Hi,
Boruch hashem I have kep internet use under control with Webchaver which is a fantastic tool.
My post here is to put forward the discussion how webchaver and any filter will not work unless one increases Yirei shomayim drastically. Filters and forums are good for when we have them but they are not the ultimate answer.
I am still discovering this day by day. When I go on business trips I have my laptop with Webchaver and it is a very useful tool BH.
But what about Strip bars, dance clubs etc etc. If you are in a foriegn country without a jew for 2000 miles the temptation is so great because no other Jew in the world will walk in on you, premium channels television, KTV lounges, the list just goes on.
Being a holy Jew is so much more than internet filters nowadays. As a traveling Jewish Businessman the temptation is around every corner.
The reason I am writing this and found this site, is I have had a recent business trip and during a business meeting I was introduced to the suppliers sister, over a couple of drinks things happened and she ended up spending the night in my room and more .....
I can here you all shouting how can you, your a sick vile individual. I know I am , but I just did not feel at the time I was doing anything wrong. My wife (don't disown me yet) is the most special individual in my life and we BH have an exeptional marriage, but the problem was I just did not feel it being disloyal. It felt like I had a yeridah and looked up something bad on the interent.  She is still the only one I love in my life and have and will not have any feelings to this shiksah. I didn't even enjoy it much.
I have now come back to the USA and I feel like I am meeting Hashem again, and I can't face him, I can't look at myself in the mirror.
The question is what now..
Have I thrown my life down the drain. (I don't feel i have, maybe I should feel like that?)
Have I been thrown out of the Jewish nation till I have done Teshuva (how and what)
To me I feel this is a huge learning opportunity and to prepare myself adequately for any future similar challenges. But I think this is part of the problemm. This is a shocking most disgusting thing I have done. I can't just carry on life. I have to make a massive change in my life!! I can't just carry on a s normal./ I am desperate this does not affect my marriage in even the tiniest way. But why should Hashem be this kind to me. Thanks for listening.

Hi willnevergiveup...... no you wouldn't

Welcome to our community, you have finally come home!

We're all in the same boat here. Tzuras Rabim Chatzi Nechama   Once you've arrived, there's no turning back. Everyone here will just grab a hold of you and pull you up with them!

GYE Program in a Nutshell: (Right Click the link and press "Save Link/Target As" to save the PDF file to your computer).

'Guard Your Eyes' offers a unique approach to helping people by recognizing that there are many different levels in the struggle for "Shmiras Ainayim" and "Shmiras Habris". After studying the experience of hundreds of religious strugglers over the past few years, we put together the suggestions and recommendations that we feel are best for the various levels. We divided the tools, features and services that GYE offers into 8 different levels. This "GYE Program in a Nutshell can help people quickly identify at what level of the struggle they are at, and which tools and features would help them most at their particular level.

Here are some quick things you can do to help you jump straight into recovery:

1) Make sure to install a strong filter. It will be almost impossible to break free of this while having all the garbage within a mouse click away. See this page for one good filter option, along with instructions on how to install it best – and give away the password to our "filter Gabai"… See this page for another 20 (or so) filter ideas and information… We also highly advise installing "Reporting Software" such as webchaver.org to give you some accountability, because filters alone are usually not sufficient and they can often be bypassed.

2) Join the daily Chizuk e-mail lists to get fresh chizuk every day.

3) Scientific studies have shown that it takes 90 days to change a neural thought pattern that was ingrained in the brain through addictive behaviors. Did you join the 90 day chart on-line? Sign up over here.

4) Post away on this forum! You will get tons of daily Chizuk and support. This disease can't be beat alone. It works best when you get out of isolation!

5) GuardYourEyes also offers many free anonymous phone conferences where you can join a group of other frum Yidden, along with an experienced sponsor. See www.guardyoureyes.org > Tools > Phone Conferences for many different options. Our conferences are taking place every day, morning, noon and night… Joining a phone group would be a tremendous step in the right direction for you and help you learn freedom from this addiction. Not only will you learn the secret of the 12-Steps – which is known to be the world's most powerful program for beating addiction having helped millions world wide, but the daily call will be another way of GETTING OUT OF ISOLATION and connecting with others who are going through what you are.

6) If you need more general guidance, write to our e-mail helpline at gye.help@gmail.com or call our hotline at 646-600-8100.

