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Hi,

I don't think that this is a religious thing (at least I had issues with minyan and homework). Think of it, procrastination is probably effecting you in material ways. You are probably not as productive as you could/should be. Procrastination can be triggered by fear and/or insecurity and/or avoidance. In my situation, it was avoidance. There are many people here that mentioned that they procrastinate but I'm sure that most people have it under control.

I wrote this to someone else (and pasted it here).

There are several practical things that I do.

1) I make myself a list of priorities and force myself to stick to it. I used to be all over the place. I would start something but would then intentionally distract myself. I would look for something that needs to be done which is less annoying. I messed up on several assignments and therefore decided to start this habit. I don't allow myself to start a new thing until I finish the first thing on my list.

2) When I started to work on this problem, I used to log all my daily activities in detail and would give it to my brother. P & M were logged as "wasting computer time". I was at first embarrassed from myself but eventually my bro really gave it to me (we are really close) and he got on top of it. This only works if you are comfortable with criticism (it can make things worse for some people).

3) I strongly believe that if I get my P & M under control it will help as well. It's not that I spend so much time doing it but it is the lack of self discipline that is so destructive for me. The urge for sex is obviously so much stronger so I'm making a kal vchomer  .

4) I read the enneagram  once on a flight and I really got hooked. I find it to be extremely accurate and it enables me to catch myself in the act of a typical negative pattern that someone like me is prone to do. Generally speaking my personality type has a problem with dealing directly with issues (for example, will have a very difficult time saying "no"). It explains why etc. and it is so accurate that it is almost scary. I was also able to better understand the needs and insecurities of  myself and others because of it.

5) I started using K9s internet block. You can set it to block all internet access for x amount of time. Getting a notice of a new email or checking GYE can be a major distraction.

These things worked for me. I'm not perfect and it will probably be my nisayon for life. I always say that even though it is difficult, I have to be thankful that my life is in order, and that it is doable. Many people have nisyonot that are much more difficult and potentially destructive (like jealousy, anger, greed, stinginess etc). We all have our own nisyonot and that is what we are here for (I'm talking to myself).

Anyway, I hope that this helps. If you have any questions or would like to discuss it, don't hesitate to contact me. 

on item 4-just to say the enneagram is very deep and very true .I learned a great deal about myself from it

it is all connected.... the avoidance and fear of real life spurs us to act out in addiction and results in isolation and consumes our kochos,leaving us with very little energy,sleep deprived,without eating properly,not getting exercise and feeling depressed. then the cycle goes veiter because we feel down then we slow down and get distracted and do not accomplish anything wothwhile and then we don't make goals b/c we are afraid of failure.
u mentioned some profound ideas which are actually part of the solution
how can I overcome this laziness, because it has become second nature for me not to deal with the world
the ba'alei mussar would say true , hergel na'aseh teva
but here is the key hergel is also na'aseh teva sheini.

btw in my humble opinion,u need to pick out some small baby step goals and work on them perhaps running when it is time to go to daven or shiur or if possible trying to get to davening earlier (i know it requires superhuman efforts) or how about getting out of bed in the morning like a soldier ready for battle (saw this in a Kelmer sefer of kabalos) was too hard for me even to do once a week. after all my atzlus is a lot more firmly entrenched than yours. i was once diagnossed with Avoidant Personality disorder l.o.l. .....

I haven't yet "given my life over to the will of G-d",
this is another part of the solution.....however it is a lifelong process...not sure how the 12 step people look at it but al pi mussar we have to continually  train ourselves to do the ratzon Hashem ,even  if we don't feel like it (what an unAmerican concept!!!)
i did once hear  someone say at a 12 step meeting  we need to  put down the drug then do the next right thing
one last note this all or nothing thinking is part of the disease /Y.H. talking to us. -if we can't be perfect then we are a failure .that drives the atzlus as well.
Anyway,be gentle on youself.
Bracho V'Hatzlocho.
btw u have exhibited high energy spurts like when u started writing the the fourth step work and don't u have a history of accomplishment in learning if u went from B.T. yeshiva to a regular yeshiva in a matter of weeks. and what about getting into NYU-didn't that take dilligent efforts?  Yasher Koach on your posts on the forum that also is something to feel good about.

I just read through this thread...
You started off with the question of what to do with laziness and procrastination....

From your last post it sounds like you are not lazy at all...

Bechori Reuven wrote on 14 Jul 2010 02:07:


You tried everything you can: You Promised, You begged Hashem, You even tried pills...

You don't deserve to be thrown out of Yeshiva. It doesn't take love to keep you, it takes basic decency...

