This thread is a follow up of the thread entitled "reference list of relevant Gemoros".  This thread will be devoted to understanding chazal’s statements in succa daf 52.    These Gemoros are perhaps one of the most famous and comprehensive in dealing with and understanding the yetzer hara.Because there are quite a bunch of statements, I will begin by loosely translating each independent statement, leaving out the pasukim and any other information that may detract from the flow.  In cases that it is necessary to see the pasuk in order to understand the teaching, I will quote the pasuk and translate it.  Otherwise I will just make a reference to the fact that chazal quoted a pasuk.  By doing so, it will be easier for the reader to follow going forward.  I will include Rashi’s explanation where necessary.  I encourage everyone to look up the Gemara, even if you have seen it a billion times already.  Why not see it a billion and one times.  Now that we are baalei teshuvah, we will be able to understand the Torah we always knew and see it in a new light.  

After quoting all the gemaras, I will try as much as possible to break down the discussions into topics.  Meaning, there are a few gemaras that are all saying the same basic principle.  So I will discuss all of those in one shot.  

I also want to comment that this is not to be intended as a shiur setting where there is a one way street.  I intend for this to be a chaburah (group learning).  As much as I love sharing my few insights, I really love learning from others especially on gemaras that are so dear to me.  I do not view myself as someone who has all the answers and all the understanding.  What I can provide here is a bit of organization and food for thought.  But I do hope that the bulk of the wisdom and insight will come from all of us working together.   Feel free to make references to other sugyas in shas or any commentaries that you know of.  Feel free to post personal or not so personal stories that illustrate the gemara’s principle.  Feel free to provide your own personal insights.  And feel free to ask questions on the gemaras (as long as the purpose is to lead to proper understanding).

For the first few days, I will post a few gemaras at a time; just the pshat.  I will break up each main idea as a ‘section’.  I am doing this because there is so much there, it will be overwhelming to quote all gemaras in one shot.  In order to keep it orderly, I will constantly add to the original post, so please check back with that post.  After we have all absorbed the basic idea, we can begin to organize the yesodos and delve deeper.

I really want to thank again the maarganim (organizers) pintelle yid and berdichev for pushing for this.  And Thanks to the Guard for your gracious hospitality.  And of course thanks to the Ribono Shel Olem for assisting us in teshuvah by bringing us to GYE, which I am now nicknaming the “gates of teshuva”.  And thank you Hashem  for allowing all of us baalei teshuva to relearn your Torah in kedusha and Tahara together b’chaburah.    

I end with a plea to you Hashem:
May the zechus of the Torah enable an acceptance of our teshuva
May the zechus of the Torah inspire and push us for higher levels of teshuva
May the zechus of the Torah atone for our past and erase the decrees against us
May the zechus of the Torah help protect us from sin and the yetzer hara in the future
May the zechus of the Torah assist all of the holy struggling yidim on GYE and the rest of the world by removing their desires for lust
May the zechus of the Torah assist all of the holy struggling yidim on GYE and the rest of the world by giving them stronger hirhurei teshuva


May our burning desire for Torah replace our desires for lust
May our burning desire for Torah be awakened as we brush off our desires for lust

With tears in my eyes

Lover of all Jews,
Yaakov

Here are the sections.  Please check back here every few days for updates.  There will be 15 sections in total
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Section #1- Eulogy of the Yetzer Hara
Statement: The pasuk in zecharia makes a vague reference to a hesped (eulogy) that will take place in future times whereby men and women will be seated separately.  The Gemara quotes one opinion in the Gemara that understands that this will be the eulogy for the yetzer hara when it gets killed.
The Gemara asks: Why will there be a eulogy for the yetzer hara?  Why will people be crying? There should be joy to the world when the yetzer gets killed.
The Gemara Answers: We can understand this based on the statement of Rabbi Yehuda. 
Rabbi Yehuda:

• In the future times, Hashem will slaughter the yetzer hara in front of both the tzadikkim and reshaim.


• The tzadikkim will perceive the yetzer hara as a huge mountain.


• However, the reshaim will perceive the yetzer hara as a thin thread.


• Each one will cry.


• The tzadikkim will cry and bemoan, “How could we ever have conquered such a large mountain like this”. [Rashi explains further that they are crying as they remember their pain.]


