I just had a fall and I need help getting out of it. It's so frustrating I had been going strong for over 3 months and then all the sudden it took over me. It's like I don't have any more strength and I really want to get out of this addiction mode but I don't know how. I did the 90 I read the guide, I just don't know what other "water" to drink. Please send all your advice because I really want to "break free" and please realize that I am not a newcomer here. I need the mussar and the chizuk!

Evedofhashem25,

Perhaps I'm not the best person to be offering advice because I've just fallen twice in the past two weeks over something as trivial as a woman's fashion catalogue. And, I'll soon be starting my 7th year of recovery, so no matter how far into recovery we are, we always need to be on guard.

My recent experience may help you because, like you, 'all of a sudden it took over me too'. It all started with 'wow' and curiosity mixed with lust. I was intrigued so I had to check out their website too. Then more 'wow' and it just became more and more lusting, and then titillation and just pure lusting for pleasure. And it all happened in the space of a few days. At first I could stop, but the more I looked the fiercer my passion became until my desire was so strong I just could not stop looking and just pounced on a popup. The result......falling at night in bed. IDIOT. Apparently, every time a man looks at impure images, a spirit of impurity

The only real chance we have (which I get reminded of by falling hard if I don't keep myself on track) is to avoid the schmutz in the first place. I assume you're probably young and unmarried, so we have no healthy outlet for our sexual energies. Seeing scantily clad or naked women is going to have the effects that God intended, and once we're in the situation it sometimes takes superhuman strength to pull ourselves out. The sensible and indeed the only way is to sidestep the battle and to avoid taking the first drink.

For me that means going back to my original golden rules of no touching my willy and no bikini or lingerie pictures, Victoria's secret etc let alone anything harder. That formula managed to keep me clean for 5 months at a time.

The second hardest thing is not getting depressed and mad at yourself after falling. Got to keep in mind that before a fall we have to do EVERYTHING to prevent it from happening, but after it happens we have to accept that God wanted it to happen. To teach us, humble us, deepen our repentance who knows. We do know that being happy isn't always easy, but being depressed doesn't do us any favours at all. So the sooner we move on and get out of the rut the better we will feel.

I wish Bardichev was here to slap me with one of his FELL SCHMELLs, crank open a bottle of Woodford, slap me on the back and say keep on TRUCKING son, GOD loves us.

Hi Eved and DL,

Sorry to hear of your falls.

DL, the best advice comes from someone who's been there... You've pretty much written out the right lessons to take forward. Avoid and avert from the small tests before they become big ones. Keep a good attitude and don't get depressed. Know that Hashem loves us and that it's all part of His plan for our growth.

KOMT!!!!

Gevura!

Thanks so much for the advice, it's so hard not to get depressed but I will really try to have a good attitude. It's just that I put in so much work till now and I feel like it all flopped. Just really want to push to the top of the ladder and it felt like I was pushed down now I have to struggle to get up those stairs again

GUITAR

HellO, dear Eved.

Did you listen to the shiurim of r. Shaffier and rabbai Reisman? they are advertised on the very first page: www.guardyoureyes.com/ />
And, just to share some experience, I found, that if I am NOT reading some of the chizzuk eMails, or recovery stories or tips and tricks or the handbook or epes on this topic I AM very likely to fall rachmona latzlan.

Like reb Mottel said once (bechochmosoy) "you dont have to read it (this kind of literature) each day. just on those days on which you wanna stay clean" (epes asoy, dont remember exactly.)

So, what do you think about a commitment of let's say 15 min of such literature each day?

chatzlocho, r"t

Eved, another vort that I read is that every time we say NO to the YH we gain a victory that is deposited FOREVER in our spiritual bank account. Apparently, angels are created too that help us to break free and when we have said no enough times then the army of angels becomes strong enough for us to break free completely from that test. Think of the numerous times that you successfully managed to stay clean before your fall and be proud and happy about them.

Stay focused on the BIG PICTURE. More than 90 days clean and one where you fell. It doesn't take a genius to see who's winning. 90 days where you starved countless Klipahs and demons to death and liberated countless holy souls from captivity. That equates to you wiping out a mighty army for the loss of a few divisions.

Sometimes it also helps for us to look at falls as BLESSINGS IN DISGUISE. For me a fall is often caused by being overconfident, which leads to being lax with my boundaries and fences. Use this fall as an opportunity to evaluate what led to this fall and how you can prevent it in future. Ultimately, we are fighting a war and there's no better teacher than a baptism of fire. It is only because of a fall such as this that will allow you to grow spiritually, devise countermeasure and weapons of defence and offence so that you can smash the enemy next time you engage on similar terms. Then you can go up another step on the ladder. It's a bit like learning to ride a bike as a kid. You wobble, sometimes fall down and bloody your knees but it's all part of the learning process. The key is not to cry forever and become too scared to get back on the seat and keep on wobbling forwards.

Right, I'm getting tired of the sound of my own voice so tara for now. :D ;D 8) ??? :

DL

Thanks Gevura appreciate the Chizuk mate!

Just like to share the good news that I'm starting to do what I thought I didn't really need to before. Instead of checking if a girl really is inappropriately dressed online I'm learning to ignore it. Plus the same popups are tempting me again. They still look amazing, but I'm internalising that the only way I can win is to avert my eyes, let go and let God.

BW,

DL

These days I am doing cognitive therapy, so let me offer my take on this in the light of that approach.

