Dear Ano,

It's always very hard in the beginning. It can be excruciating. But it gets much easier if you hold back. "The less you feed it, the less you need it". See here for more on this.

I read somewhere that it's not healthy to start and then hold-back. Please don't start at all.

The images also will fade away from your thoughts the more you hold back. See this page for some chizuk and ideas on fantasies and images.

You are shaking the upper worlds with your sincere struggle!

what you are feeling is almost exactly what i felt when i first started - this forum only keeps 10 pages - it must be some time before that.but look at mevakesh - he asks you to write him privately!! listen to him - he'll be there for you just like he was there for me - speak about unbelievable!!!!

Practically, we can control our own minds.  Sometimes it's better not to close your eyes for an
extended period of time because that brings on the images. What works for me is the following.

Think of a "clean" pleasurable image of a place you've been or an experience that you enjoyed.
Concentrate on this image for a while with your eyes open or closed. Feel the feelings, see the
picture and hear the sounds all around you.

Now every time an old image comes up which you want to get rid of, simply replace it with
this good image. 

There is a trick to doing this called the "swish" technique.  I can tell you how to do it
over the phone if you're interested.  Just call the hotline at 1-901-685-3256.  I'll call you
back or if I'm home I'll answer the phone.

I did this 9 years ago after passing by a place I used to go into.  Now, even 9 years later
when I drive by, I remember my good picture and all the memories fade away.

If you can stand being on this computer any longer you can Google NLP Swish technique
and learn how to do it.

guardureyes wrote on 26 Nov 2008 15:15:


I can understand that it could be unhealthy because of the way it feels. Is it possible for you to find a source for that, and post it here? If I have a medical reason to hold myself back it will make the struggle even easier. Thank you!

Taken From Wiki.Answers.com

Is it unhealthy to masturbate then purposefully not ejaculate?

Yes, this may damage to the seminephrial vesicles. Probably also cause harm to the prostate.

I'm quite sure that I damaged myself physically by doing that.

About Elya's idea, I just want to add that I did something similar with a lively nigun. I think R' Nachman of Breslov suggests it.

battleworn wrote on 27 Nov 2008 12:02:


Why are you sure that you damaged yourself? Is there any physical sign of damage? Or do you just assume damage because you've done this so many times? I'm getting close to 24 hours of not touching myself (to stimulate) at all. You guys are the best!

There is a physical sign of damage, but I can't prove it's from that.

I spoke to Elya on the phone today for about 20 minutes. He was very nice, and I look forward to speaking with him again. @Elya: I forgot to ask you about that swish technique that you mentioned in your last post. I guess we'll discuss it next time. Thank you very much Elya!!

Well somehow I've made it for two clean weeks. I would like the third week to be free of any 'starting'. Every time I think of starting now, I think of little Moshe whose parents were brutally murdered by animals. His whole world was torn out from under him, leaving him orphaned of both parents. How can I willingly do something which may cause my children to undergo similar kinds of pain? The fire and brimstone doesn't usually do anything for me, but that may only be due to the people delivering those messages to me in the past. But when it starts in my own head it does help. I don't think a moment of pleasure now is worth exchanging for the suffering and damage it will cause me, my offspring, and the rest of the world in the future.

What you write here reminds me of what Jack posted today to someone else. Scroll down on this page to see what he wrote.

Remember, it's not just "FEAR" of the same thing happening to you that helps, it's also simply putting things in perspective. Like jack wrote. In other words, when you think of the pain of Moshe'leh and the brutal death of his parents for the honor of Hashem, your own pain at not giving in to the yetzer hara comes into clear perspective as "trivial".

I watched Moishe crying on CNN in my building and was heartbroken.  But I had to realize that
I cannot carry the burden of the whole world on my shoulders anymore and cannot let
resentments and anger spoil my sobriety.  There is a time for mourning and a time for joy,
but we don't have to let it lead us to acting out.  Then we've accomplished nothing but more
pain.

Elya, I think you misunderstood him. He is using the pain to PREVENT himself from acting out. That's fine.

I guess different people respond to things very differently!

Elya you misunderstood me completely as GUE said. It's amazing how the same event can have such a different effect on two different people!

My sincere apologies.  :-[