• The reshaim will also cry and bemoan, “How could we have not conquered that small thread”.


• Hashem will also be shocked at them (not clear if it is referring to the tzaddim or reshaim).  The Gemara then proceeds to quote an ambiguous pasuk that supports that Hashem will be shocked at them.

Yaakov's Comment:

• What is the idea of Hashem Slaughtering the yetzer hara?


• Why does the yetzer hara look different to the tzadik and the rasha?


• Why are they both crying? The reason the Gemara presents does not seem to suffice.

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Section #2-Thin to Thick
Rabi Yosi: The yetzer hara starts off like a thin strand from a spider but in the end it will be like large heavy ropes that can pull a wagon.  The Gemara quotes a pasuk to support this idea.
Rashi explains:  if a person gives in to temptation, even a little bit, the yetzer will get stronger and stronger and eventually control him. 
Yaakov's Comment:

• Hmm…Sounds strikingly familiar to something in my life.  Hint hint.


• Why is the yetzer hara referred to as a string altogether?

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Section #3-The Seven Name of the Yetzer Hara
The yetzer hara has seven names.  Each name was assigned by someone else:

• Hashem: רע(Ra).  This is usually translated as evil or bad, neither is comfortable with me. The Gemara quotes a pasuk.


• Moshe:ערל (A’rel), barrier or covering.  The Gemara quotes a pasuk.


• Dovid:טמא (Tamei), impure. The Gemara quotes a pasuk.


• Shlomo:שונא(Sonei), enemy. The Gemara quotes a pasuk.


• Yeshaya:מכשול (Michshal), obstacle. The Gemara quotes a pasuk.


• Yechezkel:אבן(Even), stone. The Gemara quotes a pasuk.


• Yoel:צפוני(Tzafoni), concealed.  The Gemara quotes a pasuk.

Yaakov's Comment:

• What is the significance of each name?


• Are these seven different perspectives or seven aspects of the yetzer hara?


• What is the significance of the fact that Hashem called it Ra, Moshe called it A’rel, etc?  Meaning, is there a connection between who called it which name?


• How can Hashem call it Ra(Bad)?  Isn’t the purpose of the yetzer Hara to create bechira? Isn’t the greatest gift to mankind the gift of bechira?  If so, shouldn’t the yetzer hara be the ultimate Good in the world?

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Section #4-The Reward for Combating the Yetzer Hara With Torah
In the middle of the previous discussion, the Gemara mentioned that Shlomo referred to the yetzer hara as an enemy.  The Gemara expounds on the pasuk that it quoted and presents the following beautiful idea:
Mishlei 25 אם רעב שנאך האכילהו לחם ואם צמא השקהו מים כי גחלים אתה חותה על ראשו וה' ישלם לך
Translation: If your enemy is starving, feed him bread.  If he is thirsty, feed him water.  By doing so you are stirring hot coals on his head.  Hashem will pay you back.
The Gemara comments:אל תקרי ישלם לך אלא ישלימנו לך
Translation: Do not read the last words of the pasuk as “pay you back” but rather “He make you feel complete and at peace”
Rashi: The pasuk is teaching us the idea of combating the yetzer hara with Torah.  If your yetzer hara (who is your enemy) is hungry you should feed him bread, meaning Torah.  Torah is compared to bread.  If he is thirsty, feed him water, meaning Torah.  Torah is compared to water. If you do this it, you will burn the yetzer hara with coals.  Hashem will then make you at peace.  Meaning, he will turn your yetzer hara from an enemy into a friend. The yetzer will no longer try to sway you to sin and make you be lost from the world.
Chaim's Comment:

• What are the different aspects of Torah referred to as Water and Bread?


• How does each one deal with the YH?


• What do coals on the head of the YH mean? What happens to him?


• The coals seems connected with section #9 where the Torah is compared to Fire


• What does the YH contribute to me as a friend?

