I can give a few suggestions that might help you. On GYE there’s a method explained in detail called the Taphsic method which basically uses nedarim to help you break free. Here’s the link to it here, check it out: https://guardyoureyes.com/tools/taphsic-method
It’s a really good method to use for a few a reasons, if you take the nedarim responsibly, you’ll see that even though normally one would’ve given in to the urge right away, you can wait up until the vow expires and by then the urges will be gone. This is something called “urge surfing”, it’s talked about in the new self paced program GYE launched, Flight to Freedom. To sum it up, there’s been studies done that show when it comes to addictive behaviors that urges will seem big in the beginning and would seem like they will be getting bigger, but as a general trend, the urges will get weaker and weaker the more you hold off from engaging in them. Sometimes though this isn’t exactly the case with p and m, many people here on GYE report that things seemed to go smoothly, with relatively tolerable urges, for the first couple of days and after that time they were hit with much bigger urges. It’s being able to get past that initial point that you’ll see the urges get more “easier” to deal with. I recommend you check out the self paced program for more details and for all the other great information it has because it’s designed to teach you the tools you need to break free. Here’s the link: https://app.guardyoureyes.com/
I also recommend looking into getting webchaver through something called the KBA system. It’s actually free, but they will charge you an amount of money that you choose upon sign up, if they see anything that you shouldn’t be looking at. The bad and questionable reports get reported by the A.I. are reviewed by real people before you get charged. This doesn’t include just looking at p but also borderline stuff like what you describe. Check it out, it’s free so you have nothing to lose and I’ve been using it myself for quite a while without any problems. The link for that is in my signature.

Hi everyone,

I'm B''H still clean from P&M but i did fall back with lusting and guarding my eyes,
but i have to say, that I'm still in a much better place then before, my mind is not busy with lust all day, i don't think to go special to a place where i could maybe see...

and the only way for me to do that is by being mindful and seeing the urge as an outside thing, because if not the more i run away the more its running after me, and i need the grip off me

.so i started this week again, started practicing urge surfing, reviewing F2F and i B''H had a good week so far.

all the best !!

Trouble wrote on 28 Jan 2022 14:52:

Thanks! 

I meant that different methods work for different people, and there are other methods that don't rely on insisting that there is no need. For example, with other urge surfing, you don't judge the urge, you just try to observe and describe the sensations to yourself, and watch it increase/decrease until it's gone. The same goes with the Unhooking (defusion) technique, where you recognize that you can experience many different feelings, thoughts, and sensations at the same time, but that you can "detach" from them (ואכמ"ל), and follow your values. The same goes with the SOBER technique (Stop, Observe, Breath, Expand, and Respond), where you are non-judgmental regarding the Urge, but still get in touch with your values, and the big picture, before deciding what to do. 

---


I'd also add, that yes it will get stronger in the short term, but in the long run, when you don't act on the urges, the urges will get weaker and less frequent. 

See המספיק לעובדי ה' (לבן הרמב"ם) פרק י:

וכן בעל אשה יצטער אם יתאחר משגלו אפילו שבוע אחד, ואלו הרוק שהזנות אסורה עליו וכן מי שנוסע רחוק מביתו לא יצטערו אפילו יתאחר שנה תמימה, וכל זה מכח ההרגל. ועיניך הרואות כי הצם הרבה ימים רצופים יתענה ברעב ביומו הראשון יותר משיתענה ביום השני, ובשני יותר מבשלישי, עד שיעשה לו הצום טבע שני ולא יהא חושש לו, כדרך מי שרגיל בתעניות. (ובהערות המהדיר: וכן בסנהדרין ק"ז איתא אבר קטן יש באדם משביעו רעב ומרעיבו שבע. ובשו"ע ר"מ א כתוב, "אך יותר טוב היה לו לדחות את יצרו ולכבוש אותו כי אבר קטן וכו' עיי"ש).

