Hi geshmack!. I had(have?) the same problem as you, calling sex lines. bh i haven't called in like 150 days. I find it to be the biggest and hardest challenge in the porn world because its so accessible, but also one of the easier ones to get un-addicted to because since we use our phone so often, if we stop calling sex lines enough times, then our brains get rewired faster, because if we use our phones 24/7 for the right thing our brains stop associating it with porn faster.

Btw feel free to email me to #share and care.

Wow ever since i got on this streak so much healing has been done. I just let it all out to my parents. My anger at them for not knowing how to love me, my porn addiction my frusrations and pain. Its going to change quickly for me at home but its been slow steady proggress. AND BH NO PORN OR MAST for 63 days! 
I am feeling a little overwhelmed. I really let off 20 years of pain and anger on to my parents. 

B"H this week went well enough. I failed once but that is pretty good for how addicted I was the week before. I managed to avoid binging after failing that one time. Hoping to stay pure next week consistently, managed to get a lot more Torah study done than usual.

The time I failed was because I was triggered by seeing browser history, also, I slept on my back. My failures / close calls are caused by in-between state between sleep and waking. I've managed to stay safe through bedtime Shema, wearing kippa to bed, and sleeping on my side.

B"H it's getting a lot easier to avoid desire. I think what is different about this try is making sure I do not see with my eyes immodest women. I haven't followed this until this attempt. It seems really simple and not that abstract but this literal interpretation of that rule is making it a lot easier I think. I'm at the point that Rabbi Yaron Reuven mentions of needing to guard my sleep, because my mind is beginning to surface other images I've seen in the past. Brain fog is finally dissipating also. I think people are offended when they realize what I'm doing but I'm much more concerned about not having an illegal emission which Shulchan Aruch describes as the worst possible sin described in the Torah. Unfortunately or fortunately I'm going to take as many steps as I can to segregate myself from immodest environments as well to safeguard this. Urges are going down as long as I'm occupied with study (both secular and Torah study). Thanks for all the mensch here who have probably davened for me, I think it's making it a lot easier for me

I'm not really missing it, it's just as nice if not better to have some sweets or baked goods etc (and then no tired or guilt after really, actually maybe some tired but not in a missing sense)

Also B"H that I'm managing this during Parshas Noah given how it illustrates the consequences of immodesty and illegal emission

One thing I'm having to moderate is not allowing other people to induce or seduce me to feel anger in the secular world where people are very liberal with their displays of anger (and I think are often addicted to it). This isn't easy but may Hashem reward us all for trying

Brother, you raise a good point but I think you’re mixing medical diagnosis with religion.

For example to consider a health problem “Using porn/masturbation more than intended or using it for longer than you’re meant to” - is likely referring to someone that masturbates 2-3 times a day. Whereas once / twice a week would not meet the criteria. Same goes for many other criteria. 

On the other hand we are religious Jews, so masturbating twice a month is sacrilegious. But don’t confuse it with the DSM mental health criteria. 

(btw i think 2-3 line signatures look sharper - can you try shorten yours?)

So I beg to disagree with your conclusion that “I post this post because I think that a lot of people don't want to call this battle what it is: ADDICTION. What percentage of people on this site meet at least the 6 criteria I bolded above? Probably a very high percentage.”

ihadstringsbutnowimfree wrote on 24 Oct 2022 03:28:

My addiction to lust, masturbation and porn started way before i got access to screens and till today my acting out does not need a screen.
thanks for sharing your thoughts

I'm sorry to hear you are struggling with this. I think it is very good that you are trying to overcome this temptation. I would say that there are a few things I would want to share with you about anger. The first is that I think it can be addictive. There is to my knowledge some dopamine cycle that forms that it is really good to be free from. Being aware of that may assist you, remember it is your freedom that you are fighting for.

