I am desperatejew, and I am an addict.

Last time I introduced myself, I said the same thing. That was months ago. I posted periodically, felt good, stayed clean, made the 90 mark, and then... I fell. Hard.

So, I want to try this again. I want to try to post here without thinking what others will think and without trying to say the right thing. I want this to be my open book. I hope I have the courage to do this with you all.

I am 29, married for under 10 years and have 4 healthy, wonderful children. My wife is a wonderful mother to them and I am blessed for that. I wish I could say the same about our marriage.

I have been using for about 14 years. Wow. It's shocking to put that down in writing. That is a long time. I had periods of daily abuse and periods of lengthy 'control'. Even more than a year, at a time.

Of course as an addict, I think that I am the only one facing my specific circumstances and therefore, none of you can truly relate. And it's true  . Here's what I mean. I am faced with a wife that is totally unsupportive of me. We have spent months and thousands of dollars (that we don't have) on marriage counselors, to no avail. As a matter of fact, anyone that I have spoken to me, recognizes that I am in a tough situation. A typical marriage should have at least something positive. Emotional, intellectual or sexual relationships are some of the key things that keep a relationship going. Some have one or to but not the other. So they go to therapy to figure it out. I have none. Even our marriage counselor said he feels bad for me.

I know what you may say about my addiction affecting my view on marriage and that once I stop trying to take, and start giving, I will be loved. Honest to goodness, I've done that for years. I don't want you to think that I am excusing myself. I am just setting the record straight as to who I am and what i deal with, for future reference.

In my latest fall, an interesting thing emerged. I was not surfing the web searching for ways to act out. Besides in one way. I wanted to chat with people. I wanted to connect with someone that would hear me out. I wanted to talk to people who would relate. And of course, I wanted to chat with people who would lust after me.

So, I justified it by saying to myself 'Hey, you don't get any attention at home, so it's okay to talk to others online.'

I'm embarrassed to say that the only reason I stopped the madness of this past week is because my wife asked me if anything was going on. I said to myself "Heck, why lie? Just tell her!' And I did.

I just realized how much I've been rambling so I don't know if anyone will even be reading this to the end. If you did, thank you!

As I said, this is just a way for me to keep an open book with the hopes that some of you might care enough to support me through this.

With love to you all,

DJ

I didn't read your first post and i'm not quite in your position. But I feel your pain. At least somewhat. I honestly do. In my case it happens to be my mother. No matter. STAY STRONG. Maybe some other guys will come on and post something inspiring but if you need a shoulder to cry on and/or an ear to vent to, i'm here and i'm hanging onto your every word. Email me or message me on google chat. ma ccabee5770@gmail.com

DesperateJew wrote on 09 Jun 2010 02:17:


You told your wife you were searching the web to find somebody to connect to because you had no one to connect to at home?

And she said?

DesperateJew wrote on 09 Jun 2010 02:17:

Wow. There's lots in your story. The part where my jaw dropped was where you saw no more point in continuing to withhold the truth from your wife. Wow. It speaks volumes about you and about your marriage.

And then, she understood and you can each play some role in where things go from here. Wow again. It speaks volumes about her and about your marriage.

It's quite possible that she'll be a little more "freaked" right now than she appears. (At least from all the stories I've seen posted on GYE.) My advice -- don't leave her alone in her shock and pain, just because you're tackling your own. Be her rock. Compliment her body. Buy little presents. Leave post-it notes of love on the bathroom mirror. Just... be. Together.

But don't confuse her quiet support with really being behind all this. Women don't see this stuff like men do. Period. But REMEMBER WHAT A BRACHA YOU HAVE, THAT YOU HAVE HER AT YOUR SIDE. [AND THAT YOU CAUGHT IT BEFORE YOU MIGHT, CH'V, HAVE LOST HER.]

Desperate

Well we did read your whole post (although with different conclusions) we would like to offer you some assistance but we could use some more info.

You still there?

Briut wrote on 09 Jun 2010 14:15:

Yep, me and me3 (?) are jumping to opposite conclusions about what happened when you told The Wife. The chevra's reflections back to you might be VERY different, depending on how that conversation went and what happened afterwards.

