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It's all their fault (and that's the truth!)
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TOPIC: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 40442 Views

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:04 #309258

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MayanHamisgaber wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:59:

Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:54:

unanumun wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:42:

Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:32:

unanumun wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:23:

Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 16:43:
There's a difference between venting about the difficulties caused by your interactions with other people, and actually blaming them. 







Is there really a difference? 
the common denominator is focusing on the other person or thing. 
Both will not get you very far in life, because there will always be someone that doesn't follow along the script as you thought it should go. 
one must strive to be whole with oneself and with Hashem and know that whatever happens to him is custom made for him. Either as a direct result of his own actions or as a way to work on himself. 

The story is told about some Rebbe in Europe that worked hard to get special wool from eretz yisraeldike sheep for his new tzitzis. after much effort he was pleased to have attained the desired wool. 
He excitedly gave the wool to his chasid, the expert tailor to make the beged for the tzitzis.
While working on the wool, the tailor got all confused and when he went to cut the whole in the middle for the head, he accidentally cut two wholes in the beged.
Embarrassed but with no choice he brought the two holed beged to the rebbe. He nervously awaited the Rebbe's reaction, fearing what divrey mussar he was going to get from him. 
the rebbe smiled and said: "gevaldig, that's exactly what i needed. a beged with two holes - one to stick my head in and one to test my kaas"

that's what it is all about. that's how we can live life. (I wish that one day I can give you an example from my own life, but in the meantime at least this is what I am striving for)

Maybe he got confused, for he didn't know how to cut a "whole" in middle of a beged.

Oh! so now you are blaming me.

Well, did you say over the story rong, or was it the rebbe's fault? The blame's gotta go someplace.

no it doesn't

Then, where does it go?
i'm all about that (substantial) bass, no trouble ....

if you're looking for trouble, you can email me @trouble69gye@outlook.com

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:04 #309259

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Markz wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:00:

Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 17:18:

Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 16:43:
There's a difference between venting about the difficulties caused by your interactions with other people, and actually blaming them. 



I am venting cause it stinks and I am blaming them because it's true.

I blame others too...
Is there a recovery group for guys like us??

btw if trouble joins I'll sit the other side of the room, thanks...

no I'm not blaming him for anything...

I will sir next to him. People like that usually look away from themselves to lay blame. The closer you are sitting to them the safer you are. (unless he falls off his chair)

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:04 #309260

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So what IS going on on this thread? Stam trolling, bipolar, comedy- which is it?

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:07 #309261

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Markz wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:00:

Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 17:18:

Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 16:43:
There's a difference between venting about the difficulties caused by your interactions with other people, and actually blaming them. 



I am venting cause it stinks and I am blaming them because it's true.

I blame others too...
Is there a recovery group for guys like us??

btw if trouble joins I'll sit the other side of the room, thanks...

no I'm not blaming him for anything...

Isn't that what we are here for?
i'm all about that (substantial) bass, no trouble ....

if you're looking for trouble, you can email me @trouble69gye@outlook.com

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:10 #309262

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Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:25:

unanumun wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:23:

Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 16:43:
There's a difference between venting about the difficulties caused by your interactions with other people, and actually blaming them. 




Is there really a difference? 
the common denominator is focusing on the other person or thing. 
Both will not get you very far in life, because there will always be someone that doesn't follow along the script as you thought it should go. 
one must strive to be whole with oneself and with Hashem and know that whatever happens to him is custom made for him. Either as a direct result of his own actions or as a way to work on himself. 

The story is told about some Rebbe in Europe that worked hard to get special wool from eretz yisraeldike sheep for his new tzitzis. after much effort he was pleased to have attained the desired wool. 
He excitedly gave the wool to his chasid, the expert tailor to make the beged for the tzitzis.
While working on the wool, the tailor got all confused and when he went to cut the whole in the middle for the head, he accidentally cut two wholes in the beged.
Embarrassed but with no choice he brought the two holed beged to the rebbe. He nervously awaited the Rebbe's reaction, fearing what divrey mussar he was going to get from him. 
the rebbe smiled and said: "gevaldig, that's exactly what i needed. a beged with two holes - one to stick my head in and one to test my kaas"

that's what it is all about. that's how we can live life. (I wish that one day I can give you an example from my own life, but in the meantime at least this is what I am striving for)


For sure. But sometimes it is helpful to vent and complain as long as you know that the bottom line is that the real work starts with you. You're right that even that can be unhelpful, but sometimes being allowed to kvetch A little is helpful. Blaming on the other hand is not at all helpful

This, I like.