I was in your very shoes during my Yeshiva days....
I relate to everything you describe throughout this site...
I know you wont believe me but I'll say it anyway:
THERE IS HOPE. YOU CAN OVER TIME PULL OUT OF THIS.

I didn't believe it when I was in your shoes....

Much Success

I'm pretty lazy too. I think there is a link to the addiction: There are things we prefer to do other than what's required of us. That's the Y"H" talking. What was that quote? Idle hands are the devils best friend. Something like that.

I'm half way through reading "Taking Action.The joyful art of zerizus" (Artscroll, Rabbi Zelig Pliskin).
He has many great tips, most are very simple.
E.g. Make to-do lists, but at the top write "To Do With Joy  ".
This will increase your joy when you set out doing these taks, and if you enjoy them more it will be easier for you to do them.

"self centered and not G-d centered" - more like "body centered and not sould centered".
Your soul wants to do great things, but your body seeks comfort. Who's running the show? You or your urges?

Just adding my two cents, because I'm an obsessive compulsive adder.

In my experience I have not seen that addicts are more lazy than anyone else.  I personally have run to go look at porn and other lust activities - laziness never seemed to get in the way.

The fact is atzlus is a part of the natural physical makeup of EVERY human being.  The mesilas yesharim discusses thin in Middas Hazrizus.  There is no such think as a person who does not have laziness as part of their basic makeup.  Our challenge is to overcome it.

- this is difficult for a person to jugde himself. - I sometimes look back at times when I thought I was happy but it was only superficial joy, not a deep happyness.

A good place to start is to define depression.
Google gives the following definition: "a mental state characterized by a pessimistic sense of inadequacy and a despondent lack of activity"
I'm sure there are various other definitions out there.

"Can I possibly be happier than I am now?" - only a fool would answer "no".

My opinion is that if a person doesn't feel like getting important things done e.g. no longer cares to go to work, or the person sees no point to being alive, then that person is probably suffering from depression and should do something about it.

Being lazy is when you lay in bed (or whereever) because it's more comfortable and wait for the very last minute before taking action.

I don't know where you're at (so perhaps this is too basic), but here's a good read:
www.aish.com/sp/f/48968911.html

ToAdd

Hey Bechori, I think I can join your laziness and procrastination club, lol.

I think there is a link between laziness and falling, bc everytime I start slacking with my learning and wasting time 'enjoying myself', then I notice that sooner or later I fall.

Every day when I wake up, I say to myself, "Thank you God for giving me a day of sobriety. I know that if I don't work as hard as I can to break free, I'm endangering myself." I guess it's a case of doing everything we can (the total character transformation that Guard talks about) and letting God do the rest.

The habits that I picked up as a result of being addicted to masturbation will take years to replace with good ones. All we can do is to set goals (both long, medium and short-term) and work our way towards them everyday. Maybe it would help every now and again if you just review your progress and if you're still falling short of your targets then you need to ask yourself why that's happening. No pain no gain mate.

A friend once said to me, "Masturbation is like procrastination. It feels good until you realise you're just f**king yourself." I think the same applies to the withdrawal from reality in which addicts like to indulge.

KUTGW (that applies to both of us) and TC,

DL 

Lol


Well, anyone that "thinks" they can join is welcome to be a member.
The problem is, we've never managed to get a meeting started...
On what day does the procrastinators club hold its meetings?
Tomorrow.

Reminds me that a few people who were talk addicts (they couldn't stop talking and went on and on and on...) started a fellowship called OnAnon....

The problem is that they are still in middle of their first meeting!!!! ;D ;D ;D

Sounds like you already have the answer:  keep working the steps.  The steps are designed to get us out of ourselves, and start living a life of service to others and to G-d.  If you keep working the steps you will eventually succeed.  But you may need to step up your program a notch or two.  The more effort you put in, the more you will conquer your laziness.  Do you have a sponsor?  Do you go to meetings?  Do you make phone calls?  Do you know of any other sexaholics who you can help?  These are all things which assist in our recovery and make us into different people.  You will become a new person as long as you stay on the course. But it's up to you how fast that change will occur.  And it's all about how much effort you put into it.  So keep it up!  You sound like youre doing great and you're definitely on the right path!  Thanks for your post!

To ToAdd:

Hey mate, it's uplifting to know that even if my post didn't help anybody, it did bring a smile to somebody's face, lol. I'm glad you appreciate my sense of humour.

I hope everything is going well.

TC and I really need to hit the sack cos it's half past one in the morning.

DL