, etc... Breslov comes up a lot here. (Hey, I just mentioned R' Nachman above  ;D)... Click here to download a booklet of GYE quotes, articles, etc... taken from Breslov teachings.




Anytime. 

Am I seeing good? Is this site managed in Israel? Meaning the times are Israeli time?

Wow, I've never heard that Reb Nachman that the Yetzer Hara is "dimyon" how true and powerful!

Yossi.L. wrote on 08 Sep 2011 12:42:

below is a quote from the booklet Guard referenced above
(guardyoureyes.com/live/ebooks?task=callelement&format=raw&item_id=155&element=f85c494b-2b32-4109-b8c1-083cca2b7db6&method=download)

From Reb Nachman's Wisdom #6
The evil urge is similar to a prankster running through a crowd showing his tightly closed hand.
No one knows what it is he is holding. He goes up to each person and asks, "What do you
suppose I have in my hand?" Each person imagines that the closed hand has in it just what he
desires most. They all hurry and run after the prankster. Then, when he has tricked them enough,
that they are following him, he opens his hand. It is completely empty! The same is true of the evil
one. He tricks the world, fooling them into following him. Everyone thinks that his hand contains
what they need. In the end, the evil one opens his hand. There is nothing in it and no desire is
ever fulfilled. Worldly pleasures are just like sunbeams in a dark room. They may actually seem
solid, but when a person tries to grasp a sunbeam they find nothing in their hand. The same is
true of all worldly desires.

Is there an idea of having an on-line sponsor?

Bardichev- You are awesome, man.  Somehow, you are able to convey the warmth, simplicy, and hope of chasidus on a reply.  How do you do that?  Where can I read your story?
Black Bigday