7) Download and read the "Guard Your Eyes Handbook". This handbook outlines the GYE approach in detail, and makes our network much more effective and helpful for people. The handbook has two parts:

A) The first part, "Attitude & Perspective", details 30 basic principles to help us maintain the proper attitude and perspective on this struggle. Here are some examples: Understanding what we are up against, what it is that Hashem wants from us, how we can use this struggle for tremendous growth, how we can deal with bad thoughts, discovering how to redirect the power of our souls, understanding that every little bit counts, learning how to bounce back up after a fall, and so on and so forth…

The second part, "The 18 Tools", detail suggested tools and techniques, in progressive order, beginning with the most basic and fundamental approaches to dealing with this addiction, and continuing down through increasingly earnest and powerful methods. No matter what level our addiction may have advanced to, we will be able to find the right tools to break free in this handbook!

May Hashem be with you!

OMG!

How dare you!
How could you !

How could you be so, so.... HUMAN!
ok - so now that you've learned how to die like a Human... imagine how wonderful it will feel when you learn how to start LIVING like a human!

nobody is perfect.
life is about a process... and making the right choices and learning how to develop a healthy sense of self.
being honest with yourself - and feeling good about yourself.


welcome to the club.

time to pick yourself up - dust yourself off... and start moving forward.

dov. in israel (aka - dov.ii )

willnevergiveup,

Whether what I am about to say is helpful or not I do not know.  I am only saying this because of what you said in your post, otherwise I think most other members of this forum would find this callous and hurtful.  The next time such a situation presents itself and you don't feel like your marriage is suffering from such actions, think to yourself this:  "If my beloved wife would be the one doing this to me, according to the Torah we would never ever be allowed to even be alone together in the same room again."  Just because Hashem in his ultimate wisdom did not make the same conditions for men (and we can probably see an understanding of our own in this situation) when it comes to these things, should not preclude us from the same ramifications as our wives actions.

wow,
willnevergiveup,
i have been spending hours the last three weeks writing a book. I feel it is just for you. If only i could do telepathy through bluetooth and send you 2000 of my thoughts you would realize the same thing that i did when reading your story:

if you only had the right perspective, tools, and education about addiction and God's ways, you would certainly be a happy man

by the way, you can get a lot lower than what you did

maybe i can drop you my chapter about "tshuva/does God hate my guts?"

after reading it, not only would you dance and realize you have it all backwards, you would realize something else-

your mistakes in sexuality are one thing, but your perceptions and notions about your place in the jewish nation and as a person, and God-for that is unforgivable

iy"H i will finish it with great haste and throw it to ya

till then, stick here, and post, and get real educated about the real view of things
glad to welcome a person like u here, a jew wanting to come forth in honesty and heal
there is not much better than that

-tz/avi

Thank you for all the messages and chizuk. Some people posted last night with some very good comments that I had not read yet, this morning they had disappeared. Anyone knows what happened to the server over night.
Anyway, thanks to rising up, a very powerful comment.
I am sure I am wrong on this but I get the feeling on this forum everyone is too nice.
I have just committed one of the most terrible Aveiros and everyone is saying how it is such a good thing that has happened and I am looking at everything in reverse with the wrong perspective.
I feel the only way to real teshuva is to realize what has been done wrong, how serious it is, what are potential punishments for such an action. I really think there should be more of this on the site, maybe then people will be loath to do it again.
The other thing which I have noticed with my post and many others. Posters are always talking about addictions and control with them. The problem is the vast majority of people with sexual taavos, don't have an addiction, it is just simple pain yetzer Hora and therefore should not be dealt with as an addiction.
I hope I am not undermining anyone.
As with me, I though it had not affected me but since I have been back, I have been jumpy, and very stressed and not feeling my usual self.
I really need to do something quick before things spiral out of control.
Thank you again.

my friend,
while you are right that somethings just happen out of yetzer harah
if it is persistent and u lack the self control to stop it, this comes near addiction, no?
if mesillas yesharim helped u after doing this one time, great

if you did porn and masturbation fifty times this year (plus all the other years cuz ur not one years old) arent you addicted?

this is really for a moderator, not a sick addict like myself.
there are many resources for chizzuk in these areas, on breslov, your local mashgiach, and more. even on GYE there are those that use the torah and chizzuk approach, that is all they need. Great.
isn't sleeping with a chinese person a bit beyond taking peeks at your neighbor's wives at the chasuna?