So, how can i kvetch without blaming?

Like the guy with the cement truck driving over his tulips; his neighbor was clearly to blame.
i'm all about that (substantial) bass, no trouble ....

if you're looking for trouble, you can email me @trouble69gye@outlook.com

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:14 #309264

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Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:04:
So what IS going on on this thread? Stam trolling, bipolar, comedy- which is it?

This thread is like life. 
It is what you make of it

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:17 #309265

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Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:04:
So what IS going on on this thread? Stam trolling, bipolar, comedy- which is it?

Yes!
The second time today, you hit it (markz) on the head!

And it certainly beats the simcha thread. My head is spinning from all that mumbo jumbo (although it does seem like good stuff). I mean, should we really be convincing someone that he is happy? You know, the old half empty, half full business. I know I'm happier with the half empty. (All you guys that mumbled, "figures," just shut up!) I'm serious, at least here. When it (the cup or the bottle) is half empty, I know I'm closer to another drink. That picks up my "spirits."
i'm all about that (substantial) bass, no trouble ....

if you're looking for trouble, you can email me @trouble69gye@outlook.com

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:21 #309268

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Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:04:

MayanHamisgaber wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:59:

Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:54:

unanumun wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:42:

Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:32:

unanumun wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:23:

Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 16:43:
There's a difference between venting about the difficulties caused by your interactions with other people, and actually blaming them. 








Is there really a difference? 
the common denominator is focusing on the other person or thing. 
Both will not get you very far in life, because there will always be someone that doesn't follow along the script as you thought it should go. 
one must strive to be whole with oneself and with Hashem and know that whatever happens to him is custom made for him. Either as a direct result of his own actions or as a way to work on himself. 

The story is told about some Rebbe in Europe that worked hard to get special wool from eretz yisraeldike sheep for his new tzitzis. after much effort he was pleased to have attained the desired wool. 
He excitedly gave the wool to his chasid, the expert tailor to make the beged for the tzitzis.
While working on the wool, the tailor got all confused and when he went to cut the whole in the middle for the head, he accidentally cut two wholes in the beged.
Embarrassed but with no choice he brought the two holed beged to the rebbe. He nervously awaited the Rebbe's reaction, fearing what divrey mussar he was going to get from him. 
the rebbe smiled and said: "gevaldig, that's exactly what i needed. a beged with two holes - one to stick my head in and one to test my kaas"

that's what it is all about. that's how we can live life. (I wish that one day I can give you an example from my own life, but in the meantime at least this is what I am striving for)

Maybe he got confused, for he didn't know how to cut a "whole" in middle of a beged.

Oh! so now you are blaming me.

Well, did you say over the story rong, or was it the rebbe's fault? The blame's gotta go someplace.

no it doesn't

Then, where does it go?

why does there have to be blame why can there not be a reason that one just cannot see (דן לכף זכות .....not easy but that is life sorry)
very important thread: guardyoureyes.com/forum/20-Important-Threads/19180-FEEL-THE-HUGS%21%21%21" option="guardyoureyes.com/forum/20-Important-Threads/19180-FEEL-THE-HUGS%21%21%21">FEEL THE HUGS!!!

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:21 #309269

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Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:02:

unanumun wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:29:
when one kvetches, is it really true that deep down he his not blaming? can one really kvetch with no resentment involved?


No of course not. But I don't think one has to. If one is willing to take responsibility they'll be fine, for sure at least to start.

Take responsibility?

For someone else's mistake?

Why?
i'm all about that (substantial) bass, no trouble ....

if you're looking for trouble, you can email me @trouble69gye@outlook.com

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:23 #309270

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First of all, there are even times where it is beneficial to take at least some responsibility for someone else's mistake. But actually I'm talking about taking responsibility for the part of the issue that was your fault. It's almost never cut and dried that something is 100% and 0% of the othersin a relationship

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:25 #309271

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Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:17:

Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:04:
So what IS going on on this thread? Stam trolling, bipolar, comedy- which is it?

Yes!
The second time today, you hit it (markz) on the head!

And it certainly beats the simcha thread. My head is spinning from all that mumbo jumbo (although it does seem like good stuff). I mean, should we really be convincing someone that he is happy? You know, the old half empty, half full business. I know I'm happier with the half empty. (All you guys that mumbled, "figures," just shut up!) I'm serious, at least here. When it (the cup or the bottle) is half empty, I know I'm closer to another drink. That picks up my "spirits."

