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Coming out of my shell
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TOPIC: Coming out of my shell 1102 Views

Re: Coming out of my shell 13 Nov 2009 04:44 #28128

  • NotAlone
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Thank you for the thank you, but I don't really see why I get a thank you...
;-)

Anyway, I had a slip today. I seriously considered falling, but I got a hold of myself in time. Baruch Hashem.

It's disturbing to stare my inconsistent commitment in the face. The worst part about my times of weakness are that they are not triggered by any outside factor that I can avoid, just by mood swings (perhaps mood swings are avoidable, but I haven't figured out how that's done yet). I feel like I really don't want to participate in this fight, that the fight is pointless, that I should just give in and avoid the consequences. I have to actively remind myself that what I am considering is really a sin, and that besides that, it will destroy my life in a very mundane sense, and that besides that I would hate myself for falling afterwards, and that besides that I would inevitably go through another painful and rocky start of a teshuva process, and that besides that I would have another painful Yom Kippur, where I would have to take yet another horrible account of myself, and that besides that I would have to start counting to 90 again, and that besides that I would have to admit to my fall on this forum, and that all in all it would be insanely stupid.

When I put all that self-convincing together, it might work. No guarantees. Because my emotions are not rational, because, well, they're emotions. Which vexes me to no end. Which is yet another emotion. Argh!

Why can't life be rational?
Last Edit: by yossefh.

Re: Coming out of my shell 26 Nov 2009 19:42 #30717

That was Rivka's question, according to the Baal Hatanya.
She could not understand how a person can at the same time be a Yaakov and then turn around and be a eisav.
what kind of crazy person are we.

Then she was told that there are actually two opposite forces inside of us.

The phyiscal side simply is not rational at all. Learning disabled in this area.

I guess that is why we can't expect to just be rational and explain to ourselves once and for all that this is crazy and fugetaboutit.

The physical, crazy side is the bigger one. Rav.

But the tzair can subject it. Rav yavod tzair.

Only by trickery and appeasement, though. It does not seem that Yaakov actually ever tried to take on Esav. Just avoided him.

best wishes,
kutan




Rashi, Breishis (10:25)
Last Edit: by yissie.

Re: Coming out of my shell 30 Nov 2009 02:57 #31192

  • NotAlone
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Thank you for the dvar torah, kutan. It was truly inspiring...

Well, I've fallen a few times again, and have to start dragging myself out again... In this last series of falls, I noticed that I was not nearly as tempted as I was before I began my journey; the urge was perfectly controllable, but I was just too lazy to control it. It was not an overpowering addiction, but the same feeling I get before I take doubles at mealtime, knowing I shouldn't, and I can if I don't want to, but not really caring. I was overtaken by a sort of apathy to the worthiness of my cause. The falls didn't really disturb my healthy activities in life (except for a couple of wasted hours), and the garbage didn't even come close to it's former place in the constant forefront of my mind. Perhaps this is a sign that the addiction has weakened, and what needs strengthening is my resolve, or perhaps this indicates that the addiction is seated more deeply and complexly than I thought.

I'm going to operate on the assumption that I have an addiction. Self-diagnosing whether my behaviour, moods, and thoughts are due to normal teenage hormonal swings or to true addiction is insanely difficult. I surmise that by treating myself as an addict, at least to some extent, I will probably overcome any hormonal urges as well, while simply dealing with the urges as temporary may help if I am suffering a temporary suspension of sanity due to my youth, but such action definitely won't help if I am truly addicted.

So probabilistically, that makes sense, even though the "addict" method is a lot more emotionally troubling and difficult than the "Just control yourself a bit and it'll go away" method.

By either method, I have to reach 90 clean days at least. I guess it's time to stop philosophising about how I'm going to live life cleanly and happily, and get around to doing it.

Here I go again!  ;D

Last Edit: 30 Nov 2009 03:00 by mechinawales.

Re: Coming out of my shell 30 Nov 2009 11:12 #31215

  • the.guard
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Rabbi Twerski writes in this article how we can become addicted from even ONE viewing!
Webmaster of www.guardyoureyes.org - Maintaining Moral Purity in Today's World. We’re here on a quest ; it’s really all a test. Just do your best and G-d will do the rest.
Last Edit: by tb123.

Re: Coming out of my shell 02 Dec 2009 14:02 #31663

Hmmm, NA, your last report rings a bell... I remember seeing someone else with the same experience. Was it TrYiNg perhaps?