Or to quote a contemporary author:

"Given that most clients believe that unless they satisfy their cravings (strong desire or appetite for drug effects) by giving in to their urges (intent to use), the craving will continue to build until they feel "wiped out" by the increased intensity of their drug appetites. By giving in and using when the urge is at its peak, clients experience major negative reinforcement (relief from craving or unpleasant withdrawal symptoms), which strengthens their attachment to the addictive substance or activity."
(Overcoming Your Alcohol or Drug Problem: Effective Recovery Strategies Therapist Guide)

In other words, over time, the less you masturbate, the less intense the urges will be.

Shmuel wrote on 19 Jan 2022 14:57:

646-GYE-6600   (646-493-6600)

Press 2 For help with addictive behaviors
Press 2 If you’re struggling with an urge right nowWe added there many great "mindfulness" & "urge surfing" recordings...

The hotline now has a new section with many "Jewish Mindfulness" recordings by Dr. Yoni Feiner, author of the fantastic book Mindfulness: A Jewish Approach.

Shortcuts:
To access this new collection dial 646-GYE-6600 ext. 19. 
To access the regular Mindfulness collection, use ext. 18 (for info on the general collection see this post.)

As @ChaimMod posted in a neighboring thread, our new hotline (646-GYE-6600) now has a new tremendous resource - a collection of mindfulness recordings, that have been prepared for GYE al taharas hakodesh. The mindfulness recordings have been reviewed by Rabbi Avrohom Union from RCC Vaad and unlike many other audios available online there are 100% pure and have no hints of anything problematic c"v.

Mindfulness can help us in 3 ways:

1. It can help us handle stress in a healthy way, instead of using P&M to escape it. Stress and other painful emotions are often the underlying issues behind P&M struggles.
2. It can help us experience and "surf" urges without acting on them.
3. It can help us avoid relapse after reaching a good streak.

The following audio sessions have been written and recorded to suit the experience of everyone from a beginner to an expert. 

What is mindfulness?

Mindfulness is a natural human practice that many of us have forgotten or moved away from over time. Have you ever noticed how you can do the same task, like brushing your teeth so many times, that you no longer think about how you’re doing it? Saying large parts of davening while thinking about something else? Or what about walking or driving along your daily route and being lost in thought instead of paying attention to where you are going or even what is happening around you? 

These are examples of being mindless. 

Being mindful - the opposite of mindlessness - involves being more curious about your external world, that is your environment and during your daily routines - noticing what happens as if they are new to you every time. 

Being mindful is also about noticing your internal world - your thoughts, emotions and bodily sensations as they happen moment by moment. 

Mindfulness helps you to expand your awareness of the things that drive you, motivate you, get in your way, trip you up, and keep you stuck in old habits and behaviors that you may want to change. 

Although mindfulness is a natural thing to do - it does take some practice to notice your thoughts, feelings and sensations - which is why we have produced this series of recorded mindfulness exercises for you to practice. 

Practical tips for mindfulness

To get the most out of these mindfulness audios, there are some practical things you can do to improve your experience:

• Set aside regular time to practice - preferably daily, or weekly.
• Starting with short periods of mindfulness can work better than occasional long ones.
• Make sure you are comfortable - sitting in your favorite chair can help.
• Take it slowly. You don't need to set ambitious goals or put pressure on yourself.
• Remember, you’re learning a new skill that will take time to develop.
• Don't worry about whether you're doing it right or not - just do it the best you can.
• You don't need any special equipment for the exercises.
• Do every session at least once.

Tips for starting a mindfulness practice

Once you have sampled the mindfulness audios you may decide to start a mindfulness practice, so here are a few tips to help you do this successfully.

