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When I see a beautiful woman...
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TOPIC: When I see a beautiful woman... 987 Views

When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 02:20 #58919

  • DJ
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As I understand it, I am never supposed to 'fight' with my YH. I am supposed to understand that I am powerless and place my fight in the hands of Hashem.

What then is to be my thought process when I see a beautiful woman who could be a trigger?

I try to push it out of my head and fight with the mental image. Surely there is a better way then putting up a fight. Can you share what has worked for you?
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 12:16 #58945

  • 123.trying.123
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Can't say what does work...

But from my own experiences I've found that pushing out a thought is simply not possible....

When I get thoughts that I hate, I know (Now -after many years of not knowing) that being upset for having it is OK, but to fight it.... Wont work...

At least with me, when I accept the thought, I can then try to just get busy with other things....

I think acceptance is crucial...

When R' Pinchus Sheinberg was asked by someone that was obbsesed with thought about how to stop...
R' Sheinberg said: "I also get thoughts that I'd wish I didn't... But I just let it be and let it float out of the other side of my head... you get so caught up with it that it can't leave the other end...."

Hatzlacha...
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 12:50 #58952

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dont try controlling your mind - just look away: this is a physical issue that you are more in control of.
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 13:27 #58962

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I am getting better at just looking the other way. Yet you can't deny what you just saw.

Is there anything to think to turn it positive instead of a thought that you are trying to banish?
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 13:59 #58967

  • bardichev
Say nothing

Just look away

The looking away even even if it is slowly is very painful and is a huge merit.

If you can't look away bite ur lip(hard) so you don't have maximum pleasure

There are no easy ways out

The nesivos shalom calls these situations "pachaz allav yitzro"

And the only thing that works is mesiras nefesh

What is mesiras nefesh only you know

KEEP ON TRUCKING!!!
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 16:07 #58988

  • Holy Yid
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DON'T BANISH ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you BANISH the thought it only gets STRONGER!!!!!!!!!!!!! And it will take over your mind, you will spend the whole day trying to BANISH it and it will keep getting stronger and STRONGER AND STRONGER and you will lose.

So you might ask but then it is HOPELESS, I have nothing to FIGHT with.

If you think that then you have made progress. REAL PROGRESS!

We don't fight these thoughts we let them be and we move on. I try to GENTLY move my mind to another topic. Focus on that thought gently let it stay there, rest there hover there.

When I feel an urge I do nothing. I say I am doing nothing now.

Other times I let go over the urge and 'give it to Hashem' I don't fight it I let it go up. I 'take the whole thing ang give it away'.

These might sound like strange ideas and very vague but try to think about them and what they could mean to you. Experiment with different things that you think could be giving the urge to Hashem, and not fighting.

In a day or to you will have a better idea what all this means.

Go out and try this and then come back and tell me what you learned
זכרני נא, זכרני נא, וחזקני נא אך הפעם הזה, הפעם הזה, האלקים, ואנקמה נקם אחת משתי עיני, מפלשתים
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 16:21 #58992

  • rashkebehag
I look away and then think about what a great thing i just accomplished. Those thoughts preoccupy me so much that I forget about the woman
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 16:27 #58996

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Hey,

Look away. By doing that you are doing more than you think. If you make your habbit took look away, then it becomes your knee-jerk reaction. Trust it has worked with me. Work hard on it for a while and soon you will see that you naturally look away. The hard part is not taking the second look. The first look wasnt your fault, but the second look is. So what I would say for that is think about your actions throughout the day. Dont do things on whim. Take even 2 seconds to thinka bout what your doing. This too will engrave into your mind that you need to think before doing anything (like the Mesillas Yesharim says we shoudl be doing anyway). Then once you look away for the first time, you think about what your about to do and wont look back the second time. This all takes work on your part though. Be diligent and stubborn (in this area) and you can do it.

Have a great Shabbos!