Like any good general will tell you, keep the momentum going!

I have found with myself that the GYE experience has brought me to new levels, that I would have only wished for in the past, but then I need to work again, at that level.

Make a 5 minute daily seder in the attitude Handbook. You will find that the YH will do all he can to discourage such a seder. But it is only 5 minutes, and there is really no excuse... and it will make a real difference.

Post on other's threads as much as your time allows, assuming you are on the web anyway. The more you give, the more it will bounce off the reflective surface of the monitor and back onto you.

B'HATZLACHA!

kutan

Rashi, Breishis (10:25)
Last Edit: by shmiel s.

Re: Coming out of my shell 02 Dec 2009 16:14 #31681

  • silentbattle
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Keep it up - and hopefully, coming out of your shell will be part of the process of coming out of your hell, and moving to a happier life!
Last Edit: by rerevere.

Re: Coming out of my shell 02 Dec 2009 19:34 #31717

Silent Battle, that was clever.
:D
Rashi, Breishis (10:25)
Last Edit: by shmutzig60.

Re: Coming out of my shell 02 Dec 2009 23:25 #31784

  • silentbattle
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Thank you  I tried to carefully read all the preceding posts to see if anyone had beaten me to it.

So, I finally checked out the rashi that, I presume, your username is based on. Nice. I'd be interested in hearing your thought process behind choosing that username...
Last Edit: by Z251415.

Re: Coming out of my shell 03 Dec 2009 03:15 #31821

  • NotAlone
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Thank you for the advice, kutan and silentbattle.
Well, I try not to stick around here too much (I don't like dwelling on the problem when I should simply be living without it), so posting all over the place isn't really an option; I read maybe two or three other threads when I come here, and usually have nothing to say, but I'll see what I can do about rereading the attitude handbook.
Last Edit: by agordan.

Re: Coming out of my shell 27 Dec 2009 00:17 #38175

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Well, I took a several week hiatus from the site after falling, until I could pull myself out again. Reading this site a day or two after a fall is often a trigger rather than a cure, because it makes me dwell on my problem, and leads  to the problem.

Quitting cold-turkey has not been working for me, so I'm taking a divide-and-conquer strategy. Namely, if I fall (though I will try not to) I will try not do it with p***. If the urge is overcoming me, I will leave the room and take care of it, rather than fall with my eyes as well.

Obviously, this is not ideal, but in my previous attempts what broke my streak was an overwhelming physical desire. I really didn't need to go back to the p***, but I did anyway, to feed the fire. If I can hold out on the first part until Pesach, then I will start a new 90 fully clean. I don't wish to count this progress on the main chart, but I will report here instead.

Is this an acceptable strategy? It seems to be like the "gradual" method in the handbook... I can't tell if my apprehension at allowing myself to fall to m* even in the plan of avoiding p***, and with an intention to cut out m* is caused by my y"t or y"h.

Any thoughts on this, R' Guard or others? 
Last Edit: by thedrummer9.

Re: Coming out of my shell 27 Dec 2009 01:44 #38177

  • elya k
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You're overwhelming yourself with goals until Pesach and going cold turkey.
Take it one day at a time. Before you go to bed at night say the Yehi Ratzon before Shema Al Hamita
with Kavanah.  Go over your day and figure out if you were resentful, angry, lonely, tired, or if you
owe anyone an apology.  Are you holding something back that you should tell or approach someone close
to you with?  What could you have done better today.  Figure it out, write it down, go to sleep after some
mental exercise.

Next morning, say modeh ani and the serenity prayer.  Pick a part of davening that speaks to you and
say it with Kavanah, having this disease in mind.  Ask Hashem to help you have the right thoughts and
actions all day - just for today.  At the end of the day, thank Hashem for keeping you sober one more day.

Go to meetings, get a sponsor, post to the forum, make phone calls. Get rid of your resentments.

Then you'll begin to come out of your shell for real.
Elya
Elya K was the first  GYE hotline moderator for couples struggling with Shmiras Eiynaim issues in their marriage.  Elya is the author of 6 books, among them Navigating the Phases of Sex Addiction Recovery, Help Her Heal with Carol Sheets,  Ambushed by Betrayal: The Survival Guide for Betrayed Partners on their Heroes’ Journey to Healthy Intimacy with Michele Saffier. 