If someone is in the habit of blaming other people it would make sense that he would avoid people convincing others that they are happy. Because how can you be happy if you have no one to blame for being happy. 

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:30 #309272

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MayanHamisgaber wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:21:



why does there have to be blame why can there not be a reason that one just cannot see (דן לכף זכות .....not easy but that is life sorry)

all you are saying that someone is to blame but since you don't know the reason you should dan lekaf zechus

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:34 #309274

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Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:23:
First of all, there are even times where it is beneficial to take at least some responsibility for someone else's mistake. But actually I'm talking about taking responsibility for the part of the issue that was your fault. It's almost never cut and dried that something is 100% and 0% of the othersin a relationship

I think that unless you take 100 percent responsibility you are bound do have a difficult life. who is at fault is really irrelevant. what was, was. the only issue that you should be thinking is what is the proper thing to do from now on. 
like stephen covey says, being responsible is really being response able. we are able to choose our reponses

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 19:50 #309277

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unanumun wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:30:

MayanHamisgaber wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:21:



why does there have to be blame why can there not be a reason that one just cannot see (דן לכף זכות .....not easy but that is life sorry)

all you are saying that someone is to blame but since you don't know the reason you should dan lekaf zechus

No that is not what I meant 
what I meant was it really doesn't matter who is to blame and getting bent out of shape does not help either so what should one do? What I do is try to see it from the others perspective or think up a reason why they would do this that is not negative.
Whether it is true or not (the reason I come up with) many a time the frustration dissipates and at least i feel better whether or not I can calmly discuss it with the other party.

I know this is a hard thing to do and it took me years to get to where I am holding and I am no where close to being good at it (see my thread in sig.) but this works for me maybe it can work for others maybe not 
very important thread: guardyoureyes.com/forum/20-Important-Threads/19180-FEEL-THE-HUGS%21%21%21" option="guardyoureyes.com/forum/20-Important-Threads/19180-FEEL-THE-HUGS%21%21%21">FEEL THE HUGS!!!

Re: It's all their fault (and that's the truth!) 26 Mar 2017 20:02 #309278

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MayanHamisgaber wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:21:

Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 19:04:

MayanHamisgaber wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:59:

Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:54:

unanumun wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:42:

Trouble wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:32:

unanumun wrote on 26 Mar 2017 18:23:

Workingguy wrote on 26 Mar 2017 16:43:
There's a difference between venting about the difficulties caused by your interactions with other people, and actually blaming them. 









Is there really a difference? 
the common denominator is focusing on the other person or thing. 
Both will not get you very far in life, because there will always be someone that doesn't follow along the script as you thought it should go. 
one must strive to be whole with oneself and with Hashem and know that whatever happens to him is custom made for him. Either as a direct result of his own actions or as a way to work on himself. 

The story is told about some Rebbe in Europe that worked hard to get special wool from eretz yisraeldike sheep for his new tzitzis. after much effort he was pleased to have attained the desired wool. 
He excitedly gave the wool to his chasid, the expert tailor to make the beged for the tzitzis.
While working on the wool, the tailor got all confused and when he went to cut the whole in the middle for the head, he accidentally cut two wholes in the beged.
Embarrassed but with no choice he brought the two holed beged to the rebbe. He nervously awaited the Rebbe's reaction, fearing what divrey mussar he was going to get from him. 
the rebbe smiled and said: "gevaldig, that's exactly what i needed. a beged with two holes - one to stick my head in and one to test my kaas"

that's what it is all about. that's how we can live life. (I wish that one day I can give you an example from my own life, but in the meantime at least this is what I am striving for)

Maybe he got confused, for he didn't know how to cut a "whole" in middle of a beged.

Oh! so now you are blaming me.

Well, did you say over the story rong, or was it the rebbe's fault? The blame's gotta go someplace.

no it doesn't

Then, where does it go?

why does there have to be blame why can there not be a reason that one just cannot see (דן לכף זכות .....not easy but that is life sorry)

There goes Judaism again!

Always that proverbial gezeiras hakasuv.

You can't see it, but it's there.

It's not logical, but it's a fact.

We don't understand reason, but it's true.

How then can we ever know true blame? And don't tell me I'm right, for then I will be out of business.
i'm all about that (substantial) bass, no trouble ....

if you're looking for trouble, you can email me @trouble69gye@outlook.com
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