im 22, not married yet. not even dating.

so I was freaking out and Im very very nervous. im B"H on top of my addiction. I spoke to a Rabbi, and I even told my mother I want to see a therapist.... it took a lot of guts...whew!...

but looking to the future... is my marriage life screwed up before it even starts?
because ive had my share of seeing things thats not quite realistic.
I have been told that what you see in porn is not a reflection of what you really want. I hope thats true.
I hope to love the woman I marry and not treat her like an object.

is it possible that someone may try to "act out" what they see in these twisted fantasies?

It's not only possible but it happens all the time to the great detrmiment of marriages everywhere.  Sometimes the wife willingly goes along and sometimes not. Either way its bad stuff.

Now for the good news.

You are trying to get help.  Help is there to be gotten.  People who get help can get better.  People who get better have AWESOME marriages that are often much better than those of people who never needed help in the first place.

Congratulations on the start of a great marriage.  You may not have found the girl yet but your taking the steps toward it that are even more important. 

Interesting to see this as I type it but I think its true, we are the most important ingredient in determining the success of our marriage, not who we marry, but who we are when we marry.

Cool

Thanks for the opportunity to think about this and post.

I'm in a fairly similar situation to you and worry about the same thing.  I think that worrying about it will only make it worse, and when you find your besheret there will be a connection that if you are honest with yourself will exist outside the realm of lust and with the tools you learn here and in therapy you can definitely have a sucessful and happy marriage!

Jooboy, that was an excellent point you made, thanks!

thanks for the answers, I think im pretty ok...so far... I havent watched anything crazy but many times ive found myself searching for the clip that doesnt exist...

my lust begins usually with fantasies of being married and having a great relationship.( dont make fun...Im lonely...)
sometimes these fantasies dont even include sex. but sooner or later lust enters in. I then sometimes take this fantasy and bring it over to the internet where it gets twisted and upside down. I search for something passionate or normal but that gets zero results...porn has to be retarded of course...thats when i see worse stuff...

hope thats not considered too much info on this website....you guys are the ones who said to be open so..

anyhow this morning in the shower my Y"H tried getting me to "test" my feelings and see if they were normal. It wanted me to masturbate with no porn and see what I was thinking at the time to see of my thoughts and feelings were normal
except that this test is worthless and involved sinning.

I decided I would place my problems in Gods hands and do what im suppose to for now. So I jumped outta the shower...i may still have shampoo in my hair, but I didnt sin.

good result!

s4nh wrote on 29 Dec 2010 21:18:

Dear S,

I am sort of new around here too, but I've been married now for about 12 years, and I thank the RBS"O (and ask him for Siyata Dishmaya in the future) that somehow -regardless of my twisted fantasies -my relationship with my wife is totally separate from my problems; and our encounters are mutually fulfilling and very special. I don't know how, but I thank the RBS"O that it is so; and I plead with Him that it remain so.

One thing which has occurred to me, is that the reason for this is that  the P*** that's out there and all the fantasies are just that- fantasy. They don't even bear a resemblance to any real life scenario -most ceratinly not the real life of an Orthodox Jew. That is exactly what -subconsciously -lures us into these dark reaches of humanity; because the YH is trying to cause us to exit reality and replace it with his 'Olam HaDimyon'. It is well known that the P*** and lust addict regards women as objects, as over time he is desensitized to that sector of the human race, this due to his self centeredness when he is swept up with his lust -anything and anyone is a tool which can be used to support his habit, until he regains his sanity. Some of us have only temporary insanity, for some of us it's permanent until the recovery.

However, if the person is not as ravaged by the addiction -and your keen reading of the YH in the shower, coupled with your victory over him seems to be a sign that you fit this category -and his view of marriage is solid as a rock, he can properly fill his role as a GIVER not a taker. When I was a chassan, my madrich taught me that in all areas -and certainly when it comes to intimacy -my one and only mitzvah is that SHE should be happy, and that SHE have her needs taken care of; and that in such case I will be happy and satisfied. Therefore, even though I have other desires that sometimes overwhelm me despite all the Hashkafah I know, all the Torah I learn, all the Yiras Shamayim that I normally display in every area EXCEPT P*** and lust -which is why I consider myself an addict -THIS HAS NOTHING to do with HER and SHE doesn't have to suffer from MY problem. Moreover -knowing my own pre-marriage shortcomings when it comes to P*** and M*** -I knew one thing.... HERE I want to succeed (L'maaseh, I also thought at the time -mistakenly -that marriage would ease the problem...which it might have sometimes....but it definitely didn't SOLVE my problem). And Baruch Hashem, at least in this respect I merited to see the fulfillment of Chazal's guarantee: HaBa LeTaher -Mesay'in Lo.