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Section #5-The Damage of the Yetzer Hara
At the end of section #3, the Gemara mentioned that Yoel referred to the yetzer hara as the concealed one.  The Gemara expounds on the pasuk that it quoted and will present a beautiful idea. To properly appreciate this teaching, I will present the reader with the necessary background.
Background:During the times of Yoel, the Yidden did some terrible aveira. Hashem sent locusts to the entire land of Israel, which brought economic disaster as the crops were all destroyed.  The pasukim describe with great emotion the trembling that these locusts brought to the people and the great destruction it brought to the land.  Yoel encouraged all the Yidden to do a mass teshuvah.  This was one of the most inspiring teshuva movements in all of Jewish history.    One will find in Yoel the most beautiful and moving pasukim in all of nach.  After Hashem accepted the Yidden’s teshuvah, he promised then prosperity.  The Navi proceeds to desribe how Hashem will rid the land from the locust.    It is on this pasuk that the Gemara will comment.  The pasuk reads as follows:
Yoel (2, 20):את הצפוני ארחיק מעליכם והדחתיו אל ארץ ציה ושוממה את פניו אל הים הקדמוני וסופו אל הים האחרון ועלה באשו ותעל צחנתו כי הגדיל לעשות
Translation:And I will remove the northern one (referring to the northern group locust) far away from you. I will then drive him into a barren and desolate land.  I will take its face (referring to the eastern group of locust) and drive it into the eastern sea (referring to the dead sea).  Its end (referring to the group in the west), I will drive it into the western sea (referring to the Mediterranean sea).  Its stench (from the dead locusts) will rise.  Its spoiled smell (from the remaining dead crops) will ascend.  (And why will hashem act so harshly against the locust) because it already did great things (great disaster).
The Gemara's Drasha:Now the Gemara will explain each part of the pasuk homiletically. The basic idea is that the pasuk is not only referring to the physical locust but on  a deeper level it is referring to the yetzer hara.

• ואת הצפוני ארחיק מעליכם [tr: And I will remove the [b]northern[/b] one (referring to the northern group locust) far away from you] – This refers to the yetzer hara that is hidden and stands in the heart of man. (chazal are learning from the word הצפוני , which can mean north or hidden. The literal interpretation is northern. And Chazal are learning homiletically that it refers to the yetzer hara. )


• והדחתיו אל ארץ ציה ושוממה [tr: I will then drive him into a barren and desolate land]  - I will drive the yetzer hara to a place where no man is found so that he can longer fight with them.


• את פניו אל הים הקדמוני [tr: I will take its face (referring to the eastern group of locust) and drive it into the eastern sea (referring to the dead sea)] – I am doing this because he had his eyes set on the first temple, destroyed it and killed talmidei chachamim.


• וסופו אל הים האחרון [tr: Its end (referring to the group in the west), I will drive it into the western sea (referring to the Mediterranean sea)] - I am doing this because he had his eyes set on the second temple, destroyed it and killed talmidei chachamim.


• ועלה באשו ותעל צחנתו [tr: Its stench (from the dead locusts) will rise.  Its spoiled smell (from the remaining dead crops) will ascend.] – I am doing this because he decided to ignore the goyim and put all his attention to fighting the Yidden.


• כי הגדיל לעשות [tr: because it already did great things (great disaster).] He put most of his attention to the talmidei chachamim in order to destroy them.

Yaakov’s Comment:

• How did Chazal interpret this pasuk as referring to the yetzer hara, when at face value it is referring to the locust?  Is there any connection from the allusion of Chazal(i.e. the yetzer hara) and the literal meaning (i.e. the locust)?


• Why does Hashem need to send the yetzer hara away from mankind; why doesn’t he simply kill him?


• Why does the Yetzer Hara have such a vested interest in the Talmidei Chachamim?

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Section #6 – Greater People Have a Greater Yetzer Hara
Story: Abayei once heard a man talking with a certain lady.  The man suggested to the lady that the two of them should take a walk together.  The woman agreed.  Abayei decided he will follow them in order to prevent them from sinning (as abayei could only imagine how he himself would react in such a situation).  He followed them during their entire walk.  At the end of the walk, the man said to the lady, “your company was very pleasant. Thanks for joining in my walk.  Now we have to each go our own way”.  Abayei was shocked that it ended uneventful and that they did not succumb to sin.  He then admitted to himself that if his own yetzer hara was with him, he would not succeed in fighting the temptations.  This made abayei depressed.  How could it be that this simpleton person was able to avoid sin, and abayei who was the Gadol Hador would be nichshal.  Until finally an old man (perhaps Eliyahu Hanavi) visited him and told him the following important principle.
Principle: כל הגדול מחבירו יצרו גדול הימנו   
Translation: He who is greater than his friend has a greater yetzer hara.
Yaakov’s Comment:

• What is the reasoning of this principle?


