I dont envy your situation Shlomo. Its a tough one to be in. Just remember two things when you are doing something about this (and you SHOULD do something about it):

1) Hashem is behind it ALL so no matter what you decide to do, Daven to hashem to help you make the right decision and help your decision be successfull and

2) As we all know form this thing we have called addiction, Hashem puts us in our respective situations because Hashem KNOWS we can succeed.

Those are two basic fundamentals to carry with you through life.

Hatzlocha Rabbah!

-Yiddle

First of all, I'm glad to hear that things are going well by you. And you're always welcome to drop by my thread!  

As far as you brother, I can only share my thoughts - I'm far from an expert. I will say that I'm touched by how much you love your brother and want to help him grow!

Your first instincts are correct - ultimately, we daven. We can do our hishtadlus, but remember that that's all it is - we're doing actions in this world that we're supposed to do. Ultimately, you can't control what your brother's doing, and trying to do so may not end well for anyone - he may end up resentful, and you feeling frustrated.

I think, though, that you can bring it up - Start off by telling him how much you love him and care about him, and how much you respect him, and are impressed by everything he's doing. Then, you don't even have to mention what you saw, though you can if that feels right - but discuss the idea of kedusha, keep it short and simple. Explain that sexuality is very important, and also very holy, but should be saved for the right situations. Mention the idea of a filter, explaining that you also have a filter because you know how difficult it can be for anyone to control themselves when they feel urges.

I'd recommend that you not say too much about your own struggle, though you can let him know that because you're human, you realize that when the rabbanim talk about how important it is to have a filter, to prevent us from falling, you realize that it applies to you, too.

thank you yiddle2 and silentbattle. just to let you know, i plan on talking to my brother tomorrow. i'll try to keep the topic on filters in general (putting a lot of emphasis on how i have them on my computer and ipod) and see what he thinks of it. i dont want to hint that i saw anything, as i want to make this non-confrontational.

and i've been davening to Hashem that he can guide my footsteps so that i can help my brother and also that he help me in my struggle as well.

day 12 and things are still looking good. thanks for the help, once again!

Thats great Shlomo! I wish you much Hatzlacha from Hashem with you and your brother.

-Yiddle

hatzlacha on whatever you decide to do. Maybe say a few kapitelech of tehillim before you speak t him, and ask hashem to make things work out well!

Again, I think that a major thrust of the conversation should be that you care about him and love and respect him no matter what.

How are you doing?

so good news in all areas.

i spoke with my brother briefly tonight about getting a filter for his computer, letting him know that i have one too. The talk didnt extend much more than that but when we set up the filter (hopefully) tomorrow night, i'm sure things will go into more detail. but so far, everythings lookin' good.

in terms of my own battle, things went well today. i had the entire afternoon/night off with little homework and when my y"h tried to come at me, i just sidestepped him and moved on with my day.

and in some rather oddball news, i was speaking with one of my friends (we both have an interest in music) and he agreed to sell me an old acoustic guitar. as long as its in good condition (and i dont have a snow day tomorrow  *please snow*) then i will most likely be able to buy it tomorrow for a good price. and just fyi, i played guitar for a couple months a few years ago but had to stop b/c of school, but hopefully i'll keep things going much, much longer and maybe, SB, i can start writing my own stuff.  ;D so i will hopefully have another tool/hobby to fight this battle.

so, day 13 is good.  laila tov.

Fantastic, on all fronts! Keep on rocking - and you don't have to go into detail with your brother - just let him know how amazing he is, and how much you love and respect him. No matter what.

FYI we have a few threads on this forum about this

The GYE,org has some responses from the "GYE Rebetzin" (i know she hate the title...makes her look old) on this, although with regard to younger children.

Depending on his exposure to movies and TV, he may know fully well how to do things that his body may not have developed enough for!! Keep that in mind, that if he is already watching it, he needs to hear the TORAH approach to it. Otherwise you are not sheltering him, but merely incubating him in a goyish mindset of  "s-- is good, do whatever you want, but use 'protection'" .    very few goyim buy the abstinance idea! and that meathod is not accepted by the general TV "hashkafa", so they won't be brainwashing him with it.                  Idealy, try having an open conversation that allows him to het a torah perspective of the things he has already watched and heard of, and make shure that he feels comfortable coming back with more questions.   

We aren't talking about meah shearim. He will learn all the gory details online, and he must definitely know most of them by now.            I once heard a 7 year old talking about the profanities he watched on movies....he can't even be physicly aroused...and he already dreams of znus?????? 

for the first time in 17 days, i bring bad news. i fell, but in terms of the negative use of words, i want to leave it at that, as i want to focus on staying besimcha and keeping the spirit of adar going.

as tough as it is for me to say this, the fall doesnt surprise me. I have been posting over the past few weeks, but i certainly could have focused much more on the positive things. i typically kept my updates to "no news is good news" and i hardly worked on self improvement or constantly making changes to how i live (and after seeing how well it has worked for other members to do so and post on the forum about it, especially sci1977, its not even an option).

aside from this, i just want to lay out a few things that i have learned over the past 17 days and from this fall:
1. the only way to truly move forward with this struggle is setting up boundaries and fences in all areas, especially in relation to internet use.
2. a meditation that i used that helped me multiple times when being pestered by my y"h was simply contemplating what I will be like in a few hours. will i be:
a) going on with life normally, proud that i avoided a slip/fall b/c thats Hashems will or
b) disappointed with myself b/c i acted out.
i prefer a.

