Dear fellow hopeless guy,

As a man of so few words, I must tell you that although I categorically deny the existence of heavenly background music (so we can put away our violins)...but: there has been a shocking change in the quality of our marriage since my sobriety and recovery started.

And we never went to a marriage counselor nor shrink to work on it, I never read any of those "37 seconds to a decent marriage" books, or anything like that - not that it may have helped, but I just didn't use them (yet). Yet the marriage has had a nahafoch'hu experience. Accidentally, apparently....typical of Recovery.

I was married and having occasional panic attacks. I was not only not so close to this woman, but I was often sure I had screwed up and married the wrong one; that she'd never satisfy me sexually nor religiously, nor intellectually; that we just didn't relate. I acted out like crazy for a decade of marriage, especially when i discovered that the marriage was not going to 'work' for me anyhow. My wife was a decent enough person - but not for me! I hated my existence and eventually hated myself. Everything was a waste.

I tried a shrink or two, (under the pretext of 'marriage counseling' - but I really wanted to just stop hating myself and compulsively acting out) talked to some rabbis, etc. never gave them the entire story, of course. Read many self-help books, Twerski, the whole nine yards. Even got frummer for a time. It all sucked.

So Q: What did I use?

A: I stopped masturbating, mainly. But:

Lu-yetzuyar that I was not an addict, but just had a schmutz habit and "broke it", clearly that would have done very little to convert our marriage into something living and beautiful. But since lust and my many ways of engaging and using it to avoid the pain and banality of my then-stupid life had grown to become the backdrop of my existence, I was out of control. I acted out with typical, progressive, and repeated patterns, suffered withdrawal, and shocked myself many times with "failed again!?", I decided I must be sick in some way: an addict. But I still could not imagine living w/o it.

Eventually, I had to (that's another schmooze).

For an addict to stay sober one day at a time - and maybe even die sober (after 120) he or she needs to have some sort of real change in how they live. 'Hanging on' for "just one more day!!!" is no solution, just postponement. It sounds nice, sounds like Torah-dikeh 'chizzuk', and sounds eerily like "one day at a time"...but that's not at all what it means, and it does not really work. The 'pressure' builds, and I would always lose..for one excuse or another (usually it was her fault :).

So I had to do something. Something real. I decided that since the only people I knew who were as screwed up as I - and yet were getting better - were in SA, I went there and followed their directions trustingly, that if it worked for them, it could work for me. I had already given up 'beating it', so I already knew that I certainly cannot again be trusted with fixing myself. And Hashem guided me to the right people and I followed their experience. Worked the steps and found my honesty, found Hashem (my own G-d), learned tools, and always got as much support as I reached for. And I started to change....accidentally.

The first year and a half were rough for us. I still lied a lot and got caught a lot, was unreliable and not pulling my weight at home very much (after years of practice at avoiding the wife and those pains-in-the-butt [children] I helped make, it was just second nature and difficult for me to even see what I was doing!)...and it drove my wife extra-crazy that I was going out to SA meetings 1-2 times every single week! ....Till she started noticing real changes in me. I was starting to grow up. It has not been easy, but it beats the heck out of the miserable alternative. And I was just trying to stay sober, that's all.

Recovery has great door-prizes. I just showed up, basically...OK, so I did a little work. But a lot less work that I had done to find porn and hide the masturbation and fantasizing and other behaviors I was busy with, and the pain!

Looked back at our marriage after a few years and discovered I was no longer gnawed with doubt over having married this woman. I found more and more peace in my life since then, b"H. Every year together has been better than the last. I am actually close to this woman and have discovered that she loves me. That was a shock, though I heard it often, I did not really believe it. Living with her is different. I do not deserve this, that's for sure. May He continue to give this to us to 120 and beyond, Amen.

And I owe it all (sort of) to keeping my zipper up (except when I have to go to the bathroom, of course... :o).

So much for 'a few words"  !

Hey dov
Will respond later in greater detail but simply put - u could be my twin or better (worse) u could be me. Every SINGLE issue you have I have gone through in one way. For a while my best friend was a little thing named xanax....

WOW!

Dov, This is the FIRST time I actualy printed a post which you wrote!!!!


[Take that as a compliment!]

First time? How sad.







So you thought I stopped picking on you?

I'm sorta stalking Yosef's posts...  ;D

  Me3 send him a buncha links you feel worthy of laminating.  There is about 3 on every thread, so it might take you awhile.

Brother, I switched to "digital printing". Yknow when you have no printer connected to your computer, and you click print anyway... it's free and 'virtually' unlimited.

dov wrote on 31 Mar 2011 13:21:


When did your wife find out?  or did she never find out?  I almost wish mine would catch me and I can be truthful with her.  It will help me figure out if she is really supposed to be my wife.  I have the doubts all the time that you had.  I have panic attacks and for a time was living on Xanax to help me get through my day.  Besides for all this, I have very little belief in God.  I was brought up in mainstream schools where if you were not part of a mold  you did not belong.  I was also always beliveing the rabbis who said if you do xxxx then you get xxxx.  That is not so.  I used to be a good jew and listen.  I still am good but do not see the point or where it is going.  I think I may be a non-beliver now.  I lust internally.  I was at a club ONCE in my life.  I have morals and values I just wish to be part of another life/society with the yoke of what I have been brought up with.  The good news is that I think I am too old to do such a thing.

Im so confused?!???!!!!!???

I think it may be beneficial to separate some issues into 2 different categories. The way I understand your posts, there seems to be an issue with Judaism in general and how you've become disenchanted, perhaps partially due to the conflict between the way you might have been brought up and the way things actually are. Then there is the porn (general category) issue. Now I say we should separate the 2 because I feel that they are drastically different issues. Even if there would be no halachic problems with porn, it would still be an addiction that I (we) hope one day to get rid of.

I feel that the main issue is the porn. After all, you've clearly been a "Judaism-practicing" man for many years (either with feeling or without) and a couple more months of "non-believing" wont really do much harm, and furthermore there is a good chance that once you sort the porn issue out, it may be easier to sort the religious aspects as well.  You should be commended, because you have come to the best place where you can regain control of your actions.

I apologize if I totally misinterpreted your remarks!

The way I see it, all my life problems are all offshoots of my one central addiction that controls me. I hope that by solving the main problem, it will be easier to work everything else out.