• What does this really mean?
 

• When we look at the world, it does seem to be true. 


• Could it be that Abayei would succumb to the sub human level and commit such a terrible sin?


• Why wouldn’t Abayei’s Torah protect him?

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Section #7 – Every Day the Yetzer Hara Increases
Rabbi Yitchak/Rabbi Shimon bein Lakish: Every day the the yetzer hara gets stronger and seeks to kill you. The Gemara quotes a pasuk.
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Section #8 – Must Rely On Hashem to Succeed
Continuation from previous section: Without Hashem’s help, it is impossible to succeed. The Gemara quotes a pasuk.
Yaakov’s Comment:

• Why? Doesn’t the Gemara say that everything is in G-d’s hand except for fear of the L-rd?  Isn’t one’s fight with the yetzer hara all about fearing the L-rd?


• Doesn’t this Gemara seem to negate free will?


• What should we do different knowing this Gemara?

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Section #9 – Combating the the Yetzer Hara with Torah
Rabbi Yishmael: If you meet up with the menuval (despicable one) pull him into the beis medrash.  If he is a stone, he will melt from Torah.  This is because the water can destroy stone and the Torah is water.  And if he is iron, he will explode from the Torah.  This is because the iron can explode from fire and the Torah is fire. The Gemara quotes a pasuk.
Yaakov’s Comment:

• Why label it as a’ menuval’?
 

• We normally label simply as ‘yetzer hara’. 


• What do chazal mean when they say if it a stone or if it is iron? 


• How come this trick does not seem to always work?

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Section #10 – Dual Loyalty of the Yetzer Hara
Rabbi Yonason: The yetzer hara sways a man in this world (to do bad) and in the next world will be the witness to testify against him regarding all his bad deeds in this world. The Gemara quotes a pasuk.
Yaakov’s Comment:

• Isn’t the yetzer hara part of us?
 

• If not, isn’t he at least a relative?
 

• If not isn’t he at least an enemy?


• And if so, how could he testify against us; the Halacha is that a relative and an enemy cannot testify.

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Section #11 – Internalizing the Yetzer Hara
Rav Hunah: There is a contradiction in pasukim from Hoshea. 
First Pasuk(Hoshea 4, 12): כי רוח זנונים התעה
Translation: The spirit of harlotry has caused them to make mistakes
Second Pasuk:לא יתנו מעלליהם לשוב אל אלכיהם כי רוח זנונים בקרבם ואת ה' לא ידעו 
Translation: They did take to heart their bad ways and to teshuvah because the spirit of harlotry is within them.
Comment: The Gemara is bothered because the first psauk presents the ‘spirit of harlotry’ as an external force that is fooling them.  But the second pasuk presents the ‘spirit of harlotry’ as an internal force that is implanted in the heart.
Yaakov’s comment:

• It starts as an external force.


• But if you do not fight the yetzer hara and give in to temptations, eventually it will become a part of you. This will become your real desire.


• And based on the pasuk, we see that when this happens, teshuvah is out of bounds and to the point where the heart no longer wants to know hashem.  Yikes!


• This is why addictive people have such a hard time just picking up and doing teshuvah.

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Section #12 – From Passerby to Master of the House
Rava: The yetzer hara is originally called a ‘passerby’.  He is then called a ‘guest’. He then becomes the ‘master of the house’.  The Gemara quotes a pasuk.
Yaakov’s Comment:

• This is another classic gemora for addiction. 


• The more we give in to the yetzer hara, the more control he has on our lives, where he eventually becomes the master of the house. 
  He takes the control away from us.  This is why addicts lack self control. Yikes!


• This is why our Holy Rabbis have told us that many addicts are considered as if they are coerced (ones) in their actions (Steipler, Arvei Nachal parshas Shlach, beis haleivi parshas bereishis to list a few).

