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_ 05 Oct 2010 00:35 #79499

  • kadosh
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Last Edit: 20 Oct 2011 13:18 by .

Re: i am loosing the batle! 05 Oct 2010 01:21 #79503

Hello =). We feel depressed when we stop because we have been using p and m as an escape from our pain/loneliness/troubles.  We haven't really grown up and learned how to deal with life and its pains probably.. we found lust, and we saw that it work.. at least for a little bit... so its hard, until we learn to find ways to deal with life and its hurdles.  Working the 12 steps, over a period of time, would bring us new happiness, untold joy in life..
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Re: i am loosing the batle! 05 Oct 2010 02:23 #79510

  • jewinpain
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Kadosh, I 2nd BR, reb nachman says "em efsher lkalkel efsher ltaken" we just need to work it, I promise u that its possible to stop w/o taking medicine, try to dig in to the root of the problem now that u don't have all the bad sites handy, what's the trigger , & once u realize it, than u can adopt a plan on how to beat it, Depression has to be cut out from ur dictionary it may not exist in a Yid's heart, this is the what enables our addiction to grow & spread like crazy, even if u fell get up quick and zoom off that dirt site, try to post away whenever u feel week, get a sponsor/partner & u will see that over time things will ease out for u, there is no magic pill for that. But if there is a will there is a way, & we know the way here @ GYE, just gota stick to it
Hatzlucha, may hashem steer u in the right direction
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Re: i am loosing the batle! 05 Oct 2010 03:44 #79522

  • Holy Yid
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We should not get depressed because then we are less motivated to serve G-d. Being depressed after a sin is sometimes worse than the sin itself. That is because it brings us to feel worthless and do all kinds of other bad things.
זכרני נא, זכרני נא, וחזקני נא אך הפעם הזה, הפעם הזה, האלקים, ואנקמה נקם אחת משתי עיני, מפלשתים
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Re: i am loosing the batle! 05 Oct 2010 04:44 #79529

  • Dov
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Holy Yid wrote on 05 Oct 2010 03:44:

We should not get depressed because then we are less motivated to serve G-d. Being depressed after a sin is sometimes worse than the sin itself. That is because it brings us to feel worthless and do all kinds of other bad things.
So true! You are getting so much beautiful feedback here, 'Kadosh'. The only thing that will help is doing something with it. Thinking about it and even making hachlotos will likely do nothing at all. If making up one's mind were the answer, you, I, and all of us would have never screwed up in the first place, right?

Find a routine that works for you; recovery friends you can meet in person and on the phone, and behaviors you can do instead of messing around with 'the first drink'.

Hatzlocha. You are not alone!
"Off the 18-wheeler and fine on this tricycle!", "I do not particularly care exactly which "lav" suicide is. I'm not interested in it for other reasons...and you are probably the same."
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Re: i am loosing the batle! 05 Oct 2010 05:22 #79533

  • smile4life
First thing's first:  Assur Lehityaesh!!!!!.  This is not something you should be losing hope on.  Firstly, I am curious to know if you are married or not.  I am assuming you are not (because if you were this probably wouldn't be a huge problem except when you are not with your wife) in which case when you get married b'ezras Hashem this will all be gone.  And until then I will give you reeeeeeeeeaaaaaalllly really important advice which I am still struggling with like you but to have these things in midn are really important.  Firstly, do not let any hirhurim get into your mind.  If you let even one thought get in, it cannot get out (as you already know).  Sometimes people think that if you have been so used to looking at really inappropriate stuff and those imagines are so clear in your mind, then it doesn't really matter if you look at or read something only slightly slightly inappropriate (i'm not talking from a halachic perspective as that is pretty clear that it is assur).  But that cannot be further from the truth.  If you already stopped looking at pornography and the only issue is hirhurim and stuff just don't let it enter your mind.  don't let anything trigger you to let it enter your mind.  Just keep your mind focused on other issues and as long as that thought stays away then you won't have any need to destroy zera levatala.  But once that thought enters then it's only downhill from there.  Secondly, if you sleep in a place with other guys try to let yourself be seen at all times.  Like if you sleep in a room alone then sleep with the door open.  Even in your own house it may be a good idea.  In yeshiva there are guys that if they are alone in a room for Shabbos or something they will keep the door open.  believe me, you are far far far from the only one dealing with this problem and all you need is a little bit of chizzuk and you'll be able to overcome this.  Also, one more thought which at one point helped me deal with this issue is not to look at it as something disgusting, but rather to see the unbelievable miracle in the creation of the world.  That Hashem created each and every person with the ability to create other people.  literally to be partners with Hashem in the creation of the world.  In just one small drop there is the entire genetic makeup of a human being.  Therefore, I try to look at it as though I am abusing this unbelievable - really, unbelievable - power that Hashem gave me.  True power is when then power is only used appropriately.  Like I said, not to beat yourself up over it if you fail, but if you do fail to realize the tremendous power Hashem gave you and even to thank Hashem for giving you this power and to commit yourself not to do it again.  Once again, hatzlacha raba. 
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Re: i am loosing the batle! 08 Oct 2010 02:40 #79981

