Habib613:

As much as your approach sounds like a great way to go about life, I thinkyou cant just sit back and expect Hashem to bring everything to you. I hope you do not get offended I would just like to defend my position and in order to do so I need to explain why its no the same as your position. You said, "Obviously Hashem doesn't think I'm ready because Mr. Right has not yet shown up." There's a concept that I really believ in called doing one's Hishtadlus. That is a very broad term that to many people means many different things. TO ME (not anyone else), I think it means going out and finding someone. I do not think Hashem is just going to bring Ms. Right to my doorstep when He thinks I'm ready to get married. I need to go out and find her in whatever way that is (shaddchan, etc.).

To everyone:

Thanks for the responses and to explain my point: I am not asking this question to know if I should date NOW, like tonight. I want to know if I get 30 clean and pure days, is that something I can build a relationship on. Obviously right now I'm not going out because I am only a mere 2 days removed from a complete fall. But say in 3 1/2 weeks IY'H if i'm still sober can I begin my search.

-INH

oh, i am doing hishtadlus.
been to shadchanim.
but i'm not doing any more than that.
that means that if a boy comes up, and he sounds normal, i'll go out with him.
but somehow, no shadchan has suggested Mr. Right.
and THAT is min hashamayim.

Rabbi Twerski wrote on this page:

In the case of alcohol or drug addiction, we generally tell people to avoid even getting into a relationship before one year of solid recovery and with the approval of one's sponsor. One month sobriety is hardly a beginning. There are many variables. How long was the addiction? Does the person still have urges?

So, besides for putting distance between you and the addiction (at least 90 days, for sure), there are many questions that need to be answered.
How old are you?
How many years have you had the addiction?
How bad did the addiction get?
How often did you act out?
What progress have you made?
What's your game plan?
Etc...

Good advice as usual from Harav Guard, this is definitly something to ask one's rebbe, and you must be extremely honest with yourself, although im not married yet, marriage is a huge step. You must feel comfortable saying to yourself "I feel comfortable enough with myself that I'm able  to raise healthy kids and have an honest sincere relationship with my soulmate".

Love u yeedle

Hi Habib613:

I appologize when you said that u r waiting for Mr. Right, I assumed u were just waiting in ur house hoping for no reason that he would come.

In response to Reb Guard I'll get back to you in email when  I finish typing it about myt life story. But to respond to Rabbi Twerski, I would venture to say that alcohol and drugs are on a completely different spectrum that addiction to pornography. Ive seen people who are addicted to these things and the way they act is much different because of their addiction. Their are more irritant, antsy, on the edge, etc. But a porn addict does not have these features (or atleast I dont). For me, a month is a huge thing (i know ur not belittling it). I had a month's streak this summer, 35 days to be exact, and I felt great. Happy all the time, more of a connection with Hashem, etc. I felt like a new person. So why not after a month build a relationship off that? From past experience, being in a relationship has helped me with my addiction.

-INH

Ineedhelp!! wrote on 14 Oct 2009 22:10:


There is a one thing that makes pron MUCH worse than drugs. It can distort your whole perspective on marriage. You will objectify your wife and you will loose sight of having a relationship. This site is full of posts from people whose shalom bais was ruined by their addiction

Ineedhelp!! wrote on 14 Oct 2009 22:10:


First off, INH, this is a great topic.
Some discussion has started on my thread about this topic.
rehab-my-site.com/guardureyes/forum/index.php?topic=616.msg23572#new

When you say it helped, what do you mean?
I get involved in my addiction when something is off.
I am filling a hole/need.
I can also have relationships that do that for me.
Common denominator is that the addiction is unhealthy
and so are the relationships.
I don't want to be using someone else to fill that need of mine.
I don't think that is what relationship is about.
So, great, being in the relationship makes me feel a bit better,
but if the relationship ends, which happens,
then, KABOOM!, my hole/need blows up in my face, big time.
I am talking from personal experience, not stam.
If I am really doing ok, I am not really dependent on anyone or anything on this planet.

I am not there yet either man,
and it is frustrating.
And I want help getting to that stage
and coping with not being there.
Maybe you are there,
but these are my thoughts...

kol tuv,

Sturggle

also, something I just posted in my thread...

Ok, so I think that if I would be dating now,
and something would work out with someone,
it would mean that we're in the same place as each other now.
If I don't like where I'm at right now,
then I don't want to find someone who is matim
to the me of now, b/c that's not whom I want to be with.

Make any sense?

Wise words...

Not sure when u say 'I don't want to be using someone else to fill that need of mine'.? are u saying its metter do act out than to no act out and have someone indirectly help u with that? Please explain.

-INH

INH, i think you're thinking in the here and now, and struggle is thinking about long term recovery.
in the here and now, yes it may be harder without dating.
in the long term, if you used a girl as your prop to hold up your sobriety, then if she leaves, you're left with nothing.

Dear Friend,

I hear what you are saying and logically it makes sense to me.  It really does ...

The collective experience of countless porn/lust addicts, however, paint a very different picture.

We all thought that marriage or a relationship would save us.  The hard facts, however, indicate that this is simply not the case.

We cannot look outside of ourselves for someone or something to save us.  Not a relationship, not a job etc. etc.

Rabbi Twerski advocates disclosure as his 50+ years of experience working with all addicts, not just alchoholics, has brought about the realization that addicts do not usually recover based on external factors.

I cannot tell you what to do, but I don't think you will loose out by listening to the sage advice of Rabbi Twerski or Rabbainu Guard or some of the other wise souls on this forum.

Wishing you well ....

Ineedhelp!! wrote on 15 Oct 2009 13:41:


i think Habib has a point about the here and now and the long term,
but if I am reading your words right, I think it's even more than that.

I think shomer and I are saying similar things.
shomer wrote on 15 Oct 2009 14:02:


i find that if I'm being fully honest with myself,
a relationship might help me in a way with my addiction,
but that is b/c the addiction, as has been discussed,
stems from a deep need that I'm trying to fill,
and now I am filling that need with another person through "relationship",
but is that really relationship?
what is relationship? me filling my needs?
using this other person to fill me?
im not there yet, not married or even dating right now,
but i dont think that's what it's all about.
better to act out? no. better to use someone else? no.
im not saying one is better than the other,
what is the better option?
i hope i am on the road to finding that out...

Very wise words from the the jetson.

I agree very much that the "need" cannot be filled by another person.
Just not gonna happen.
It's like a pit of quicksand.
And the girl will drown in it.
But,on the other hand,even normal people have that "need" to a degree,just not nerely as strong as we have it currently.
Once we tame the need till it gets to healthy level,we will be ready,iy'h
This is what I have been taught by my therapists.