Guys, stop fighting!

I got a tremendous amount from the forum. Without the forum I wouldn't even be fighting, I would be acting out every other day instead of having 3 clean weeks. I probably would be fired from my job and seriously depressed, maybe even dead. I got what I need from the forum. I got support, I got friends. You all picked me up when I was in the dumps. Why haven't I beat the addiction? Only G-d knows. I don't blame you guys or the forum.

You've totally misunderstood my point. Agh!!!! The only point I was trying to express (and apparently badly since I was misunderstood), was that the chatty nature of the forum made it harder for me to stay offline. I've been on all the time instead of working. When it was a more serious format, it was easier to check in and check out when I needed to give or get chizuk. I need to work and check in/out only when I need to.

I appreciate that my thread stayed joke-free, and I did avoid the more chatty threads. If that works for you girls, and I appreciate that, and keep it up.

Now, let me go offline already and work. Blee neder, I'll be back.

Well, if I misunderstood you, I speak for myself. Fighting, no. Being assertive of my needs, yes.

I too am grateful to GYE for everything they have been giving till now (I don't know if I'd be dead; I'd probably be bingeing this very moment though), but I would also appreciate more serious format.

2B

Tomim2B wrote on 23 Sep 2009 06:37:


Actually, you didn't misunderstand me. I backtracked because I can't stand the fighting and I saw that I was hurting the girls' feelings. Nothing makes me feel worse inside than seeing (even virtually seeing) a girl cry.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I didn't disagree. Was just trying to make a point. I think that everyone can use the forum, in whichever way they see fit. If the chatting takes up your time, stick to your/serious threads. It was really not my intention to hurt anyone and I hope I didn't. I was just giving a suggestion. I'll delete it if you want and stay in the E.N from now on. As Tomim said,
You're right. I'm sorry .

TrYiNg wrote on 23 Sep 2009 06:49:


I'm glad you brought this up. No we don't want you to stay in the Ezras Noshim from now on. We want you to be involved in our threads when possible, as we will be involved in your threads when possible. There are very few women on this site and it's unfair to tell them to keep to their areas. If we all give and take in a mature way we'll all benefit.

I understand that you respond better to less serious posts. I'll have that in mind when posting in your thread.

2B

I admit I've been given a lot to think about here, which is why I dont want to express an opinion off the top of my head.

What I do want to say is sorry though. Whether right or wrong for all or some, I think that the changed atmosphere has a little to do with me. And I apologise sincerely Momo and Tomim if this has hurt you.

Hi everyone. I love you all. Lots of good points have been brought up here. I think it's clear that we are not talking about triggering the opposite sex. Everyone agrees that it's not the triggering that is the problem, and that's the most important thing, for one. So the comparison with chatting with on-line girls in our addiction is not applicable at all. (I guess it was used to make a point, but I think it was taken a little out of context). Ok, so now that we got that clear, it no longer has to do with young girls or older women, or men posting on women's threads, or vis-a-versa. The question seems to really boil down to "how serious we should keep the threads?". My thinking is that each person should be allowed to set the tone of their own thread.

Your thread is your "virtual safe-place" on GYE.

If a person wants a more serious thread for one of the following reasons:
1) They don't feel a need for the warm, family flakiness,
2) They enjoy the chit-chat a little too much, and see that it is holding them back from work
3) They feel triggered by having the opposite sex post on their thread (something I haven't heard yet from anyone on this forum, as we are very careful about this)
Then, they should make it clear. What I mean is, that as soon as people start getting "out-of-hand" on their thread, they should kindly ask everyone to keep the tone more serious.
And if a person wants a more serious thread, and asks for it, then jokes and hijacking will not be tolerated. (Kanesher has a gun and will strictly enforce this).

But I do not think that we need to change the tone of the entire forum. Like so many here have said, everyone needs something else. For many, it seems, it is precisely the warm, family nature, jokes and flakiness of the forum that make them feel so "safe". They don't want to let their family down. They have somewhere to vent, and to cheer on others, and this is very precious. Even Dov, who was dead serious in his recovery for 11 years, and who I consider my own personal Rebbe in all recovery related issues, has made Rabbeinu HaBardichever his Rebbe (every Rebbe needs a Rebbe too!), and he says that the one thing he learned from GYE (imagine, us teaching Dov something!) is not to take life so damn serious. In 12-Step groups as well, they have a saying along the lines of "don't take yourself so serious"...

I think that even rage, behind all the RED-NECK TALK, is really a big flake in disguise. If not for the warm, joking, family nature, I believe he'd be long gone. He even said yesterday that he never was able to connect with any "frum network" before. Is it the seriousness that is keeping him here? I doubt...

Anyway, to sum up. Each person's thread is his own personal castle. And we must respect the tone they wish to set.

Thank you Momo for being so honest and for stating your opinions. I think this helped us all get more clarity.

If anyone disagrees with what I wrote, feel free to post here (and jump in a lake  :D)

k, momo, i'm sorry i misunderstood you yesterday.
the chattiness makes me procrastinate too.
I'm just not at the level where i think i could manage without it.
sorry momo and tomim for being so annoying last night about e/t
you forgive me?
(if you don't want to post to answer that, it's ok. but if you don't forgive, then please tell me what to do to make amends. )

Dear Momo -

Thanks for putting it right out there and BTW, I have never even read any of the female portions of this forum because I have not stayed sober so far by taking risks and I think that chatting or even reading women's posts, particularly about this problem would be a problem for me. Even though they are likely much more connected to sanity and sobriety than I may ever be and are l'Shem Shomayim. I have PM'd Guard about this in the past. I don't sacrifice myself for anyone, even a sexaholic. B"H for every day sober so far...

This is a little, zeitiger issue for me, what I really want to share with with you is for my next post....

Woops, I guess I was wrong. One important person here does feel triggered... But I wonder if he is just "afraid" of what he'll see on the women's forum (sushi and brownies, mostly) and therefore doesn't want to take any risks? or if he is actually triggered by things the women said...

Since Momo wants more seriousness, I will respect that.

Momo, I think you're a Nobody. But hey, nobody's perfect. That makes you perfect!



oopsie. kanesher is coming to get me

I was so scared that i was triggering people. let's just say my pillow was soaked till 2am and i texted habib "ow!" a few times. i almost gave up the forum. i felt like a louse for letting the y''h fool me into thinking i was a "sister". i'm so glad it's not like that and i'm really so so sorry if i did have any bad affects on people. i never want it that way. I will be VERY careful to be serious if i post on your thread at all, momo. if you want me there only or if i'm the only one on if you need help.
Please forgive me for any lightness/distress that i caused you.

Again, as has been said, I don't think triggering is the issue (Dov's point was that he was not going to take any chances).  However, all communication between men and women, real or virtual, needs to be done with caution.

ok, all points taken
thank you everyone for being open and honest!

My goodness Rage

To use of of your favorite mataphors,

You certainly don't pull your punches.

Another aspect BTW of the levity side of the forum is as I and many of us stress,

A favorite tactic of the YH in making us fall is by getting us depressed, it's also his favorite tactic of keepining us down.

But whatever the case Momo doesn't want jokes on his thread and we respect his wishes, and don't make him respond let the poor guy work alittle bit.