Chazak VeEmatz,

E. Ben Durdayah   

thanks for your reply! it was comforting.
I asked someone if marriage helps and he said yes. another said no.

I think marriage does help...if one has an open relationship.  I compared the people I asked and saw one was more open and sweeter while the other lived in a world of secrecy..

after all your wife can watch you and make sure you dont fall... I will make my wife put a password on my internet if I have to...

I must caution you though...all the experts agree that marriage DOES NOT help. I also didn't say that marriage helps. Sometimes it can alleviate withdrawal symptoms of someone trying to ignore his addiction (generally such a person doesn't think he has an addiction), and therefore the addict thinks that his marriage helped his problem. I found that the truth is -despite BH my healthy relationship with my heilige spouse (who is really, and always was pure as the driven snow) -that I simply buried the issues that I had been struggling with for many years instead of dealing with them. And that is why I'm here today.

The conclusion being: although for the kind of people whose mind is healthy enough to live   the distinction which i made in my first post -their addiction, or if you aren't (or think you aren't) an addict their 'issues' may not impede making the most of a marriage by fulfilling their marital duties (and I am NOT referring to intimacy -I mean ALL of their marital duties); the only way to deal with a real issue (any real issue) is to deal with the issue itself. I don't think that somebody who had real issues with P*** and lust when he was single will find that marriage helped these issues. If anything they may have just gotten complacent... and the YH has time and patience.

The only way to deal with these issues for addicts is recovery, and for others -serious Chesbon HaNefesh, Avodas HaMiddos, and studying the areas of Torah and Mussar which deal with this YH. Oh gee, I guess that means recovery as well! So what? Don't get cold feet, just get well!

Yours,

E. Ben Durdayah

Whoaa...I don't know about this open business...

Lots of posts (and some by R' Dov) say that this kind of openness can do more harm than help.

If you want, research the subject here on the site -lots has been said about it in the past.

Generally speaking, sometimes talking about these things with a spouse can come as a shock. Sometimes even after it seems that they received the news with a sympathetic ear -they just didn't know how to react at first, and later they can feel hurt, insecure, and a host of other feelings.

A wife knowing nothing about your 'history' -if you can swing it -doesn't necessarily indicate an unopen relationship. Pardon the Mashal, but do you think of sharing the gory details of your bowel movements with your future spouse? Or forget about the details (color, texture, sorry for being gross); How about just talking about the fact that your human and you do that too. This too (i.e. telling her that you have had a problem in the past/present) is all about Shmutz that you want to get out of your system. Maybe there's no reason she should have to deal with this issue for better or for worse?

E.B.D.

Sorry brother, but according to what the professional here say, marriage ain't gana solve ur lust problem, 2 things can happen, either ur wife will go along with ur demands, than u got 2 lust addicts in the house, or 1 lust addict with a bashed lady who has no will or mind on her own, just a sex object floating around the house, or she will put up a front and u will wallow in ur addiction like never b4 and be worse than b4 getting married, so unless u r successfully beating this addiction while single I'd say not to rush into marriage, I myself also have sometimes this thoughts would have I married a better lady, things would be good, but I keep on hearing that this is not the case and since I haven't married yet the other sweeter lady I can't argue on that fact, so whatever u decide to do, ask hashem for siyata dismaya

It's an ironic situation - if you have fantasies coming from a healthy place, you can explore them with your wife, and you can both enjoy it. But as long as it's coming from Lust, you feel they're sick and twisted, and they will mess your life up.

And no matter what, you've gotta solve your Lust issue before you get married. Well, you don't have to, but if you want to build a happy marriage, then you do.

And one more thing - for many reasons, I don't think it's a good idea (or fair) that you make your wife into the shield for your Lust. It's not her job to stop you from acting out.

Never thought of it that way  :o.

i understand and I completely agree...i think... this frustrates me because I learn things here and then elsewhere people contradict it.

but i still think an open marriage is very healthy, from what I know...
I know a couple who almost fell apart, but after seeing a therapist they learned to be more open and it saved them.
open marriages always do better.

I think when the experts said marriage wont help, they meant dont think it will replace porn. obviously it wont. you have to be willing to work on it and get healing done, but a partner can help you.

Even on this forum ive read about people who gave their wives the password to the filters ect... (or is it etc?...i dunno)

I guess it also depends on your situation, how bad it is and what kind of wife you have..

If the help which marriage affords is someone to give your filter password to -save time, money and energy; I'll be glad to hold on to your password for you.

The million dollar question is: Who are those people elsewhere who tell you otherwise, when over here you seem to be hearing quite a number of people who have gone through these issues and are trying to work them out? What is the extent of their experience with what kind of problems?