ur-a-jew wrote on 07 Oct 2010 00:44:


Who says Yosef did an aveira? There are some interesting midrashim that I don't claim to understand but none that say Yosef "fell"

Who's a hero? He fell, the other fell, I fell...we have all fallen! There is no schedule, no comparison and no time here. It's all a big mush and we each are in our own lane on the recovery highway. As the ba'al Mishnas Chassidim wrote, "v'ein odom nogei'ah b'mah shemuchan lachaveiro", and as the Gemarah says somewhere, "ein Malchus achas noga'as bechavertah, afilu k'molei neemah." It's all the same: we are each in our own world progressing the way we have to, it's our own little corner of Malchus Shomayim to be mekadesh - like our very own Eeshah that is mekudash to us. It's all the same, and I have written way too much...this kind of thing happens when someone is tired....sorry if it made no sense to anyone else but me.... :-* 

The Mahrsha (sotah 36) learns that because Yosef was M"ZL during the incident he lost out on having 12 children like Yaakov had.  Sounds to me like a fall.  May have been an uncontrollable fall, could have been much much worse but still a fall.  The critical point is what he did at that moment. He restrained himself from going further.

Eye.nonymous wrote on 05 Oct 2010 06:44:
Good question, Eye. (I know that's not how you meant it, but right now this is how I'm hearing it -- it's a question!) And while I've been feeling rather disconsolate this week, I don't think I'm so full of discontent etc that I'm heading for a meltdown.

Recently, I've been getting a real kick out of the mode I've been using with TBG'U (the Big Guy upstairs :-> ). Basically, I've been pushing back. A lot. Here's an example:  OK, Hashem, I can do what You ask. It'll keep us together as close teammates. But I need you to show me that you really NEED me to do all this, and that you APPRECIATE it, and that you can PAY ME BACK for all this tircha -- not just after 120 but NOW. You want me to (hang up that phone), then make the phone ring with so much work I can barely handle it. You want me to (keep my hands to myself), then bring bushels of unfathomable beauty that will keep me happy instead. You want me to (stop salivating over certain stuff), then bring me ways to eat my most delicious foods as often as I like. And on and on and on.

I know some folks might say that's unfair. After all, EVERYTHING comes from Hashem. We have to find a place to love EVERYTHING He gives us. (Check out my tagline these days: that Hashem should help me WANT everything I GET.) But that's not where I am right now. Instead, I'm feeling like: I'm busting my backside right now; a little help wouldn't be so bad; I'm just trying to give these kids a homelife they can be proud of both now and when the movie of our lives plays after 120. HELP! I can stay on-track, but probably ONLY if I get a lot of good stuff from you RIGHT NOW.

And, if it ain't too much trouble, Lawdy, could you send that great food over with a little extra chocolate for dessert?

Somehow, though, if I can keep my relationship with the RBS'O (TBG'U) on this kind of "ask Him anything" level, it's easier to try to give Him everything. Whether I fall, don't fall, or fly to the Rockies.

(And PS: if I could ONLY tell you guys what I had planned, you'd realize how chutzpadig this attitude is. But that doesn't matter! Because first, I think He WANTS me to act that close to Him. And second, because I could never explain what my plans were since they might trigger some of you.)

I'm calling Janice Joplin and we're gonna have a little talk about you, boy.... :D

It's funny, but HKBH is responding to all my testing and taunting and bribing Him (oy) with... giving me everything I want.

I'm holding my breath until I turn blue, and He's giving in. Lovingly, even.

If You really want me to stay good, I say, you should show me with parnassa b'kavod. Done. B'revah.
If I'm being good, there should be reward of sholom bayis (in the bedroom and the rest of the house). Done. B'revah.
If I'm being good... etc etc...

Bli eyin hara PPP, the brochos are coming. I cry out that I need it this way, because any message in the form of a potsch would just destroy me right now, and He answers that He knows that. (Well, duhh, doesn't He know everything? !)

So while I'm struggling over what to learn from a recent fall and how to get my sea legs back for the next journey... I see very clearly that He's gonna help support me in every single area of my life -- I just have to look around for the signals because they're all around.

[And if I start to think for a minute that my practice is picking up right now because "I" am so smart or "I" am so [whatever]... kick me in the [pants] because it's obviously happening because "He" is caring so much about me and my success.]