Secondly, what has been the most helpful for me to avoid anger is to realize that my knowledge of a situation is likely limited. Or at the very least, that if I wish to communicate with people in a way that gets me what I want, I have to acknowledge that communicating in terms of absolutes may cause the other person to respond in a way that is not what I would like. For instance, I think it is better to say in an argument ``When you do this ... it makes me feel ...'', or ''my opinion about ... is that it is ''. This may not seem important but I've noticed it produces a very different effect than saying things like "you are ..., that is ..." (in the sense of absolutes). Through practicing this, I've come to be more skeptical of thinking that someone really is what I assume they are, and more likely to give them the benefit of the doubt or to assume it is likely they are in fact trying to do the right thing (but that I perhaps cannot understand how). There's a book I've read called Nonviolent Communication: A Language of Life that has assisted me with this - your mileage may vary. Wishing you the best and Shavua Tov. I think it is very good what you are doing and I think Hashem will reward you with many blessings for trying to overcome it

Lastly, I'd recommend remembering Hashem is in control and will safeguard you from the dangerous things you are worried about. I find it interesting you mention viewing this lady as a possible cause, which I take you to be implicitly concerned about as a possible kind of idolatry. I personally struggle with feelings of idolatrous lust towards women. I find it interesting that many men seem to have idolatrous feelings towards females. I think it is great that you are aware of this. What has helped me the most in my struggle is recognizing that Hashem is my only G-d (first commandment). It was not obvious to me how that commandment is so foundational but I think both your example and my example is able to serve as an example of why it is very important to keep Hashem as the only G-d

frank.lee wrote on 20 Oct 2022 23:48:

Thanks very much for your comments.

I think that any approach to overcoming addiction would require the addict to invest sustained and concentrated effort- and therefore would require the willpower and strengthening of resolve to apply that effort.

Whether willpower alone is enough- I think it’s the most critical element. There are definitely important methods that can and should be used, and dangerous pitfalls to be avoided. I do have an approach that I hope to share- stay tuned! – and of course there are many other clinical and non-clinical approaches. I do maintain that the defining element of overcoming addiction is exercising the will to do so, and that enough strengthened resolve and willpower will push an addict to find the proper treatment course and overcome the inevitable obstacles.

As far as defining addiction, it seems that typically (as is the case in the article you referenced) it is diagnosed rather than defined. Meaning that it is identified by its symptoms rather than by its properties or how it operates. This is in distinction to my approach, where a ‘next-level-nisayon’ is defined as one where physical pressure contradicts the conscious will, as described above.

I’m eager to hear your take, please let me know what you think- either here or by e-mail, yehuda2341@gmail.com

Hi Revuen,
I have Techloq, have tried others and have found it to be the most versatile and strong. I also have had Netfree and that was even better for the addiction, each image is filtered by humans who are told to take any picture with a woman out. But if you need to access some websites they will not allow you to go onto them if they said it was no good.

Hi, 
I'm 24 and single and never really told anyone but I'm addicted to looking at porn and inappropriate stuff. I have times where I don't have urges and don't succumb to my Yetzar hara but their are times where I do. For me the biggest help was getting filters on everything. But I recently got a new job and don't know of a good filter for an HP computer does anyone have any ideas?
I really want to beat this horrible addiction! 

soooo.... the yetzer likes to strike when we are feeling confident.... Not a slip, not a fall, but a very painful win(?)

Curious to know what happened?

Yehuda, thank you so much for sharing these deep ideas!

I think many in the field would differ with your idea that for addiction taavos you need to strengthen your resolve to resist the pressure. There is an idea that once something is an addictive relationship, more resolve and willpower would not be able to resolve the issue.