• Create a mindfulness space. Find a space in your home or office where you can practice mindfulness without being interrupted and where you feel comfortable.
• Practice at the same time every day. Routine is the foundation of any practice, so if possible choose a time that you know works for you most days and add it to your schedule. Lots of people choose first thing in the morning, before they start their day, as it helps them have a more positive and productive day.
• Repetition is key. The mindfulness audios we have provided for you are a great way of starting your practice. You can practice the same sessions for a week at a time and then move on to a new session to keep things interesting.
• Target your needs. If you notice you are struggling with an issue such as stress, anxious thoughts or poor focus, choose a mindfulness session that will help you - such as a breathing practice - and add it to your existing schedule.
• Take your time. There have been many studies that show the brain region called the PFC (Prefrontal cortex) which is associated with higher-order brain functions such as awareness, concentration and decision-making – is improved after just 8-weeks of practice. This is based on 10 - minutes a day - every day of mindfulness practice.
• Cultivate Mindfulness throughout the day. When you start your personal practice you will find there are occasions when you cannot sit for 10-minutes to practice. This doesn’t have to prevent you from cultivating mindfulness. If this is the case, then you can practice noticing your breath as you brush your teeth, drive to work or even while sitting in a boring meeting.  The idea of mindfulness is that wherever you go, you can be mindful.

The Mindfulness Audios

There are six Mindfulness audio series that has been organized as follows:

Series 1. Beginners Mindfulness (6 recordings)
Series 2. Mindful Breathing exercises (this series currently only has 1 recording - there are more on the way)
Series 3. Mindfulness for Relaxation (8 recordings)
Series 4. Thoughts & Feelings (4 recordings)
Series 5. Urge Surfing exercises (8 recordings)
Series 6. Relapse Prevention exercises (4 recordings)

(To listen to these, call 646-GYE-6600 extension 18. Then press the number of the series you'd like to listen to.)

The Beginners Mindfulness sessions will introduce the basic techniques of mindfulness such as using your five senses, increasing awareness, and mindful breathing.  

In series 2, you will find more mindful breathing exercises that you can learn and practice anywhere at any time (not while driving or operating machinery), as a tool for lowering stress and increasing your awareness. 

Next, in series 3, you will be introduced to a series of relaxation exercises that when done mindfully will help you to relax your mind and body. 

Series 4, addresses the thoughts and emotions often associated with P&M. In this series you will practice how to stop the judgment mindfully and learn how to increase awareness of your negative thoughts around P&M. 

Series 5, is the Urge Surfing collection of mindfulness practices and you will be introduced to a variety of techniques for managing, and overcoming cravings and urges. 

Finally, series 6, The Relapse prevention series is focused on helping you to become more mindful of your actions, environment, and any cues or triggers, with a view to helping you quit P&M.

Press 2 For help with addictive behaviors
Press 2 If you’re struggling with an urge right nowWe added there many great "mindfulness" & "urge surfing" recordings...

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• To learn about GuardYourEyesPress 1
• For help with addictive behaviors, Press 2.
  
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• • • • If this is your first time calling, press 1
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• If you’re struggling with an urge right now Press 2
  
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90 days! It's incredible!

I'm incredibly thankful to GYE and all of the people who have supported me so far.

I would especially like to reach out to all of you who are reading this that have been part of GYE, visit regularly, but haven’t yet become posters on the forum. I assume, that for some of you, the reason why you don't post is a combination of feeling uncomfortable posting about yourself, or you feel “Is it worth it? Will it really help me significantly?". Maybe you feel that your problem isn’t as big as some of the others here, and you don’t need help, you can manage on your own.

All I can say is that before I joined GYE, I thought I tried everything and continued to struggle for many years. Once joining, and working out a diet of things that help (some of which I was unaware of previously, and some that I just didn’t know how to find - like accountability) it’s been so much easier. I don’t think this is a 90 day “spurt”. I’ve changed the way I deal with this in a number of ways, and I don’t plan to change that, nor do I think I’m done. So please, take the leap. Give it a try.

I've been trying to figure out how I've been able to make it this far - and honestly, it's been fairly easy for me. I don't know how many people find that they experience a major change just by joining GYE, but that's what happened to me. Here are some thoughts of how I got here so far.