FREE EBOOK ON THE GYE SITE AT: Mask In the Mirror (guardyoureyes.com)

Elya K. has been coaching people worldwide for over 10 years for Shmiras Eiyanim issues. 
For a free 15 minute consultation call 901-248-6001.
Last Edit: by DeletedUser10574.

Re: Coming out of my shell 27 Dec 2009 04:07 #38183

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I appreciate the concern, R' Elya, but I am certainly not overwhelming myself. My current plan is actually rather lax considering my previous successes. I know that I am capable of fulfilling it based on my prior performance. What happens after Pesach, we shall see.

Regarding taking each day on its own: Of course a spiritual enlightenment is part of the daily healing process, but I know that if I have to re-make the decision to be clean each day, there will be days that I make the wrong decision. Without a structured plan, I can't guarantee (or even wager) that I'll stay clean for any given period. There WILL be days that I feel depressed, tired, or disheartened, and will be willing to throw my work to the winds. Such is the nature of living. However, when I have a medium-term plan, I tend to follow it simply because I am compelled to complete my work, and the level of disenchantment that it takes for me to throw it off is much higher.
Last Edit: by airwalk.

Re: Coming out of my shell 27 Dec 2009 06:26 #38198

  • Kollel Guy
First of all WOW. You are the wisest 17 yr old I have ever heard of. When I was 17 I didn't even understand enough to really care.
Secondly, these dialouges you seem to be having with the y"h are no-good. Don't talk to him. If he want's to talk to you while your clean - he can only discuss the topic of it's severity. After a fall - that's when he can discuss how it's not so bad.
It sounds like you have very typical feelings and inclinations. These can be extremely difficult to control at your age, and therefore I think it is irresponsible for you to rely on just will alone, and 'play it by ear', meaning have the battle when he approaches you. That's like spending money on your cerdit card and saying "When the bill will be due at the end of the month, then I'll work and make some money". Your main work is prevention, not actual fighting. The fighting will be there regardless - believe me, there's no way to avoid it completely. What you CAN do is fight from afar. And this is how people succeed in winning this fight. This is how you can derive the strength to overcome the urges when they do attack.
The kotzker said "If you wait for your y"h to approach you - you don't stand a chance. If you initiate the battle, then you might win".
Hang in there man, you are very fortunate to have found this site at such an early time in your life. Most people have to wait till well in their 20s to find out that there is such a thing as an addiction. Take advantage of the gift H-shem gave you and use it for all it's worth. On this site there are the tools which will get you out of your situation... If your willing to use them.
Oh, and if you think the after-feeling is bad NOW, just wait till after your married.

Hatzlachah rabs!!
Last Edit: by theloyalwife.

Re: Coming out of my shell 27 Dec 2009 06:30 #38200

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Reb Lo Levado (a.k.a. - Not Alone) - First of all, it's great to hear from you again!

Second of all, I'm glad to hear that you're still working on growing, and still planning victory!

However, I don't think the idea of "one day at a time" is about deciding each day to make a new commitment to being clean. I think it means that when you're faced with a nisayon, instead of thinking, "I can't do this, I have to be clean for the next 3 months," you say, "just for today." Or if that's too much, even "just for one hour." And then, an hour later, hopefully oyu've already moved on, or you can try to push it off again.

There are three major advantages to this strategy, that I can see (more experienced people can probably mention more). 1) it breaks time down into manageable chunks. Otherwise, we can think, "whoa, I can't hold off for 2 months!" But "just till tomorrow" works a lot better. 2) even if, after that day, you fall, you pushed it off for one day. That's one day without this huge aveirah, and the amount of kedusha that you bring into this world is beyond imagining. And 3) Even if, Ch"v, we fall, we know that we didn't just blow everything - we blew this one minute. But now, it's another minute, and we have another minute to be strong in, with hashem's help.
Last Edit: by awesome1234.

Re: Coming out of my shell 27 Dec 2009 06:35 #38201

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Just to clarify - making a long-term plan is good, because it's a long-term battle. But on the day-to-day level, we can say, "one day at a time."

KG - I think he already has a plan of what he's going to do when faced with a nisayon.

I should mention, though, that you might want to try also having a plan that will lead to you being clean, and then have the "plan B" of going into a different room.

As with any plan, try to visualize yourself succeeding, getting up and leaving the room, and hopefulyl doing something else. the more you picture that success in your mind, the more likely it is to happen.
Last Edit: by ushermeisels.
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