Very true, life is very much more exciting, and bh my life has lots of what to offer.

but there's a great amount of intensity and energy which viewing p* and m* and the self abused brings along with it, when I withdraw from those acts it creates a void which needs (i could be wrong) to be replaced, no? 

Maybe that's the idea of helping others that struggle with the same nisayon, doing so it channels the same energy in a positive way.

no, I'm not looking for the guilt feeling, I'm not looking for the self abused feeling, what I'm searching for is to replace the negative energy that it brought along with it, that it shouldn't create the void which heaven forbid can lead me back to those same acts.



thanks in advance for ur reply.

Michael94 wrote on 14 Jul 2017 15:46:

This is not my experience
life is very much more exciting
my suggestion is to get to a life of sobriety
and then work it out
shabbat shalom 

Now for KOMT, 
how can I channel the enormous amount of energy I used to have in my actions off viewing p* and m*? 
And living a sober life will not satisfy me, that only helps for the first month or 2 maybe 3 when I still have vivid memories from the pain and anguish I endured but when that fades off, my body my thoughts are searching for that adrenaline spike, any advice guy?

a good shabbos folks, and stay clean, one thing for sure only for one clean shabbos dayaimu! 

thenewme49 wrote on 13 Jul 2017 15:37:


On many occassions when I tried to stop I was very much so watching my eyes and thoughts. For an addict it won't help. Do you use the word colloquially, like "I'm addicted to pringles?" Or is it the real thing? Also, congrats on opening up with the wife, but some say that's dangerous and could be selfish if it's just to her. You have a rabbi or therapist you could open up to, too, who would better be able to guide you?

ColinColin wrote on 14 Jul 2017 03:19:

Now now, you know how our program works.

One Gilgul At a Time

Welcome, michael. We haven't formally met. We might never. Probably only through this forum. But KOMT!

I wonder what things have been transpiring in my long absence. I'll give a breakdown of things that have transpired for me.

First of all, I love you all. 

So, I got a "warning" at work that were I to do that again (looking at porn on some youtube alternative website) they would take action. The next day, I was summoned once more and told I was actually going on a paid suspension until the next Tuesday. We were on Erev Shavuos so I wouldn't have been at work much anyway. They needed time to make a decision. So needless to say Shavuos was more an anti-Shavuos where I was in more-or-less catatonic state at home, venturing out once to have second day lunch at a friend of my wife's. 

My greatest pain was that my wife didn't know what went wrong. What I did. I told her it was a misconduct, coupled with the uncertainty of the position in the first place (read my story from start to finish for full pshat). She knew about 12-step meetings and how (and she commented too) they greatly improved my life and aspirations and reactions to reality. But on Second Day, 7 Sivan, I told her about my addiction and just why this was all happening. We had a long talk. a good talk. she told me I was sensitive, caring and mindful of her through the whole conversation. I made it not about her. Just that my mind was warped and I was diseased. I was afraid she'd take me as a fraud. A fake (see Dov) and not who she wanted to marry. But she didn't. She loved me wholeheartedly and the fact I was actually doing things to recover was the real clincher. We grew very much closer that day. She knew my darkest secret.

It was good timing, too, because the very next day we had a healthy baby boy, BH. I don't think the conversation would have gone down as well for her if we were in Niddah. It was a God-given opening for a crucial discussion. And perfect timing.

Shavuos for me was just about surviving from one minute to the next. The next week was such an influx of emotions, the joy of the light amidst the darkness, our son, versus the trauma of the work stuff. I remember driving to that meeting the next tuesday, I could hardly breathe I was so stiff with fright. Would I still have a job? What would I do? How would we survive? Would my wife forgive me?

They agreed we part ways, the business and I. And they agreed to pay 3 months' salary and 12 therapy sessions. I got into a morning kollel for 2 weeks and night seder. After so many months of tension, of feeling I wasn't even needed at the job, of the fear of inadequacy, I could finally exhale. Now I realise the brocha. I wanted to leave. I really did. But I was scared. And this is how it happened. Not to say what I did was right, but I feel God really loves me. I know, it's a given.
So the learning went into bein hazmanim and it gave us a chance to just relax, after all this. I was home all day, we did cool things as a family and Hashem blessed us with an extremely short Niddah period, too. Weird. Bein hazmanim non-Niddah with three kids under 3. Fantastic. Therapy opened me up to my suppressed passion for life and I finally got around to things I had wanted to do for years, like getting my bicycle fixed and selling mayonnaise! Well, I've only sold one jar so far, but I hit the goldmine on the flavour.