For some info on defining addictive behavior, please see this post by 5Uu... guardyoureyes.com/forum/2-What-Works-for-Me/386561-Thread-in-which-I-share-my-thoughts

Hi everyone,
I recently joined GYE and have not yet posted on the introduction page, but now I'm ready to share my story...
I am 25 years old currently learning fulltime. I grew up in a home with many difficult parts, from my fathers anger management issues to all my brothers going off the derech. It has never been a very stable environment. 
I was exposed to P and M by my older brothers and have been addicted since my early teens. I don't recall using it in order to escape stressful situations but my childhood and on has always been filled with stress and pressures, so it may have been subconsciously related.
I have tried to quit several times including smashing my smartphone during one fall-ridden bein hazemanim, but never with lasting success.
After I got married I had a clean streak for a year though I was exposed to many triggers I never viewed P or engaged in M. But when my daughter was born my wife became niddah and no-one told me how long it would last. I was hearing anything between a month to 3 months, and my triggers started getting stronger until I began to fall, and fall again. Since then I have notice a change in my relationship with my wife. I started wanting more in the areas of the bedroom which she wasn't ready for, and being from a sheltered home she didn't know how to progress in the intimacy very far. this led to me turning to P and M to satisfy my desires which removed one of the main glues of marriage, the intimacy shared by the husband and wife. I realized also the potential destruction which would occur if my wife ever discovered what I was doing, and became very protective of my computer, which caused more tension in the marriage.
Finally I decided enough is enough. I want to have a happy marriage and raise my family in a pure and happy home without being scared every time someone turns on the computer. I joined GYE and started my journey forward.
I am hopeful that the F2F program will help me restore myself to a clear mind and be able to have a happy marriage.

Idea #3- Against Your Better Judgement

We said last time that the Yetzer Hara traps us by offering an easy way out- ‘the path of least resistance’- by inventing reasons that the aveira isn’t bad (or isn’t “so” bad).

That’s true a lot of the time, but not quite always. There’s another way the Yetzer Hara can go after us, without needing to make us justify or minimize the aveira.

As we all know, issues with taavos in general are sorted into two categories: ‘non-addiction level’ and ‘addiction level’. I’m pretty sure there’s no hard-and-fast definition for ‘addiction’, it’s just used for when the problem is at the next level, when it’s having serious negative effects on the person’s life.

I’m going to put myself out there just a bit, but I don’t personally find that distinction useful. In my way of thinking I prefer to not draw the line between this person and that person- “he’s an addict and he’s not”. I like to draw the line between this nisayon and that nisayon- “this challenge, this temptation, is a different level than normal”.

So what are the two levels of challenge? The first is what I described before. Our ‘want’ to do right is stronger than the ‘want’ for the taavah, so to go after the weaker ‘want’ (the taavah) we need to make a compromise, make it ‘ok’ to do it. I called this ‘the path of least resistance’.

But what if we do resist? We don’t allow ourselves to believe that it’s ok, we know better than that. What’s left for the Yetzer Hara to do now?

Often, nothing. For a ‘regular’ nisayon, refusing to compromise, refusing to accept the justifications, will end the nisayon. But sometimes it doesn’t stop there. Sometimes the Yetzer Hara will turn up the heat, apply pressure, make it literally painful to resist. That’s the palm-sweating, stomach churning, burning desire that won’t let you be, won’t go away. Even though you don’t want to do it. And you know you don’t want to do it, you know the excuses are meaningless, you know the consequences. You can be thinking, consciously and directly, ‘I do not want to do this now’, and do it anyways, against your better judgement, just to relieve the pressure.

That’s the next level. If you’ve been there, you’ll know what I mean. It’s different.

When does that happen? I’m not 100% sure, haven’t done any studies. But I think that this generally happens to a person who has been involved in taavos for a while. Someone who’s used to getting those pleasures, depends on them for happiness/comfort/distraction. Basically, an addict.

So what’s the point of all this? Am I ending up with the same thing- addict and non-addict?

Not exactly. An ‘addict’ can have a regular, not-all-that-difficult challenge here and there. Someone who’s life is not being ruined by his taavos can sometimes have the overwhelming nisayon, as described above.

