Well your share tells me how ingrained this disease is within me, and i need to be extra cautious not to act upon my lust, not even an inch. It is a fight, that needs to be fought. otherwise i am a live Body with a dead soul. Thanks for the reminder. 

mikestruggling wrote on 02 Jan 2018 12:59:

Super post. Honest and human/vulnerable. We all should learn from Mike to recognize our weak points honestly and plan accordingly. Avoidance, surrender, fight - whatever mehalech works for each of us

tzaddik212 wrote on 02 Jan 2018 13:26:

1.
12&12 Step Two, p.27  
To acquire it, I had only to stop fighting and practice the rest of A.A.'s program as enthusiastically as I could.


2.
BB Working With Others, p.103  
Besides, we have stopped fighting anybody or anything.


3.
BB Into Action, p.84  
And we have ceased fighting anything or anyone -- even alcohol.


4.
BB Into Action, p.85  
We are not fighting it, neither are we avoiding temptation.

Hi Growstrong

I appreciate your references of the 12&12 that stress the importance of admitting powerlessness with this addiction, and i believe that this the essence of step 1. powerlessness ,means for me, that i cannot manipulate any sobriety, I cannot avoid it on my own, i need Hashem to guide me through this journey. What i meant with the term "Fight it", was that no mater what, i will not a/o. When i feel triggered i will not act upon this feeling, i would call up a friend or someone, i will surrender it, i will pray, i will check in myself and make amends. This is what i meant when i said i will fight it. And this is in congruent with the 12 steps. I hope i clarified myself. 

"V'chol ma'aminim she'Hu toiv lakoil, Hayoidea yetzer kol yetzurim"
There is a connection Hashem is good to everyone because He knows everyone's nisyoinos.
Thank you Hashem for loving me.

I am powerless over lust. I don't want to lust, contrary to what I think. Which is funny I'm convinced I want to lust and act out. If that were the case why do I hate myself for doing it? After all that is perfect self-care.
What I believe is that because I am powerless and my life doesn't make sense. I convince myself that I want to do it and that I'm not disgusted with myself. But ha'emes yoireh darkoi​ why don't I mind dying what happened to the natural self love ingrained in my psyche. What's happening is I'm hurting myself with each time I act out I send myself a message I don't like myself.
I'd better stop, right? I can't. That's where steps 2 & 3 come into play.
 Hatzluche

Hi I've been away I was doing first step research.
I came out that I am powerless over lust and my life is completely un manageable
sponsor says I need to make program part of my routine and new bottom line if I call phone line I lose my sobriety
hatzlacha

Hi haven't been here in a while
I listen to a lot of AA and SA talks. I like to compare the two programs and notice the difference. One that hit me very strongly was as follows the sobriety definition for an AA is no alcohol. Period. Very simple. There's no such thing as a slip while maintaining sobriety. However, in SA I can listen to phone sex (personally not anymore it's my bottom line), watch porn, lust heavily on the streets, flirt with women etc. and I'm not required to 'reset my clock" even though I'm -as my sponsor says- drunk like a skunk. That;s like saying to an alcoholic you can drink as long as you don't throw up.
The white book really says true sobriety includes "progressive victory over lust". I feel I'm struggling now with this not recognizing all lust hits as toxic.
Hatzlacha

mikestruggling wrote on 23 Jan 2018 16:51:

Thanks. You helped me realise that no sobriety definition is an ivory tower. It's possible something in the deeper subconscious; we can't put words to encapsulate it, but we know what we need to do and pray for the guidance to do it.

I was walking home today form yeshiva. A memory of porn came into my head the thought of making a call crossed my mind but I decided the thought didn't "hit me" strong enough to warrant a phone call. So I plugged myself in to a recovery talk and continued along my way. I found myself lusting and I couldn't believe it. I realized that even those "small" thoughts have to be brought to the light if I want to live "happy joyous and free".
The fellow I called told me that listening to a recovery speech without surrendering the thought is like toivel v'sheretz beyadoi.
Have an awesome day
hatzluche

nice
inspiring

Hi I had a question. I wrote a letter already to eventually show to my wife and I am willing to disclose to my wife (at the right time) if that's what I should do. However my rebbe said he wasn't sure it would be a wise idea. My rebbe is an extremely sought after mechanech he does agree that he doesn't fully understand our problem (addicts). On a personal level I wouldn't disclose anything without his permission because he put himself on the line when my mother-in-law called to ask about my meds. 
The question is if I am absolutely ready to disclose and face the consequences does it serve any purpose to disclose? 
If I am told that it is in my wife's best interests that I should not disclose (not my own addict mind's decision), is there anything to gain by disclosing? is it crucial? am I still considered hiding something?
Please do not tell me that I am still trying to hide because I wanted to disclose a while ago (to soothe the guilt, of course, but still) I was told not to. Additionally I was ready up until my rebbe said he would need to consider it first.

My humble opinion is that this question can only be answered by someone who knows you, your wife, and many other personal details. If your relationship with your rebbi allows for it, maybe suggest to your rebbi to consult with an addiction expert so that he can answer you with confidence. Hatzlocha.

From within SA and from my Rav and from the wise men of GYE, I heard the same response to this question.  DO NOT, repeat DO NOT disclose your struggle to your wife until you are sober a long time!  I was told that most women see our acting out the same way they would see our being with another woman.  We have already hurt our wives whether we/they realize it or not, but telling them without first recovering will in most cases only hurt them more.  Why make her suffer just because you think it will make you feel better, or possibly make you feel worse(I must be punished before I stop.)?  Yes, there will come a time, B'ezras Hashem, for you to tell your wife, but not today.  
Remember, it works if you work it, but you have to work it every day and every night. Because you are worth it.
Kol Tuv.
chaimyakov

chaimyakov wrote on 29 Jan 2018 22:13:

Just for the record, I've heard wise men on GYE say to tell your wife. Keepin' it from her can perpetuate the disease.

Personally, I'm not a fan of disclosin' to wife, but I'm not wise and I like hidin',  so my opinion should be discounted.