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Section #13 – The More You Feed The More You Need
Rabbi Yochanan: Man has a small organ (the reproductive organ).  If he feeds it, it will become hungry.  If he starves it, it will become satiated.
Rashi: If man indulges in marital relations (albeit permissible, but there are limits) he will be weak at an old age.  If he starves his desires for marital relations, he will have strength at an old age.
Maharsha/Tosfos: The more man indulges in marital relations, the hungrier he will be for it.  And the more he starves his desires, the more satiated he will be.
Yaakov’s Comment:

• Is the Gemara suggesting that we completely refrain from marital relations?

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Section #14 – Hashem Regrets Creating the Yetzer Hara
Rav Chana Bar Acha: The more creations that Hashem ‘regrets’ creating. One of them is the yetzer hara
Pasuk(Micha 4, 6):אשר הרעתי
Rashi: The Gemara is interpreting the above pasuk as saying that Hashem takes the blame for the Yidden’s sin because he ‘caused’ the wickedness by creating the yetzer hara.
Yaakov’s Comment:

• What does it mean that Hashem ‘regrets’?
 

• If he regrets it, why did he create it?

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Section #15 – It is Not Completely our Fault
[u]Rabbi Yochanan[/u]: There are three pasukim that illustrate that the Yidden’s wrongdoings are partially to be ‘blamed’ on Hashem.  These pasukim are therefore testifying that it is not completely our fault.  Without the testimony of these pasukim, the Yidden would never be able to exist, as the blame would be too much.

• Micha 4, 6:אשר הרעתי


• Yirmiyahu 18, :הנה כחומר ביד היוצר כן אתם


• Yechezkel 36: והסירותי את לב האבן מבשרכם ונתתי לכם לב בשר 

Rav Papa: There is a fourth pasuk that portrays the same idea

• Yechezkel 36: ואת רוחי אתן בקרבכם

Yaakov’s Comment:

• Does this negate free choice?

R' Yakov, can I make you Rosh Yeshiva of the Beis Hamedrash Board?

Bardichev, Pintale and Nura can be the Magidai Shiurim...

I'll be the Mashgiach.... 

Amein on your most beautiful beautiful tefilah!
Bln I will read the shiurim and if I have anything worthwhile to contribute I will do so

Great idea Reb Guard!

Rosh Yeshiva he is!

Reb bardichev will be the Magid Shiur mainly in Simche & Chasidus.

Reb Pintele Will give a shiur in Tanya.

Reb London & Reb NB can give a great Shiur in Chizuk or anything else they feel they can really help out on.

Reb Dov Reb Dov! were are you? we need your input in Beis Medrash how about a shiur in Musar?

Reb Guard You really deserves to be the Rosh Yeshiva but "Retsoinoi shel odom zeh kevoidoi" so if you want to be the Mashgiach so be it.

Please anyone else out there who I forgot to mention please if you have anything you can give a shiur on please don't hesitate. we need all the Magidei Shiur that we can get. The Beis Medrash is getting more full by the day and we can use as much Torah as we can get.

Please leave your Low Self Esteem at home and come Fire Away! "Lo Abayshon Lomad!"

I am not very good at giving any shiurim so I will just Clean up after everyone if needed. I hope that by being in a Mokom Kodosh around such big giants that something will stick to me eventually  so that I will be able to share the info I pick up in Beis Medrash with others.

There's a known Moshol that this Smart guy arrived in a small town & saw that very few people live there. after asking around why it is that very few people live there he found out that it was because the water in that area wasn't very clean.

So this Chochom gave them an idea to build this big filter system and the problem will be solved.

So they did as he said and after a year or two the town was fully populated.

This Chochom comes back after a few years and sees the whole town burnt down. So he asks one of the towns people how it happened. so they tell him. "It's Your Great Idea That Burnt The City Down!"

Hows that? he asks? So they told him there was a small Fire in a house & they filtered the water & until they were able to get the water to the house the Whole Town burnt down.

Gevald! The Chochom yelled out! "WHEN THERE'S A FIRE YOU DON'T FILTER THE WATER! ANY WATER WILL DO!"

Raboisai! There's A Fire out there! Don't go around saying that your not in a level to give other people advise! Any water (Ein Mayim Elo Toiro) will do!

P.S.
Regarding the Magidei shiur, it's only one mans opinion!

The water fire moshol is great. Reminds me of this story.

Thanks Reb Guard for that link.