I think there are a few things that have helped me significantly:

• The less the YH is enticed and teased, the easier the fight becomes. As Chazal say, משביעו רעב מרעיבו שבע. I used to think that referred to acting out, masturbating and pornography. I didn’t realize how much I was lusting and fantasizing, justifying that I couldn’t possibly fight those things, and it was a relatively “kosher” outlet compared to other things. On the contrary, that made it much harder! Keeping the lust alive, keeps the fire going. It blocks us from thinking rationally and strengthens the Yetzer Hora until we feel we must have it, and then fail. Since I started here, I’ve been focused on not fantasizing and lusting, letting minor thoughts and sights in the street and supermarket go quickly, and the results have been that my urges are much weaker and less frequent. ​

• Accountability - I’m still trying to understand how it helps. I have a mentor who I text and am in touch with regularly, I feel accountable to the Chevra here, and the 90 day counter keeps track publicly and for myself, so I can’t just sneak anything in with no one noticing. (Although people say the opposite of addiction is connection, I don’t think that’s what’s been helping me; I don’t think my connections here are any stronger than the many great and honest relationships I have in my life - but I may be wrong) I don’t think the accountability for me is a negative incentive - as in, I can’t do this because then I’ll be embarrassed etc. It’s more of a commitment that I have to stand by, a feeling of Achrayus - to myself, the Chevra here and my mentor. And a positive feeling - like fans supporting an athlete - that people are rooting for me and I don’t want to let them down.

• I've been thinking it helps in another way too. Once I’ve shown myself that there’s a line that I really do not plan on crossing, and I’m not going to allow myself any leeway (perhaps this can apply to anyone who can stick to their commitments for a significant amount of time) that changes everything. Part of what makes the urges so strong in general, I think, is that there’s a sense that I want and will get that tantalizing pleasure that is at the end of a particular road, whatever it may be, whether it be a fantasy or real, we tell ourselves we’re going to get it. Much like Pavlov’s dogs, we train ourselves to salivate for that imaginary pleasure we hope to get at the end - and that creates a powerful force and urge, even way before we might experience anything, just from the anticipation of it. But once we’ve made a real commitment, that I will not go down that road, I’m not planning on experiencing that pleasure, and we stick to that commitment, it reverses the effect. We no longer anticipate and salivate. It makes the battle much easier. (Perhaps this is an explanation of #1 as well)

• Information on how the Yetzer Hora operates and how to deal with urges when they arise. Part of this is #1, understanding that you need to stop the YH at step 1 in order to win. It’s also a lot of the strategies of urge surfing or externalizing the urge, not fighting it while not dwelling on it. Also, working on not objectifying women, seeing them as real people, and recognizing that lusting is and fantasizing etc. is mistreatment of them.

Overall, these last 3 months have been an incredible experience and life change. Truthfully, I never felt that my life was falling apart, and I felt I have a great marriage. I was scared of ruining it, and I was spending a lot of time doing things and thinking things that were counterproductive, and I wanted to stop as much as anyone - I just didn’t know how. Removing those things from my life has helped me immensely. I’m more focused on my family. Intimacy, though I never thought it was a problem, I now recognize was subtly, but significantly, impacted by my thoughts, and now it is an entirely different experience. I can live a life without lies, and with a completely honest relationship all the time, unlike in the past.

Thanks to all of you for your help, and thanks for reading!

committed_togrowth wrote on 08 Nov 2021 20:50:

I think that's definitely true. Doing something else to take your mind off is certainly better than fighting head on.
Also, have you read any tips or strategies for dealing with urges? There are many that you can find in different places on the site. (Urge Surfing, Recognizing the urge isn't you, it's an urge that you have, changing your self-talk from I have to do this, - to I would like to do this but I'll be fine if I don't)
Also, you say things have been stressful recently. Stress and urges often go hand-in-hand. Whether that's because we're trying to escape the stress or using it as an excuse to allow ourselves to act out.