Could you fill us in? RSVP. Thanks SO much, and accept my best wishes for your shalom bayis and that your challenges in life will feel easier than at present.

Maccabbee, thanks! I wasn't much of a poster in the past so you didn't miss much.

Briut, I'm afraid you misunderstood me. Me3, sorry for the delay in responding.

She is not supportive at all(, and I feel has never been of anything in our marriage).

Before first joining GYE, she discovered that I had been chatting with people online. That is how I ended up on here. Recently, she sensed something was up, but did not have any proof. When she confronted me, all I told her was "It's the same as last time." I did not tell her why I chose to chat with people.

Again, our marriage stinks, and I am not so sure that the typical "if you work on your addiction, your marriage will be better" applies here.

I hope this brings more clarity to my situation.

Well maybe you should have told her that you chat on line because you have no one to connect to at home? I don't know if that would help but it would certainly lay it all out on the table, but then again if you have already been to therapy and you have not gotten past this, I'm not sure what to do.

But what I don't understand is your wife's perspective? Does she think she is being supportive? Why is she being so accusatory about you chatting with other people (Not condoning this) doesn't she have issues with your relationship too?

I hear your pain. I too struggle with Shalom Bayis. Sounds like u value your wife's parenting abilities.  Surprised that u told your wife. How does she feel about your acting out?
I also hear your lonliness . I have been interacting with the guys on the forum a lot to the point of not leaving work until late and causing my wife to be suspisious and upset.

I am not an expert,but for straters in recovery ,u need to accept and respect youself even if others including wifey and children dont. She probably insults u in front of the children.
the other thing is for u to "clean up you side of the steet... meaning that even if she does'nt. Therapy is not magic and recovery take a lot of work. Start by accepting youself as a respectable tzelem elokim despite that fact that u have made mistakes and have an addiction.  let me know how you are doing . my heart goes out to u.

Chazal say regarding eshes Korach "Eveles B'yadeha t'harseneh. A 'fool"(one who despises chochma and mussar) will use her hands ,which are normally used for creating, to destroy her bayis contrasted to a Chachamoh who can build her house with chachmah alone.

Hey DJ!

Welcome (again)! I feel your pain because chatting was also one of my posions. It might have to do with inability to be close and intimate. I would hardly blame it on someone else thought. I think that we all have alot of potential here and if we really and truly work on ourselves then we will see the world around us change simultaneously. Obviously something's not right with us so lets take it one Middah at a time and try to get better. If you want you can PM or email me or we can gchat more.

Work hard and really be honest with yourself.

-Yiddle

I read DJ's story with great interest. I can't understand what she is not supportive about. You say your therapist feels bad for you. I know of a therapist who is a real tzaddik and is probably the expert on Shalom bayis. Where do you live, may I ask. Please PM me for the info. But I just would like to say my own piece. Read the Garden Of Peace By Rav Arush. He writes that the man has to be supportive. Its in the chapter called "Be A Man". Now I don't want to be scolding you, but think about it. Maybe your not to expect her to be supportive. that's your job. But i believe that if you are supportive she will reciprocate.

Well, I'm sorry I misread your post and assumed that 'coming out' to her had a positive result. Ouch.

Even so, you KNOW you need to stay connected to her. You need to give HER what SHE's needing. You need to "be a man" (as our buddy quoted Rabbi Arush) so that she feels secure as a wife and woman.

I wish I had a better feel for something good to say. I'm sorta lost. But like so many of us here, I'm guessing you might already have that perfect partner, right in front of you. Getting that going might be excruciatingly painful, but I'll bet it IS related to our GYE work and not a side topic for distraction.

Keep writing, bro. You'll bump into something good here. I'm sure.

The support is truly helpful! Thank you all for responding.

I don't want to disagree with Rabbi Arush, but I would like to disagree with those that are saying that I should apply that  here.

Hear me out: We, as addicts, can't say that we can deal with our addiction by way of X, Y or Z (which are not the way to deal with it). We have to recognize that some people who are not suffering from the same thing we are can use X, Y and Z as a tool to overcoming their issues but not us!

Similarly with marriage (or mine at least), I have to realize that I have been a good husband, albeit with human faults, and that there may be bigger issues than simply saying give her more and love her more. I'm sure Rabbi Arush's solution works brilliantly for many, but it hasn't worked for me.