I did act out at some point. The week after the bris. Three times in quick succession. I got sick again. I went to the doctor, broken, asking him (supported by previous advice) that he give me anxiety medication. Just to get through a day. He did and I started to feel it. I'm a lot calmer, no matter what has happened and I haven't acted out since.

Two days before Yeshiva began again, I got a job and I started the day Yeshiva started so it was a brief 2-week learning stint. So here I am, same environment, same pitfalls, but a new opportunity.

I scrapped my smart phone and got a smarter one, with just phone and sms. I cancelled my internet at home; if anything we have my in-laws' wifi and my wife's phone which is monitored. But here I am at work again, with those same wafting ideas in my disturbed head.. Nothing will stop me but myself. Nothing will work but rigorous adherence to the program and massive character development and growth.

I have been slacking a lot in my religious activities. Night seder started up, but my minyonim attendance is quite minimal. I don't know why. I'm still dealing with a lot of acceptance issues, especially in our kehilla. Even though we now have a unifying Rov, it still feels quiet, I still feel distant. Also from doing nothing to a full-time job is a big change. I need to breathe, re-orient, and not feel bad for these things. Massive life changes are hard. A new kid, a new job....

I really want in life to be a good husband, father with lots off little kids just running around all the time, churning wherever we live, full of life, happiness. I think I am achieving that. My real dream. I am so grateful to God for that.

Thanks for hearing my rant. Hope to be a bit more active now. Thanks for all your support so far. 

It has been said we are the generation of people for whom Tikkun of our souls has failed in all previous gilgulim, because we were the most depraved.
So our challenge is Tikkun of our souls.

Chazal say one is reincarnated to rectify a certain few sins or one sin...the one we have a prediliction for.
In our case it is lust....our mission is clear!

I can totally relate to the nekuda of mesiras nefesh which this struggle entails.

Well why do I want to be sober, it is in onder to continue with life (in order to live with today and all what today has in store for me), why does a ill man want become cured, it's in order to continue functioning in life, no? 

But somewhere deep down we know that all this (the nisayon of shmutz) has what to do with our mission on this earth and how this nisayon accieve just that.

how many of you here are dealing with mental health issues like anxiety and depression? i think lusts and these addictions can go hand in hand with these problems; one can cause or perpetuate the other and visa versa.

for me personally, i've had anxiety problems as early as 7 years old, depression since 12 years old and they only got worse over the years to the point where i haven't been able to work or go to school for the past 4 years. i've been trying to get treatment over the past 10 years but nothing has been dramatically effective.

medications can help some people deal with the symptoms but i think it's a misconception that meds are a magical cure. i have not had good experiences with meds. they only make me feel worse. talk therapy like CBT or mindfulness is the most helpful but it takes time, work and you must be working with a skilled therapist regularly for it to work. PLEASE KEEP IN MIND I'M NOT A DOCTOR OR THERAPIST, don't take my advice literally because everyone's situation is different. the above is just my own personal opinion based on experience. 

and how can these issues be addressed from a spiritual perspective? i'm only a beginner in orthodoxy, i grew up secular but even learning through shiurs online, i've heard saying Krias Shema for example can protect anxiety or depression among other things.

I read last week from the bialle rebbe on parshas Korach that our tikkun in this generation which is the last generation before Mashiach is unity.
Yes the satan is fighting his last fight, but he doesnt need to work very hard, society is doing all the hard work for him.
My understanding is that Mashiach will come when all the babies that we need to bring down to the world are born.
My personal torah is that mashiach is delayed because there are still holy brothers and sisters who dont know what Shabbos is yet and Hashem wants as many people to feel shabbos as possible.
Do i think i am bringing mashiach by staying sober? No i dont... Do i have more of a chance of meeting him when he comes? Yes hopefully.. I want to meet him. But its not why im doing it.

Many great people from our generation have stated that this nisayon is the final one before Moshiach. Seforim from hundreds of years ago describe our generation, and state that "in acharis ha-yomim, out of desperation to destroy klal Yisroel, the satan will take out all his tools of impurity and attack our people with them." We at GYE are rising to the challenge and not giving up. Even when we have a fall, we don't despair and keep on going. This struggle is a form of gog umagog in each one of us. Like the salmon swimming upstream, we are going completely against the very strong current of immorality which has become completely acceptable/normal by society, and even government. Our mesiras nefesh as a tzibur and as yechidim is bringing Moshiach.

GYEBen wrote on 12 Jul 2017 07:08:

Love the first line. So true.  Yet true commitment can be so elusive to an addict.

Controlling lust is another story. For me it's a fantasy.
My only control of wanton lust is to avoid it.
I'm not referring to appropriate desire for my wife.
I'm talking about lust.