-Yiddle
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 16:32 #58997

  • hopefull
hey desperate

im a newbie here too and the whole idea of letting hashem fight your battles was also strange to me, at first

i also get upset when i see a woman that can trigger desire

however, i realized that trying to fight it wont really help

you just say to yourself " ok i tried and its not working" then look up to sky and say " dear g-d i cant fight my own battles therefore i give them over to you"

it works like magic, i didnt believe it at first, but im telling you man it works wonders

its so liberating not to be subjective to your desires

also when i stop at a red light or stop sign i take off my glasses and focus on something else

chazak v'emutz
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 16:38 #59000

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I have also realized that the triggering part of seeng a woman is not in the first moment. Its any time after that. Dont let the sight of her linger. Move your head, close youres, put your hand over your eyes. But its crucial to turn away after the first moment of sight.
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 17:25 #59004

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When I see an attractive women, I look away and say Yes! Score 1 for Me3. If I see one who is really disturbing by the way she dresses, I say

SHE MAY BE A PROBLEM BUT SHE AINT YOUR PROBLEM!
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 17:45 #59009

  • bardichev
Gevaldigggggggggg

Lesson well leared

I hope you didn't pay as much tuition as me
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 19:18 #59020

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Thank you all for your responses. Many of them resonate with me.

I have become pretty good at rejecting the desire for that second look. It is true. It feels great. My question was about the following thoughts and I appreciate the answers that I got.

I remember reading someone posting something about appreciating the beauty that Hashem made when seeing a beautiful woman. Is that a good idea? I suspect that it will be difficult to focus on the beauty of Hashem more than the beauty of the woman. I lean toward staying away from that. Agreed?
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 19 Mar 2010 20:21 #59023

  • commando612
I think your comment about turning it into something positive like appreciating the beauty of Hashem is a great idea, and the only way which is a long-term solution which will avoid depression or other problems. Hashem is the source of all beauty, and we can connect with that beauty either in this world through holy ways or in the next world. If you feel a burning passion in you, you could use that passion to serve Hashem immediately in whatever way you feel. This has sometimes worked for me.

There's a Gemorah somewhere about one of our sages who saw a beautiful woman while on the Har Habayis and made a bracha to Hashem over her beauty. Maybe the Gemorah there is telling us it was on the Har Habayis to teach us that he was already in a "Har Habayis" state of mind (because on the Har Habayis you need to be in a certain frame of mind in awe of Hashem).

Remember, the Yetzer Hora thrives with a state of sadness. We need to find a way to remain with Simcha and fight our urges. Don't misunderstand me - I'm not at all saying to stare at her. But your question was what to do after you've already seen her.

I was actually in the middle of writing something to another ongoing discussion about "do men married to attractive women have less of a problem", so instead I'll paste my thoughts here because it's essentially the same topic:

If you had all your visual memories of women erased and then were marooned on a desert island with a kind wife who isn't attractive, you'd probably manage to have a happy relationship with her.

The problem is not that we lack what we need. The problem is that the other possibilities we see kill us. Both single and married people are constantly bombarded day after day seeing women (or pictures of women) whom we're attracted to but we can't have. Everywhere we go. A walk to the supermarket, to shul, at a wedding. And you never know when another one will pop up. Sometimes they're fleeting passersby, and sometimes they're your new neighbor who you'll see every day.

When we see something we want but can't have, that feels very uncomfortable. Kids will tantrum. Adults have learned other ways to deal with not getting what they want, sometimes constructive ways and sometimes destructive ways. If we don't have the right self-awareness, Hashkafas, and methods to deal with all the feelings this generates, our lives are going to be miserable. If we're single, we'll be searching for the woman who we think will take our mind off all these other women (and that may work till after Sheva Brochos). If we're married, we'll be either frustrated, angry, sad, maybe wondering why we married plain jane when we perhaps could have married a more attractive woman, maybe wondering why the girl who seemed attractive during dating seems unattractive now.
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Re: When I see a beautiful woman... 20 Mar 2010 19:32 #59030

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Dov talks about getting out of "take" mode and going into "give" mode, by praying for the woman you were triggered by (after turning away, of course) to have everything good in life... In other words, not to see how we can "use" her image for ourselves, but rather do for her...
Webmaster of www.guardyoureyes.org - Maintaining Moral Purity in Today's World. We’re here on a quest ; it’s really all a test. Just do your best and G-d will do the rest.
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