Anyways, BH today has been a smooth sailing day. I am so stoked in my newfound interest of dealing with this. My wife is not happy about it (that's a good thing, I guess. would I want her to be happy when she found out?) still. But she is asking me questions.

I, on the other hand, am starting to be happy that she found out. Our marriage didn't take a major hit, as it is pretty bad. However, it [she] did force me to seek help. I am hopeful that with seeing a therapist about my addiction, I will finally face many demons that plague me. Laziness, procrastination, fear of failure, etc. (Sound familiar to anyone? )

GTG, but thanks for listening!

Desperate Jew, shalom.

I wish you the best in all the steps you take. I am sure it is all going to come together for you and your home will be a beacon of shalom bayis. I would like to give you just a tiny bit of advice: love your wife. Even if the love is not reciprocated, by all means possible and with every resource at your disposal, love your wife. Not with money or with attention, just love her with your heart. Make it a point about which there is no negotiating, even more absolute than your cares for your own life: love your wife. If you truly apply yourself with your heart, you will find ways to slowly win her over.

This could take a very long time. The important thing is that you do not give up. I can sense the resignation in your words, and you may feel that you are justified, but you are not. You can continue to love your wife, and this is the proof that giving up is not justified.

I also suggest you strenthen yourself with affirmations on your good points. Remind yourself of your good points. Console yourself and encourage yourself. If environment is so rough, you'll need to affirm yourself very often. But it is all worth it.

You have a great wealth of support here. This site has your back. You have everything you need to make it. It may be difficult, but if you persevere, you'll see that you have slowly paved the way for a healthy environment in your mind and in your home. The important thing is not to give up and to rely on all of the help G-d is putting in your way. R' Nachman teaches that a fall is for the purpose of an ascent. I have witnessed this first hand.

Be obstinate in loving your wife. If she refuses you, love from far away, in your heart. Whatever you do, don't stop loving her deeply in your heart. Eventually, she will let you get close again. R' Noson teaches that we should not force the hour. Stay outside and cry at the gates. Eventually, G-d will open them. But do not force the hour. And do not give up.

Much success, hatzlocha rabbah. Keep your head up and do not give up. You will make it. 

DesperateJew wrote on 09 Jun 2010 18:43:


Pardon me, my friend - I am an addict, and so, hope you know that I am a friend - but, what the hell does "I am not so sure" mean? Please forgive my hard words, but I figure: what do you have to lose, really?

The counseling has not bore fruit, now what? Recovery that 'might not work' anyway?

So, you have not really tried it, right? Otherwise why are you not sure yet that it does not work? And by the same token, you still do not know whether your cleaning up of your own side of the street has the power to save it all for you or not, correct? I know that you describe your marriage as stinky, but how precious is saving and improving your marriage and family life to you? If it doesn't rank very high for you, then who can blame the wife for being un-supportive? Just an observation. We generally get what we pay for. If you want it, then you need to pay, without any thought about her stuff. She has nothing to do with your work.

Maybe your marriage always was very precious to you, but because she didn't give a rat's pa-toot for it from day one, you lost interest in it....but is that the way it really was? Or, does she see it as having been the other way around: that she struggled to make something out of your marriage from the start but with her perception that her husband was more concerned about his penis than with her, the relationship got more and more silly until she gave up a while ago in disgust. And now you just see her as "un-supportive of you". Something is missing here, DJ.

Or did you mean something else entirely?

It took us about a year and a half until my wife stopped yelling at me for going to SA meetings - every time. It took us about five years till we both felt that our marriage was back on solid ground. And I was sober the entire time and working my steps (poorly, but working them). It was worth every day of that time and things got slowly better every day, whether I realized it or not.

There is shared and unshared pain. She has hers, you obviously have yours, and painful people generally need to become a lot less sore before they can hold hands again.

Whether I misread you or not, I hope you consider giving your sobriety the far priority ahead of your marriage, that you stay sober one day at a time, work the steps (if you choose to go that way), and learn how to focus on being a sober, safe husband for this mother of your children. Apparently she cares enough to "force" you to seek help. Nu, she cares. That's worth a lot.

Hatzlocha and if you hate me, just pretend I don't exist.