Looking forward to hearing of your success

Hello Daniel, and all friends here at GYE.
You ask an excellent question. Certainly what I need is DOING something about it.
As I was told - the issue I am trying to solve is a practical one - I've been DOING things... so the solution must also be practical - physically DOING other things to try and counter the action.
So, the first item on the list was to re-register on GYE. Done.
Now, registering is fine, reading around is great... but my own experience proved me that this is far from enough. GYE is providing a rather large set of tools - I decided to try all and see what fits.
Item 2 - forums - here I am, writing about myself, writing about my challenges and sharing.
Item 3 (i'll stop counting...) - I got myself a partner. We have exchanged emails... We have a lot in common and we start bonding... that's a good point, since this is a real person.
Next... I joined a 12 steps phone group... that's an experience I feel is very helpful!
Next... well... the 12 steps are not just nice words put together, I am working my way through the steps. Some of them I think I understand well, some other will require some deeper enquiry, but its battle plan (sorry for the military terms... I am quite extensively military trained...)
And of course, I started listing my arsenal of tools and 'things that work for me'.
A there are quite a lot, but I am aware that most of these are tactical weapons - good for dealing with a impulse to act out or a specific behavior that needs correction or eradication.
I must deal with all the situation at a strategic level - what changes and remedies I need to take upon myself in order to succeed in changing my life.
Going over the GYE site teaches me a lot.
The 90 days chart is a great tool, I think - never mind what some of the more serious people around here are saying about it.
I went over the board - and I understood that you - and many others - are right. The board in itself cannot be THE goal. Making it to 90 days or even more is not the issue. BUT it is one of the tools I can use to quantify the short term practical results.
I learn from  the board some very impressive things.
First of all - honesty. Some Haverim here have long long streaks and an impressive track record and still have the courage to go back to the bottom of the board. 1 day.
Secondly, it teaches clearly that just abstaining and waiting for the count to grow and the medallions to be awarded is not enough. Because doing so will for sure result on being on the board forever, going up and down... that will not work for me.
I reached such a situation that requires deep treatment. 

Introspection and reflexion are other tools I apply nowadays. Being honest with myself.
So - the first result is that I don't lie to myself anymore - I have a SERIOUS problem, I am sick - I must take care of myself or I will continue hurt myself and my loved ones and Am Israel in ways that will have no coming back from.
But I also found out something which left me amazed. I understand today that my recovery process started at least ONE YEAR AGO.
True, I am using the right words - sex addict, therapy, 12 steps... - only for a few days. But I am conscious, at this level or another, of my situation for years, and I wanted to solve it for a long long time, but never really did something about it. Or did I?
One year ago, I changed job. Voluntarily. I quit my last position - in spite of real effort from my employer's side to keep me in the team - and took a new and fresh start in a completely different branch of business. That was a gamble - fo rthe time being paid off in more than one way.
My new work environment is much better for my recovery. For many reasons I wont detail here now.
And that was the occasion for several other changes - dramatically influencing my way of life, which eventually led me to this stage of actual actions to recover from my addiction.
It might seem superficial - but I changed my haircut. Or rather, I stopped cutting my hair altogether. I was used to very short trimmed hair since my days in the army... now I am going around with curls like a hippy from the seventies - and feel great about it.
Then, I changed my name. Well, not really changed my name but I changed the name used by all my fellow workers. Once again, a leftover from my army time - I went from Benji to Binyamin and once more... feel great about it!
My new job, in contrast to what I did in the last 25 years, does not require me to travel abroad so often (I used to be half of the time on airplanes, hotels, etc...) So my mileage status went down from Platinum frequent flyer in 4 companies to being just a simple mortal occasional traveler... and my life improved dramatically!
I can have a normal life again! If I only want to, and now, I do.
Regular hours, same minyan every day, I registered at the gym and I workout (very) regularly.
All that was actually setting the stage for my recovery.
So, OK, I am far from being done. But yes, I DO, and I will continue doing with your support and the teachings I learn here and in other places.
Braha VeHazlaha to all of us!
Ben

And to clarify that this is not a theoretical question rather a one which has to do with our fundamental belief, and therefore in the past it has costed me and added to my addiction which in a way i was saying that anyway I'm a lost case, just look at it that when moshiach will come ull have all those pious jews and ull have all those which couldn't even make through the door step.

Hashem help me, i see u writing that we are the ones that will bring moshiach.
i had and still have somewhat of a nagging thought that what will happen when moshiach come and see us with our pants down  but as u put it it's our fighting this struggle which is our generations nisayon that will usher him in, which gives me chizuk, but I still don't fully understand the extant of this idea.
so if u can elaborate on this idea I'll be grateful.
thanks in advance.