The problem is the belief of powerlessness. A central concept of cognitive therapy is that behavior precedes cognition. In other words, you have deep-seated secret unconscious thoughts that create your feelings. If you have a thought that being powerless makes it okay for you to act out, you will act out and you will also get a feeling of powerlessness. You get conditioned. Eventually it's just automatic.

If you do not in some way attack this unfounded belief that being powerless makes it okay you will always be an addict and always being in danger of falling, regardless of how long you're sober for.

To learn how to change your beliefs that are no longer to your advantage you can read "Feeling Good" by David Burns.

In no way am I being contentious here. I am merely sharing my very limited, very one-sided, personal experience and bringing up another perspective on the "powerlessness" thing. I and may others have found that used properly, it is the most powerful tool they have for sobriety and recovery. So, be"H:

1- I am an addict and can explain to anyone exactly what I mean by that. And I am powerless to control and enjoy lust. And I am sober for many years one day at a time, be"H.

2- My SA sponsor told me that "once an addict always an addict" is simply not known to be true - it is only an assumption most of us recovering addicts make in order to have a better chance of remaining humble and honest with ourselves. And it helps us remain sober by helping us take fewer risks (gayvoh of course leads to risk-taking - go ask your nearest invincible teenage boy!). It also helps us question our motives rather than making excuses for taking 'certain liberties'. It works for us, so we use that adage - even though we do not know it to be true and never will. In a way, it's a matter of 'faith' - there is evidence, so we believe it to be true, but do not claim to know. So we do not throw it in anyone's face. Saying we know it to be true would be just hubris, as far as I am concerned. One needs to be a little humble about humility, you know, if one needs to keep it...

So I understand well why people would rightly be insulted and upset about those pompous recovery guys (and I mean that seriously) who throw that line at them: "You are always going to be a powerless loser against lust!" Gevalt. How do they know? Maybe this guy is not an addict to begin with! And maybe some addicts are healed and can regain the ability look at porn a little, or masturbate a little, or voyeur a little, and get away with it without getting all consumed by it and out of control. For that is the opposite of what being powerless is, right?

True, Hashem tells us it is very bad for us and for the world when we c"v do these immoral things - and that is what He made Teshuvah for! But all that is for the normal people. Addicts usually come to see that there is no "Teshuvah" that will spring them from this terrible bind they are in. We usually come to see that there is no evidence that we will soon be able to use, enjoy, and control lust - all our personal experience indicates is that it will always overcome us and mess our lives up somehow. And I wager that if our wives knew all the extent and details of our stories from the beginning, they would emphatically agree with that!

An addict who has Step 1 knows he needs to stop because he needs to stop. Not because it is an aveiroh - but because he cannot successfully control it (like normal people can) and he cannot successfully manage his own life any more.

Not so for the average frum, guilty masturbater. He may not be an addict at all - so how the heck could we throw "powerlessness" at him? It's irresponsible and irrelevant. And nederman is right in that it can be damaging for a non-addict.

3- The adage "Once an addict...blah, blah", is also poweful tool for the typical new guy who gets a week or 90 days of clean time and keeps losing it because he goes and figures he is "better now" - he really does feel powerful, healthy, healed, etc. and that's great! - and he acts out. This happens all the time - just look at how many guys say exactly that.

I say that this happens simply because by "I am healed" or "I am no longer an addict" the fellow actually means that now he is normal. And the truth is that normal guys are able to look at porn a litle and not have dire consequences. Normal guys do not perpetually end up masturbating over it, or having an affair over it, or end up driving around following women a little here and there (again!) for the next few days over it, or whatever. It does not become an obsession. But he does. That's not normal.

4- And Hashem in His Torah repeats over and over that we as Jews - all Jews, even non-addicts of course - are to accept that we cannot manage our own lives. Dependence on G-d is perhaps the most important basis of Yiddishkeit. Dependence that leads to empowerment. Dependence with bitachon to try, and try hard. To fight hard because we know He will help us and that He is in charge so it'll be OK. So AA did not invent this basic idea of the 3rd step.

5- I know that I cannot afford to act out my lust, and can explain why I can't, to anyone. And it has nothing to do with issur or the Torah's halachos.

6- In 15 years of practicing and sharing my recovery in SA, I have never met a single addict in recovery who has sanctioned or excused his acting out because of an acceptance of his powerlessness, b"H. Many explain their failures that way - but none say, "well, then I guess it's out of my hands," or, "I therefore bear no personal responsibility for my actions." Gevalt. For if they did see it that way, why would they still be coming to SA meetings any more in the first place? Plenty guys drop out - most, actually - and the guy who keeps coming back must still think his behavior is very wrong and still be trying to discover how to stop, no? SA's White Book reads that "the only requirement for membership [in SA] is a sincere desire to stop lusting." - not "a sincere desire to accept that we are excused from responsibility because we can't stop anyway."

7- It is not OK to use porn and to masturbate, for many reasons. But the only reason that really matters is the one that gets a guy to stop.

So if cognitive therapy will help you stop - GO FOR IT, MAN!!

But what is this fellow's motivation to quit, really? I think it matters. If it is because the damage of doing an aveira pains him more than he can bear, then I understand fully and can relate fully and he could use the 12 steps just fine. But then I expect he feels exactly the same way about any serious aveira, not just a sexual one...

There is no single, supreme way to get 'better', or recover, or whatever we want to call it. And there is no homogeneity of GYE people. GYE is for many to come and share, and I just want to point out that there are other ways to view the "powerlessness" issue.