Wow. Gut Voch.

Chevra: could I seek a little advice here, please?

It looks like I'll be hiring a part-time frum employee to work in my home office. This needs to be during quiet hours (i.e., empty house). I'm pretty certain there's no way to hire a female due to yichud issues. But I'm also pretty certain that hiring a young man could prove tempting in other ways.

I want to daven that the RBS'O should recognize my plight and send me a candidate who's really smart & qualified & pleasant and... FAT AND UGLY! Maybe even smelly . Do you chapp?

So, help me -- what should my attitude be, what should my tefila be, what should my tachlis actions be?

Thanks.

im only a mouse but i'll give it a shot.

q.1 are you absolutely sure there has to be no one else in the house and that he would have to work in your home office? is there any other way to deal with it, that you're not being honest with yourself about? (not accusing c'v, just thats what would be p'shat with me)

q.2 i dunno your exact trigger situation, but perhaps in your case, the rotzon Hashem is that there would be yichud for u with a man but not with a woman. I dont know, but perhaps it's worth investigating.

lastly - i would use the parnoso tefillah in shema koleinu, i discovered the gadlus of it just yesterday - the last passuk quoted (tehilim 55:23) 'throw upon Hashem your burden and He will support you'. Daven that the predicament is one that you can't solve, you can't know what's the best way forward for you, but Hashem does, so ask Him to guide you and support you and I'm sure He will.

hatslocho!

My advice regarding Tachlis Action is really your advice to others:
Like here:
Briut wrote on 10 Oct 2010 13:07:


I think you really need to talk to your Rov about this one.  Find out whether the Yichud issue is really a yichud issue.  For example, even if it is quiet time do people on occasion still come to your office possibly removing the Yichud issue?  A Rav especially yours who is familiar with your issues I think can give you the best guidance on this issue.

URAJ: Thanks for the thoughts, even if your source is a little suspect . (Don't you just HATE it when people come back to you with your OWN WORDS to answer an inquiry. Ouch!)

Anyhow, I DID ask my Rav. About some of it. Namely the question of whether this constitutes yichud. He seems pretty clear that having a 20-year-old recent Sem graduate is not a good idea. (Yichud? Ma'aris Eyin? Something Else? I didn't ask.)

What I did NOT ask, and would have a difficult time getting together the to ask, is whether I need to avoid privacy with a GUY. Not for halachic basis, I'm certain (issur is re women), but just as daas Torah. This would be a painful question to pose, but as I say to others it's important to acquire a Rav I can ask ANY question. I tell myself that I'm waiting to see if the question is to'eles (relevant, real-life, not a mere academic theoretical question). It's possible I'm simply a chicken, but if it's not to'eles than I'm not gonna beat myself up for that.

I still think it's okay to daven for someone really talented and really unattractive.

Other thoughts, friends? Am I deluding myself? What would YOU do if female eye candy is forbidden by Torah and male eye candy is forbidden by common sense? This would require eliminating all "eye candy thinking" and I'm not sure I'm quite there yet -- on my way but still working on it.

So? What do I do?

is it feasible to rent a small office in a building where there are other offices? you could ask for a voucher for the rent from Hashem, you seem to have a special connection to Him. (only half-joking)

Update: For the hiring, I'm leaning toward a middle-aged, overweight, highly talented man. I don't think sharing the empty house will be an issue.

For the GYE work generally, I think I'm in free-fall. I'm still clean in actions (no P or M, etc) but my mind is doing overtime in shmutzland. I haven't been counting days because I keep thinking I'll be falling tomorrow so why bother. I think if I can get through the next coupla days, though, I'll be back on track.

And at some point, I've realized, it's not about s*x at all but about caring and commitment and feeling that the world is a reliable place. Wouldn't it be easier if it were simply all about shmutz! ? ? !!

Briut wrote on 18 Oct 2010 02:20:

Yeah, sometimes that's where we're at.

Briut wrote on 18 Oct 2010 02:20:

hi Briut,
can you elaborate on what you meant by this? i don't understand the intent.
thanks
zs

Ooh, "Briut"! I'd love to take a crack at Zemiros's question....but then I remembered that this is your thread! Whew!