True.

I've noticed that I've been a bit more short-tempered and cranky. It may be the stress that I'm under overall (albeit good stress), it may be the fact that I've been rushed, it may be the fact that my eye is hurting...

But it's still not an excuse. Take slow breaths, thank hashem for everything, and be more patient.

In other news, had a sudden burst of desire (for self-medication) yesterday. Was actually kinda frightening. So I knew it was time to pick myself up and leave the room.

Whew.

Briut wrote on 25 May 2010 16:29:


OK, just stole this from another thread (Morshax's, on the "introduce yourself" board). I'm...impressed. Very.

This takes "one day at a time" to a whole new level, at least for me. Until now, the idea was, "well, you can't worry about tomorrow, you need to just focus on today" - because if i focus on tomorrow, I'll lose today, too.

This, however, offers a different perspective. "Worry about tomorrow? Who knows if this opportunity for growth will even be here tomorrow?! Seize the day, take advantage of today, because this is the only opportunity that you have for sure!"

So, when we're faced with a nisayon, think, "Who knows if I'll ever again have the chance to grow from a nisayon?!"

This can be applied to every area of avodas hashem, too...

I love it!

Don't say 'steal.' It's yours for the taking, Oh Quiet One.
(Plus, I hardly think it's a new thought! I just don't have a source to share like the talmedei chachamim on the site.)

I don't recall ever hearing that...I don't know if I can think like that all the time, but it's certainly a nice perspective to cultivate!

Well, one piece I can recall is that the Baal haTanya goes through (maybe chap 20 or so: any chabadniks here?) that when moshiach comes, our yetzer hara is just gone. Retired. Our only struggle is whether to DO good or NOT do it, but there's no more struggle of whether to do BAD or avoid it. In other words, there's no more free will in terms of doing a lav -- it's just not gonna happen.

This also means that there's no more schar for avoiding a lav, because there's no tayva, no yetzer hara, etc.

That's what gets me to the position that basically, our score on the lavvim is basically frozen once Moshiach arrives.

The rest of my words are mine alone and probably misguided [but I'm all I've got so I try to take care].  Does that help?

Hey, it worked for me even when it was just you saying it!

Of course, to a certain extent that's really just a more positive way of saying, do what you can now, because you don't know how long you'll still be around, having the opportunity to make choices and stuff.

So, definitely valid outlook, but your way seems to be more positive. Hence, for lowly people like myself, possibly easier to use.

Quotes:

"you can win any game you play - as long as YOU are the one making the rules.
If the YH what to play games so badly - agree, as long as you can make the rules."

"Mom had a good suggestion - possibly saying more of a blanket tefilah for all the women, without focusing on a particular one."

"Anyhow, how do we daven for them without obsessing over them even more, as you just said SB? I'd like to know. For me, it's mostly just --

"RBS'O, oy, how your creation has messed up. Look at her, thinking it's normal to dress/act/think that way. Look at the cable TV, putting such thoughts into her head. Look at her 'boyfriend,' conditioning his attention on her degradation. PLEASE, don't make us Yidden tackle a planet in such a condition. Help them gain some self-esteem and some knowledge of You. And help me stay out of their trap."

But Bards and Dov and others seem to say, "Hashem, let her be happy; let her be healthy; let her get that new job she wants, dress she wants, money she wants, etc."

What other options for tefilos exist? Which one is "right?" Is there a "wrong?"

And SB, since this is YOUR thread, what kind of tefilo would YOU be thinking about assuming you control yourself from a third glance"

OK, so even though the goal is kind of selfish (that I be freed of the need to be taken in by the image of that person and the fantasy it brings up for me), the actual tool here is changing my channel from taking to giving. It's not about distraction, per se.

The stuff I do (tools like davening for these people) is designed to change me a bit, right now in this moment, from a taker into a giver.

The assumption here is that a taker lusts (I guess we have all experienced the powerful self-centeredness that fills us in lust). It follows then, that a giver does not lust. True, I may still posses the desire, but if I am truly concerned for someone right now, I generally will not use them at the same time.

It's not about looking vs not looking, it's about being guided by and under the power of lust, vs freedom from lust - cuz I am different right now. Over time, the person who does this (initially crazy thing) becomes generally free of lust most of the time, even when triggers are present. It is turning the loss into a gain. And I assume Hashem intends no less for us to do with our temptations. After all, the addict's true relationship with Him is hiding right in the Lust. At least that's where I found Him! Where else does the alcoholic find G-d if not in the bottle itself, eventually? It is only through being beaten down by the bottle that the recovering alkies I know can find their dependence on their very own G-d.

To me, it's not about doing aveiros or not doing them, looking or not looking - it's about changing into to a different kind of person right now, through the temptation itself. Where else can we look for true growth?!

And what about the risk of ending up focusing on this person even more?

Ok silent batttle I will answer you

But but take it like
I say it (I'm very honest and not fluffy)

3-2-1 here goes

Number 1

Bards has close to 3000 posts not 1 mentions praying for her (if I ever said that pleaase send it to me I will stand corrected)

Conversely. I say "she may be a problem but she aint. YOUR problem)

I pray what chazal tell us to pray

Al tiviani lo liyidai nisayon vlo liyidai vizayon

Yes I can have in mind the  pain Hashmem has from the perverse world when I say viniya KULANU yodei shimecha

Do I pray for specific women that trigger me. ? Do I pray for jewish actresses or models do I pray for any one the YH tells me to pray for

GEHEnNom NO!!!

It is a way for me to hold on


Ayyy rebberebber=DOV

When I ever acheive a fraction of his bittul hayesh I will reconsider what I say

I emulate DOv but I am not ready to take the risk at this poin


I hope u undrrstnd
Me

B

Ah, Reb Bards, I apologize. Thank you both for teaching, and also making me smile at the same time!

So, do you have any suggestions?

Suggestions??

The whole GYE is a suggestion

Here is bards quickie


Prepare yourself before you head out

Look away

Don't frustrate urself if u do look just look away

Bite ur lip. Curl ur toes.

Sing a song in your head

Run on your merry way

KOT

(In short don't make a too big deal about it. Cool. Don't add life to it)

Barrrrrrrrrrrds

Referring to my black&blue post above:

I am not disagreeing with anything anyone is saying, and if what you or yenem are doing works, I am so happy. But I need to qualify:

If I would have ever experienced that davening for the woman would hold my lust for her in me for even one second longer, I would never do it. That's it. It simply does not work that way for me.

Now, if you don't really believe in a thing you are saying when you daven for her, I wouldn't use this tool. I have to actually care about her benefit for it to work. (And I do believe that Hashem wants us to care about everybody and every thing- by a yid it's just Kamocha. We see plenty people of chazal davening for/blessing trees, goyim, etc.).

Also, if you really can just look the other way and forget about her then I wouldn't use this tool, either. If you walked past her and she's gone, why start davening for her then? That'd be just plain silly, goody-goody behavior; and if I did that, it would certainly be just a trick to hold onto her image for longer.

A person needs to be honest with themselves, otherwise even fasting on Yom Kippur will lead them to aveiros.

That's all I've got. 

Thank you for your help, everyone - I'm going to think it over, experiment with what works best, and hopefully - continue to grow.

Or, to put it another way, continue to hopefully be less of an idiot.  :D

May I join you?

Too late...you didn't realize that I've been in the trunk of your car all along?

I think I'm going to work on thinking in learning, or something like that, rather than davening for the girls - at least for now. I think that's safer, for me.