A gute woch, ye'all!
I just wanted to report that I love my life. My wife is putting the babies to sleep, my older kids are doing their thing (one's not even home) and I am not sneaking in watching porn.
In addition, I am in a good mood, even though I fell off my alcohol sobriety wagon earlier today. I am willing to say that my wife is an enabler
The sex addiction thing is a much stronger demon as far as I'm concerned. This is where the real fight is.
For example, I made havdolo on bear after I made kidush on wine. All of this because I didn't worry to buy juice. (Also, you can probably guess it's a new thing for me, if I still have beer and wine in my house.)
So instead of throwing a fuss and blaming my wife for not having the juice, or making my son ( a young teen) make kiddush on wine instead of me, I braved a cup of wine. I can't lie so I'll tell you that after drinking the required "roiv kois" I shortly finished the becher, and then proceeded drinking another one... and a shot of tequila for good measure. ( I also still have a couple of unopened bottles of tequila and scotch). And now, for havdolo, all I head was becherfull of beer (and whatever was left in the bottle, because of bal tashchis). In short, I kinda said "I fell already I may as well finish it off with good times". (I don't recommend this to newcomers, and the oldtimers know better).
But I survived a birthday celebration earlier this week and an entire Shvuos. And I think it was a right-er way of going about things than the alternative.
Ma she ein kein with the sexual thing. I can not risk exposure to anything remotely triggering. I went on the Facebook and clicked on a link promising a promiscuous video withing seconds of coming up on the link. It took no thought. There was also no doubt what kind of show was gonna play. My filter didn't play the video (thank G-d).
But I can't afford the first drink of lust, is what I'm saying.

obormottel wrote on 03 Jun 2012 07:09:

It's always good to have a bear around the house, it reminds us of Dov, Woodford is great too, it reminds us of Bards.
Hang in there Mottel!

[once you're on tequila... can we get some tortillas in the kitchen?]

Yeah, Obber1Canolli. For all the years that I masturbated and used porn, I believed in my heart of hearts that the first drink is to be avoided - as some sort of geder so as to avoid eventually getting drunk .

Needless to say, that mentality did not work well...(hic!)

Until I accepted the tremendous chiddush (to me) that it really was the first drink that made me drunk, rather than the third or fourth one...I never could have stopped drinking. Not with all the G-d and program in the world.

(PS. I am referring to lust drinking, as I do not happen to be an alcoholic, at least so far...)

That's pretty much what I'm saying. The first lust hit, or drink, or wtvr, will immediately put me on a binge mode.

OK, so welcome to the club. Now that this is clear to you, there are 3 pitfalls to look out for and avoid:

Borr (not beer, or bear) 1- Forgetting it completely. It's truly amazing what our capacity to just plain forget, is. :o AHHH!!!!!!!

Borr (yeah, yeah, yeah) 2- Realize and accept that we will not be perfect. Alcohol and pills are relatively clear to seem perfect in avoiding - no more booze of any kind, period (and maybe even no cough medicine...uh-oh, maybe not so clear) . But lust and sex addiction is very tricky. The marrieds have it much tougher than the singles for this reason. Cuz sex is not the problem - lust is. It takes most of us a few months to make some real progress - then many of us discover that it takes us a few more years to make really significant progress in that and ger real freedom...at least on good days.

And life goes on, avodas Ha borei always improves over the long term this way, and the ikkar remains - am I sober today from sex with myself or with anyone other than my wife, or not? That's the bottom line. And getting progressive freedom from the tyrrany of lust will have to happen if we really know we need to stay sober no matter what.

Yipee! Welcome to the club! At least there is no 'circumcision' needed, like when we entered that other club (called Judaism).

I remember that day well...
Thanks, chabibi. 'Tis good.
Mottel
P.S. third pitfall?

Bor Al Gabei Bor Al Gabei Bor....

Gevura wrote on 04 Jun 2012 03:29:


Actually that would be the first one. He was asking about the third.

Mottel its nice to hear you're doing well. Continued hatzlacha.

Thank you. Did you see my email?

Mazel Tov!!!! IY'H by 180!!

hi mottel,
pardon my irreverent associations, but the talk about bears and initiation rites reminded me of this
www.guardyoureyes.org/forum/index.php?topic=477.msg35274#msg35274 />ואתכם הסליחה

well, as an alcoholic, I can add to Dov's point about the first drink with anecdotal evidence... for me it wasn't the drink per se, but the accompanying belief itself about the first drink. The belief was part of the intoxicating effect of the beverage. The belief that, once I had that drink, the afternoon would be tranquil, I could escape into serenity... the belief that the first drink was part of my right and heritage as a way to enjoy and truly experience the moment - whatever moment - a simcha, a summer day at the cottage. The belief that, just this once, I wasn't going to turn alcoholic into a problem.

You will find that most alcoholics who have properly worked their programme - if they ACCIDENTALLY take sip of alcohol, they don't go into binge mode. THEY VERY QUICKLY REALIZE THAT THEY ARE IN GRAVE DANGER AND CALL THEIR MENTOR. They get to a meeting. They discuss exactly what that sip did to them - if anything - and double up their security system.

BUT if an alcoholic INTENTIONALLY SIPS an alcoholic beverage, that belief itself is part of their drunken relapse... and they are 99.9% going to go into binge mode if not right then, at least within the week.

I guess I've never truly surrendered my sex addiction this way, truth be told. I've kept it separate from my alcohol addiction and just viewed it as a potential sex addiction to be monitored and re-programmed. If I truly surrendered the same way, that my belief about women and looking/getting massaged by them is part of the same destructiveness as alcohol, oh what then!

Incidentally this past week has been good to me. I am slowly surrendering to the possibility of dividing myself from my desires, accepting that they are not the same thing... that I don't have to follow my eyes all the time. now if only I could get my legs to some meetings...

obormottel wrote on 04 Jun 2012 03:11:


Funny...when I was writing it I wanted to put in the third pitfall and write:

"Borr # 3: Forgetting it completely" again...as sort of a joke.

Which reminds me of a great line I heard in the mikvah a few years ago when a guy was taking too long in the shower after saying "I'll be 2 minutes!". My (very) irate buddy complained, and someone said:

"Well, you know there are three kinds of people: those who are good at math and those who aren't."
;D

Rick Perry, is that you?

For the geeks out there:

"There are 10 kinds of people, those who know Binary and those who don't" ;D