i am NOT critisizing you, but only asking you to unfurl this for me

i too did the sin that you did,
for me the doomsday approach did not work
i dont think it will work for you either
even for any person in this generation

u really want to hear about the hell, kaf hakelah, chibut hakever, the chitzonim u created having been born through li-liss, to torment u and your family? gilgulim? cancer? that could be a punishment for this and boy that is scary, i dont wish it on anyone.

please consider what i am saying, and unfurl it. you dont at all need to agree, i merely want to ask you to recheck what u r saying

there is much to say,
there are many special people here

stick with your questions and keep asking them till you get honest accurate answers
stick around, maybe we'll learn something from you or u from us

you are a good jew

a lowly sex addict,
tz90

Dear WNGU,

Nothing anyone wrote should be construed as minimizing the severity of the aveira you committed.  Although Teshuva is always available, I think you may need guidance from an Adam Gadol as to how to go about it.

I would like to suggest something that you might want to consider, subject to approval by an Adam Gadol: Many people are lenient to shake hands with women in a business context, and I'm assuming that you are as well.  Although there is a valid basis to be lenient, there is no less a valid basis to be stringent.  I would suggest, however, that all this is for non-addicts and for those who have not crossed the line that you did.  In your case, I would suggest, b'li neder, that you be stringent in this area.  Declining to shake hands can be very awkward, but it will serve as both a Kapara and a Geder to prevent anything like this from happening again.  After all, if you won't even shake hands, you certainly won't cross that line again.

It's just a suggestion.  However, I think that if you take on something concrete like this, it will show the RBS"O how serious you are about not letting this happen again, and will allow you to move on with your life and live with Simchas Hachaim.

Dear WWNBF

I have never, ever been accused of being too nice. In reality, you had a momentary lapse of judgement (which was preceded by several other lapses in judgement that led you to the situaation in the first place). And yet, I have not seen any benefit coming from wallowing in self pity and misery. While regret (Charata) is part of the teshuva process, Kabala Al Haasid, and fixing your life are far more important.  This will only work if you are in a positive frame of mind. If you are depressed and consider yourself a sinner you are playing into the Yetzah Hara's hands.  That is why the people here are offering you encouragement.

The reason why the people here refer to addiction is because this site was designed to help addicts.  If you are not an addict and have normal taivos then go back to your filtered internet.  And work on your teshuva and work on improving your connection with Hashem.

I'll leave you with one cheerful thought though, that the vast majoity of "addicts" on this site have not sunk to as low a level as you have.

Thanks Kedusha,
I am actually very stringent about shaking hands with Women, and actually warned my supplier before we met I do not shake hands with Women, I can't imagine what she thought when I slept with her sister! What a chilul Hashem. The problem was and people please be warned - Drinks in a bar together!! One should never ever socialise with goyim in an informal situation.
By the way I actually slept with this woman for a few nights and resisted the temptation of intercourse for all the nights till the morning of departure when I was half asleep and did not resist. What a crying shame...
(BTW tzaddik 90 who said anything about a chinese girl?)
BH I do not do Porn or Masturbation 50 times a year, so BH BAH I am not an addict. Therefore probably a little mussar is in order here. Yes I do think being online here on this forum before offering the girl to share my room with me and someone giving me mussar of all the terrible things I would do, and could happen, would have helped.
Unfortuantly i have found the forum a little too late for this occasion but will be in touch now I have found it.

I see. 

There is a reason why Stam Yeinam is not permitted.  Although the prohibition doesn't technically apply to liquor [see Rage's post below], you see what a Michshol it can be.

The way you describe things, by breaking down a number of very important Gedarim, you caused yourself to be in a situation where sinning was all but inevitable.  First and foremost, you will be held accountable for putting yourself into such an impossible situation (unless you do a proper Teshuva).  Not to mention for the sin itself.

Yashar Koach, Rage!

By the way ME3 while I agree with your last post [Moderator's note: Me3's last post is "Alav Hashalom", because it was responding to a post which has since underwent major edits] for the reasons discussed in the , I do not agree that this site is only for addicts. There is a lot of good points to pick up from this site and if I would have known about this site earlier it might have helped. Your comment about most people on this site have not sunk as low as I have is quite sobering.

[Moderator's Note: At Me3's polite and respectful urging, I edited my previous post, which Me3 implied might be misunderstood by some.  As Me3's very polite response was no longer applicable, it has been removed].

WWNGU

I didn't say only for addicts, anybody who can benefit is welcome.

Thank you Rage,  I never new this was an Issur.