When we fight the Yetzer Hara, we have to focus on overcoming this challenge. Different challenges need to be dealt with differently. If we are tempted to justify following our taavos, we have to work to not accept illogical justifications- even if we’ve reached ‘addiction level’.

If we are being pushed against our judgement, then it doesn’t help to refuse to accept excuses. We already did that. Now the trick is to strengthen our resolve to resist the pressure- and that goes for a non-addict as well.

An ‘addict’ is just someone who is more likely to have an overwhelming ‘against-your-better-judgement’ nisayon. But the way to deal with each nisayon is the same for everyone.

I’ll talk much more later on about exactly how to resist each kind of nisayon. This piece is just meant to give a picture of what the different nisyonos are, so we know what we’re up against.

I will mention one thing, though, for those who experience these nisyonos. The overwhelming nisayon is definitely much harder, no question. But there is a silver lining. The drive, the pressure, of these nisyonos is not you. It’s not coming from what you want, from what you think is worthwhile. It’s outside of your heart and mind, it’s all physical. That makes a big difference. As strong as it is, it goes away quickly, much more quickly than your heart-and-mind desires. If you can beat it- and you can beat it- it will go away faster than you would believe.

Hi friends. I am creating this thread in which I will share different thoughts about recovery. In this first post, I want to share the DSM-5 criteria for substance use disorder as listed at www.gatewayfoundation.org/addiction-blog/dsm-5-substance-use-disorder/ (that's just where I found the list; I don't have any association with that website or even know what that website is.) I have [approximately] substituted the phrase porn/masturbation for the word "substance" or "drug" every place it appears below:

Criteria for substance use disorder:
1. Using porn/masturbation more than intended or using it for longer than you’re meant to.
2. Trying to cut down or stop porn/masturbation but being unable to.
3. Experiencing intense cravings or urges to use porn/masturbation.
4. Needing more of porn/masturbation to get the desired effect — also called tolerance.
5. Developing withdrawal symptoms when not using porn/masturbation.
6. Spending more time getting and using porn/masturbation and recovering from porn/masturbation use.
7. Neglecting responsibilities at home, work or school because of porn/masturbation.
8. Continuing to use porn/masturbation even when it causes relationship problems.
9. Giving up important or desirable social and recreational activities due to porn/masturbation use.
10. Using porn/masturbation in risky settings that put you in danger.
11. Continuing to use porn/masturbation despite it causing problems to your physical and mental health.

Per DSM-5,
* One symptom could indicate an individual is at risk.
* Two or three criteria point to a mild substance use disorder.
* Four or five symptoms show someone has a moderate substance use disorder.
* Six or more criteria indicate a severe substance use disorder, which signals an addiction to that substance.

I post this post because I think that a lot of people don't want to call this battle what it is: ADDICTION. What percentage of people on this site meet at least the 6 criteria I bolded above? Probably a very high percentage. And that is among the bnei aliyah who actually make it to this site!

So, who cares that it's an addiction? The answer is that when you realize you have an addiction and not just a "stam" struggle with the yetzer hara, you can begin to approach the problem with clinical rhetoric instead of feeling like you are doomed to gehinom because you can't seem to succeed with mussar alone despite having tried for years to stop. I personally found this mindset very liberating and helpful on my journey.  You can say, "I am a ben Torah who loves learning and doing mitzvos. I am not doomed because I am recovering form a substance use disorder one day at a time with G-d's help" instead of "I am a ben Torah who loves learning and doing mitzvos but am doomed because I can't stop masturbating compulsively all the days of my life because I can't beat the yetzer hara in this spiritual battle." Realize that in many ways this is very much like recovering from an addiction to heroin.

I am not saying this is not a battle against the yetzer hara because of course Chazal tell us arayos is a yetzer hara. Rather, I am saying that if you have been stuck for years trying to stop these toxic habits, it could be you need a rhetoric shift.