It is a Gavaldiger Success story.

E.L.

Firstly, I would like to announce that I added two more sections to the page.  Please scroll to the top of the page and you will see section 3,
The Seven Name of the Yetzer Hara and section 4, The Reward for Combating the Yetzer Hara With Torah.

As I stated at the start, I am currently only quoting the gemara with minor comments along the way.  After we are finished with all 15 can we begin to organize the basic yesodos and delve deeper.  But of course, feel free to ask obvious questions that are bothering you or that you feel need tp be addressed. 

Guard you made a mistake.  You asked me to be Rosh Yeshiva of the Beis Hamedrash Board.  This is not the "Milsa D'Badichase" thread.  :D But I laughed anyways.  Well I am sure happy to have such wonderful friends.

E.L.,
That was a great mashal.  Thanks. 

R' Yakov, I wasn't joking. If you plan to expound on all those sources over time and then organize them into Yesodos, that is a monumental undertaking! It could lead one day to a beautiful sefer, in both Hebrew and English, that can give Yidden a solid base from Chazal on how to deal with these Nisyonos. (We could call it "Nura Bei Yakov!")

If that's not worthy of making you Rosh Yeshiva of this board, what is?  :D

Rabosai,

I have added section 5 today.  You will notice that I also added my own comments as food for thought to get our motors running.  I also added comments to the previous sections, so please take a look.  Please think about these questions.  These are questions that I will address, with Hashem’s help, when we get into the Iyun mode of our discussion.  Right now we are just absorbing the basic ideas.  

I would greatly appreciate that if you have any other obvious (or not so obvious) questions that should be addressed on each Gemara, please post it in this thread.  I will then add it the main post.  Right now we are focused on absorbing the basic idea and asking basic questions.  These basic questions will be the foundation for a deeper understanding later on.  Torah is understood through a question/answer forum.  After we absorb the whole thing, we can begin to organize and process it deeper.

If you have any relevant sources that can help us understand these Gemaras, please email or PM me.  I have my own list of sources, but I am sure that the chabura has lots to add.  I will try to read through all the extra sources that you present me with and come to a thorough understanding of this big sugya.  As a note, you do not need to send me Maharal’s Nesiv HaYetzer, as that is my basic foundation of all these gemaras.  (Understaing the Maharal is another thing. sigh)  But if you know of other Maharal’s out there, it would be greatly appreciated.  

I have a few comments about sources. If you have a source, please ensure you present me with a precise source and ensure that its accuracy.  I would mostly appreciate sources that deal with the Gemara directly.  Please include the section (or sections) that your source is dealing with.  If the reason for the source is not so obvious, and you feel it is fundamental for proper understanding of the sugya, please give a brief explanation why you chose that source.  It would be easier for me to not have to start doing guess work on why you chose a particular source.

If you are scared off from my precise approach in learning, CHILL OUT!!!  I, of course, will welcome any comment from any person (including women).  We are all family.

If you see any editing mistakes please email or PM me those mistakes.  The same goes if you have formatting comments.

Last comment: If you have been reading these Gemaras and enjoying them, please post. I need the feedback to push me forward.

Ein Torah Niknas Ella B’Chaburah (Torah is only acquired in a group setting )

Ykv, your determination and deep understanding is very inspiring. I am pretty good at editing (I notice every little mistake) and I will make corrections in your posts if you give me permission. I have the rights on the forum to do it, but I am not comfortable doing it without permission (unless there is something inappropriate in a post). Let me know...

Thanks Ano. Yes you can edit my post on your own.  If you can remember to PM or email me with the changes afterward, it would be helpful.  If it is a word change, please clarify with me in advance.   

Reb Ykv,

I just reread sections #1-#5 and if this alone doesn't give you the title Rosh Yeshivah then nothing else will.

It is Solid!

Firstly the amount of Torah you know & Secondly the way you organized it & Thirdly the clarity you have & the way you explain it is Defiantly worth the Title Rosh Yeshiva.

And Yes! a Published sefer is were this is heading to.

E.L.

Sections 6 & 7 are in. We are more than half way done.  The remainder sections are shorter.

Thank you E.L. for your warm comments. 

B"H, I added sections 8-10 today.  Please feel free to comment on the gemara.  We have five more sections to go.