3. after setting my personal record since starting on the slippery slope a year and a half ago, i can say that this battle is simple. at this point after being on the forum and having GUE as a resource, the reality is that i have all the tools i need. i have fellow Yiddin that i can turn to for chizuk or any help that i may need, i have the two handbooks with countless strategies for overcoming thi
s struggle, i have Torah and Mitzvos and now i just need to "let go and let G-d." i have all of the tools to win this battle. now i just need to start using them.

aside from tonight (which is tough to forget), things with me have been good. i just installed k9 on my brothers computer and he seemed excited about it and hopefully we'll have a more open relationship about all things, especially with regards to Yiddishkeit and shemiras einayim.

purim by me went well. at the traditional shul that my family belongs to, my father read the 3rd chapter of the megillah and i read the 6th, which is something we've done the past couple years and is something that i love to do.

so as i begin anew from day 0, i hope to carry on staying besimcha, to overlook and learn from this bump in the road, and to eventually make it to the 90 days, taking it day by day.

thanks for stickin' with me. we're the most useful tool we've got.

I'm glad that you're moving forward.

Certainly, working on self improvement and changing the way you live is important. However, there's another major reason why posting every day is important, at least to me - it helps me stay in touch with where I am, it makes me look inside and see where I'm playing with fire, it makes me examine how I feel about things, it makes me examine myself and see where the trouble spots, present and future, are.

It sounds like you're planning for the future, reviewing tools that have worked well for you. That's good.

What about learning from this fall, though? What could you do differently next time - while it's happening, an hour before, a day before?

this is the last thing i wanted to be typing, but today was another bad day. i somehow managed to remember the password to my filter and things got out of hand. i've sent a new password (of about 14 numbers so i can never guess it) and a new account number to the filtergabbai so that should take care of my computer.

both today and yesterday, i know that the cause of each fall was me telling myself that "i'm a teenager. everyone does this kind of stuff. its fine if you just look for a minute or two." and for some reason, though i have no idea why, i listened to this argument. i'm just disappointed in myself that this could happen, let alone two days in a row.

i feel like i've taken huge strides while on GUE, but right now, i need to change my mindset. the filters and fences are up, but i need to change something fundamental about my mindset. at least from my perspective, i see that the only way to do this is to introduce something drastic into my life (such as not using the internet at all for 3 days or devoting no less than 3 hours to torah study, regardless of its impact upon the rest of my life including school and homework). at this point, i'm not sure what to do so that i can get over this initial hump.

any and all help would be appreciated.  :-\

First of all, please take a deep breath. You're YOU, man! You're Shlomo! The more you remember that, the easier it'll be to get up. Look in the mirror, and see the amazing person you are. Look yourself in the eye.

Dramatic things can be a good start, but they won't carry us through. That requires constant work and determination. And a lot of relying on hashem.

Why do we listen to the foolish arguments of the Y"H? Don't know, but we all do. It happens.

And most of all...the yetzer hora wants you to think that you're stuck in some deep hole, with no way out. And he tells you that it's SOOOO difficult to escape. So tough, in fact, that you might as well wait till tomorrow.

But 3 days from now, you'll look back and realize that he was lying to you. You're not in a hole at all - you're on solid ground, ready to move forward, if you so choose.

Shlomo wrote on 02 Mar 2010 02:25:


Hey shlomo, came to this post through the accountability group, hi!

I have been where you are so many times, i dont know about you but i found these drastic steps never last, you have to take on something small, try half an hour of solid study, maybe a particular thing such as shnayim mikra, or parsha with rashi, that is something that could last, and also once you have done this you will feel in a different mindset.

Anything which you do which has an impact on everything such as school and homework etc cannot last, thats my very humble opinion, you have to start small, that way when you succeed you will feel very good, as opposed to feeling terrible when you fail on your drastic plans which only leads to falling further.

Good luck man, we are with you!!

Shlomo wrote on 02 Mar 2010 02:25:


This is a difficult step that may be number oner in terms of getting ourselves into recovery. It took me alot longer than you so be gratefull for that.

Shlomo wrote on 02 Mar 2010 02:25:


This is not "me telling myself", its the Yetzer Hara telling you. And the sooner you recognize this, its just another step to getting into recovery. And if you want to know why you listened to it, its because he rationalized with you. Rationalization is probably the greatest tool of the Yezter Hara. He tries to make everyhting seem fine to you by giving you a reason. But if we would just take a step out of "reality" (which is really fantasy), we would see what the Y'H is trying to do and laugh at it. "Whoa one second! Did I just hear that I can watch Shmutz because I am a teenager?!?!? Thats hilarious! My gosh i didnt realize the Torah wasnt given to teenagers!" This is a difficult step, but the recognition can uproot the rationalization if you train yourself to do so.

Shlomo wrote on 02 Mar 2010 02:25:


Great ending. Grow from the fall. Thats the ultimate way to get back at the Y'H. AS DC once beautifully told me: (not word for word) Our addiction is like the bumps on the side of the highway. What is the point of those things? (if you dont know what im talking about then imagine bumps on the shoulder of the highway) Well thos bumps are there to wake us up. I'll give you a personal story to prove this. I was driving home and I got this new medicine that I had to take and of course I am a stubborn young lad so I didnt read the bottle that says not to drive after taking the medication. Well I fell asleep at the wheel going 65 MPH. I started veering off onto the divider of the highway. I hit the bumps on the side of the road and woke up probably less than 1/10th of a second before hitting the divider. So too with our addiction. It is the bump on the sidfe of the road. Hashem is waking us up and saying Youre FALLING ASLEEP AT THE WHEEL!! YOUR AVODAS HASHEM ISNT WHAT IT CAN BE!

Hatzlocha Rabba!

-Yiddle