Silentbattle's quote from Dov



R' Dov, I'm not sure I get this. What do you mean He's not a superhero? Isn't that what feeling powerless and giving ourselves over to Him means? I'm guessing you mean that he's not like a Superhero who saves one from trouble in the nick of time. The troubles are really Refuah's (as you go on to say). At the same time, of course He has the power of a superhero and He is where we get all our strength from. Am I close?

sb, thats so true, we are not trully alive while involved with the drug, we are in an alternate reality which doesnt actually exist and real life just passes us by and moves on without us...

a scary thought... hopefully a sobering thought!

You might want to ask Dov through a PM, especially since he didn't originally post that here. I think, though, that part of what he meant is like this:

Superman appears from nowhere to help the helpless. In contrast, we're trying to connect with Hashem and always be close to him, always reliant on and aware of Him. It's not just a sudden cry for help, it's a relationship that we're constantly working on.

That said, I'll second your question - Dov, am I close?

Look at the context of that quote if you want to really understand where it was going...I don't really remember!

But the problem with a 'superhero' view of Hashem was first shown to me by Rav Noach zt"l, when he told the story of a bike rider who visited Aish once and heard a talk about what yeshiva is about: getting a relationship with G-d. He confronted Rav Noach and told him that if that is all yeshiva is about, then he, of all people, does not need yeshiva! For he already knows G-d exists and that He is all-powerful. He then described a neis that occurred for him once while biking - a real outlandish miracle that saved his life from a long fall. He had no doubts about G-d's total supernatural power, now...

Rav Noach's response to him was this: "If G-d is that powerful, then why did He allow you to fall off the cliff in the first place? Is G-d like 'Superman' who, shocked to see a horrible accident about to occur, desperately 'rushes' in to 'save the day'? That's just plain ridiculous if He is all-powerful, no? So....Why did he make you fall in the first place? It seems the Almighty really wanted your attention! He must want you to go to yeshiva to learn how to know Him!" Rav Noach knew how to 'go in for the kill', indeed.

The frum yid who sees a progressive, destructive, and insane addiction to lust as simply "a battle with the YH" may be relegating Hashem's role in the struggle to that of Superman: "Hashem has no plan here, I mean, it's bad, no? He is 'crying' when he sees me looking at porn, no? He'll do anything, just to not do that zera levatola!" - He just happens upon the poor yid and sees the guy is in a pickle, so He 'saves' him from the masturbation- if the yid is 'good' enough/tries 'hard' enough...Gevald. If I am really powerless, then I need Chessed, not s'char - I cannot 'deserve ' His help! That is why it is called, "Chessed". True, I need to be open to it, otherwise I'll throw it back every time...but it sure isn't based on my chastity!

....what about the cycle, the mental illness, the twisting of all my relationships and yiddishkeit into a knot with my lusting?! Nu. "You gotta believe" (hey, I'm a Mets-fan!). In other words, being that I am an addict, there is just no way that I could ever try hard enough - if there were, then I'd have quit years ago! So I need a gift. And I have to be ready to take it and keep it a gift.

To me, the other way - that if 'I only really try hard enough, I'll do it on my own' - is what the Torah calls "im tailchu imi keri"....pun intended.
It is taking G-d right out of the picture - and parroting the words, "I am doing it with Your help!", is just plain worthless.

Deeper: It's not about how the poor yid perceives the lust problem, or lust - it's about his entire perspective on his relationship with Hashem. To me, it is a childish understanding of G-d. But worse, it is the very understanding of Hashem that we used  in order to fertilize our addictive thinking during our teenage years when our problem (and often, our yiddishkeit) was developing! Thoughts like "He will definitely take revenge on me; I'll daven extra hard to escape the bad influence of my acting out; I'll be extra good to make up for it; I'll punish myself enough - so that He won't need to; and I am a hopeless rosho - human garbage," infected our developing yiddishkeit - and they do not go away easily. They became coping mechanisms for our acting out, itself. Pretty shocking, if you ask me.

All those dead ends made us miserable and desperate for the wrong things, like G-d's 'Favor'...kind of like a purely religious or philosophical struggle. It's really a cop-out, for all we really want is to escape paying any real price for our craziness. We do not absolutely need to stop till there is a real price to pay. 'Gehinnom' just doesn't cut it.

At their very best, these ways of thinking kept us , instead of Hashem, at the center of our lives and avodah. They caused us to need lust even more, because they made it possible to keep on going without paying any real price - whenever necessary, we just punished ourselves mercilessly with the whip of guilt...

Our castrated way of using yiddishkeit made it impotent as a sobriety tool, because it was part of the cycle! It was part of the problem, not the solution.

The Alter of Slabodka (I think) said that we need to spit out our "mothers' treifeh milk" - meaning, the old, childish ways we understood Torah - and relate in a mature way to everything we ever learned.

For me, this is a kiyum of his idea, and we need S"D to do it right.

(Hi! to the coolest ninjawarriordude!) 

Thanks, Dov - and hi, right back atcha!

Thanks Dov. I don't think I need to see the context to get your point. What you said now fits perfectly into the quote. Besides the fact that I can't find the original context when using the Search feature. Your perspective is beautiful. I've heard that story of R' Noach before but I was younger when I heard (ironically considering what you said) and it didn't hit home until you explained it now. I might have to start calling you Rebbi!

We all do! :D

Just wanted to thank everyone who joined last night - and everyone here on GYE, too, for being part of the system that helped me get to where I am!

SB, you are an inspiration.
Really.

Mazel Tov SB!!

you are truly an inspiration and a real force for the good here on GYE!
much much continued hatzlocha
zs

silentbattle wrote on 25 Nov 2010 06:14:

THANK YOU!

Thank you, ZS and 7up, for your kind words of encouragement. The truth is that i have no idea where I'd be right now without all of you wonderful people here on GYE.

A few thoughts. I was just thinking about the practice of counting days, and I realized there are (at least) 2 different ways of looking at it. One way is counting days, as if "seeing how far I can get." This seems, to me, to be a bad idea. On the other hand, there's a more positive way of looking at it - simply a way of keep track of an accomplishment, a way of seeing how much distance you have from the disease. A way of remembering how much of the impossible has occurred!

In other news, I was walking down the street, and saw a possibly triggering woman approaching. I could have looked away, but i decided that I wanted to put myself out of any position where I'd need to be powerful, so I took my glasses off until after I'd passed her.

silentbattle wrote on 28 Nov 2010 20:43:


Another way to look at it--how much time until the next GYE party!

;D :D ;D :D ;D :D ;D :D

Yes, that too!

After reading some posts in the ezras nashim, i was reminded of just how good hashem has been to me. After dating for years, I got engaged to the first girl I dated after i got clean. Coincidence? I don't think so.

Here's the key, though - i don't think that means that every single guy that's clean will immediately get engaged (although it will likely help, for a whole bunch of reasons, spiritual and practical), nor do i think that every married guy will immediately have yeshuos from any troubles he has as soon as he gets clean. I don't even think it will necessarily work for me (although I'm already clean, and hope to stay that way, so I guess i've used up that segula anyway, right? ).

What I need to remind myself is that when I work on myself and improve myself, Hashem sees it, and loves it. It makes Him happy. I may not always see the results in my life immediately, but the changes I make, the things i do, are important, and Hashem notices.

I'm not alone.

Hey SB,

Just curious, do you feel that you would have declined your wife for physical reasons prior to becoming "clean"? In other words, did you "compromise" in the looks department because of your "cleanliness"?