  • ben yaakov
dear s4l
from my personal experiance and from reading about this addiction it doesn't leave after marriage. The reason for this is because we don't know how to handle problems and issues that come.The addiction doesn't let us mature. when we get married we are still the same.
It is not because of lack of intimacy why we are addicted we don't even understand intimacy untill we handle, control and understand the adddiction.
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Re: i am loosing the batle! 08 Oct 2010 02:57 #79982

  • frumfiend
A quote from reb Hutner Zl sheva yippol tzadik vkom means in his words written in pachad yizchok michtovim lose the battle win the war. Thanks for the beautiful title of your thread. This title should be the title of the whole gye. There is no one here who hasnt lost hundreds if not thousands of battles. I think i have lost millions.
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Re: i am loosing the batle! 08 Oct 2010 05:04 #79989

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I so much agree with Frumfiend! But....ben yaakov wrote on 08 Oct 2010 02:40:

dear s4l
from my personal experiance and from reading about this addiction it doesn't leave after marriage. The reason for this is because we don't know how to handle problems and issues that come.The addiction doesn't let us mature. when we get married we are still the same.
It is not because of lack of intimacy why we are addicted we don't even understand intimacy untill we handle, control and understand the adddiction.

1- Hey, wait a minute there. Who paskened on this fellow that he is an addict? Maybe he is just a weak person who is getting slammed by the great pleasure of fantasy and masturbation and if he tries harder and smarter he may make it.

Chances are not that great, but...could be. I believe that being open to that possibility is very important, at least for me to keep my head and remain less of the judgmental know-it-all than I'd love to be.

An addict is unable to stop - his track record eventually teaches him this - hopefully before creating too much wreckage and destroying too many other people's lives. He (or she) is also suffering a great deal at the hands of the compulsion. Life is often looking acceptable on the outside, but truly nuts on the inside. And they are the only ones who can possibly decide whether or not they are addicts.

I completely reject the idea that any yid who uses porn (fantasy) and masturbates once in a while is "an addict". As far as I am concerned, that is ridiculous. The badness of the aveira does not convert in into an addiction - at least per the 1st of the 12 steps that I know of.

2- I have never met any guy who admitted he was an addict who got better by getting married. Maybe there are some, but I rather believe that this is often what happens to them:

Crazy over lust, they get married and drive their wives batty with sexual demands for decades. This remains behind closed door. No one finds out about it...until they finally give up either because their wives are tired of the disgusting idea of being treated as an 'receptacle' for their husbands to act out all their fantasies in - or the husband himself soon discovers that his poor, innocent wife cannot compete with the fantasy-woman (or women) burned into his heart.

The real success stories are of the men who are either addicts and in recovery, or were never addicts in the first place and grew up a bit after getting married. They learned what real life is like and let go of the childish fantasies - unlike myself. I did not do that. And here I am, totally unable to win the battle and yet sober today for the past 13 1/2 years, by His Chessed.
"Off the 18-wheeler and fine on this tricycle!", "I do not particularly care exactly which "lav" suicide is. I'm not interested in it for other reasons...and you are probably the same."
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Re: i am loosing the batle! 10 Oct 2010 19:28 #80138

  • Dov
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"Dan l'kaf zechus"? Why, I am an addict too! My track record has made it clear to me that winning the battle is not in the cards for me; that I am hopeless. As I posted to you the first time. And I believe that this is why I am sober today, thank-G-d. I could not let Him help me until I let Him help me rather than fight the battle myself.

If you feel you can win by trying harder (the way some people understand "sheva yipol...", then I have little to share with you. I wish you luck. But if you feel you have truly lost, then any addict can share his recovery with you and you'll be fine, if you want to be helped.

Ciao!
"Off the 18-wheeler and fine on this tricycle!", "I do not particularly care exactly which "lav" suicide is. I'm not interested in it for other reasons...and you are probably the same."
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Re: i am loosing the batle! 11 Oct 2010 04:03 #80168

  • Dov
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Keep asking, and in the mean-time, seek for the healthy connections.
"Off the 18-wheeler and fine on this tricycle!", "I do not particularly care exactly which "lav" suicide is. I'm not interested in it for other reasons...and you are probably the same."
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