Hatzlocha in the fight! Keep up your amazing work!

excellence wrote on 01 Nov 2021 07:47:

It's hard for me to know exactly what has been working for me for the last month plus - but what you describe is exactly where I was - (for 20 years or so...) (Maybe I'm still there - just experiencing a short respite) What seems to be most helpful for me is externalizing the urge as opposed to (or perhaps together with) urge surfing. (Kind of what HHM wrote above) This isn't me, and it's not what I want, it's an urge or desire that I'm being assaulted with. I also remind myself (now I do) that משביעו רעב מרעיבו שבע refers not only to full blown acting out, but adding fuel to the fire of the urge with small, "innocent" behaviors and thoughts. I very much related to Rabbi Shafier's (The fight #6 or #7) that describes the Yetzer Hora as an outside voice. I think in the past I felt it was me, and there was something inside me screaming "I want that, I need that, but I can't." Eventually the "I can't" would lose to the "I need it".

excellence wrote on 02 Nov 2021 20:14:

Thank you for your insights!

Yes, since joining GYE (about a month ago) I've done a number of the things you mentioned. Probably the most helpful has been, letting urges go, externalizing the urge, and looking to see women as people - not objects to be used. 
I read through a number of the ideas in SMART recovery and did some of the exercises. Aside from dealing with urges - what else of SMART recovery have you found helpful?
Honestly, I do want to continue working through SMART, though it is hard to find the time. Additionally, I haven't really had any major urges or episodes, I think because I've been able to nip them in the bud.

Avrohom wrote on 11 Oct 2021 03:02:

Dear Avrohom, 

If we rely on constantly feeling inspired, it is inevitable that at some point we will fall since none of us are always on a spiritual high!

The way to continue a long streak is to focus on ODAAT. This is not just a sweet idea, it is a tremendous and powerful strategy from Chazal. Forget about the past or future and just focus on overcoming the present.

We also need internal changes, when we focus on what we really want in life it makes easier to overcome urges. Have you looked into SMART?

​What you described above about acting slightly on urges, is extremely normal. The Yetzer hora does this to all of us. The earlier we stop the easier it is. When you experience an urge try view it as something external trying to take you over, but instead just let it pass. Perhaps try to log/write down what happened after an urge to see at what point you held yourself back. Have you seen the urge surfing doc?

There is an unbelievable amount to read here too:
wiki.guardyoureyes.com/Main_Page

Hatzlocho,
Excellence 

Just want to point out that one of the things I really need to somehow work on is to let an urge pass without acting on it at all. 

Every time I experience an urge I find myself acting on it, either entering the dangerous world of fantasy to escape from reality, and most times I will arouse myself until I hold myself back at the last minute, in order not to fall.

This is a very risky game to play, as at some point I will be likely to fall.....

​My issue with urge surfing, is that it requires a certain relaxed state of mind to just sit back and surf the urge. However when I experience an urge I get so full of energy I can't just sit still, and I straight away allow myself to start slipping.............

Just thought I would share my feelings............

Thanks to all out there,
Wishing you all the best

Excellence 

B’’H I’m up to about 130 days clean and 95% clean from looking on the street and from lust.  And I feel the only reason I’m up to where I’m up to is because I’m clean from looking at women and any romance or love, because if I’m hyped up and aroused it’s very hard to apply all the tools.

How I did it,

1.       I learned urge surfing and to be mindful, and the main thing that helped me was that I was able to identify it as an outside thing, or like something that’s itching but it’s not real me. And even when I felt that my whole body, I was seeing it like a snake that poisoned me but it’s not the real me.

And every time I had an urge to look, I was thinking to myself where is it itching.

And that was the biggest thing for me, because when you are using power then you get even more exited and your mind is thinking what going on there, but when you just don’t need it, and that’s why you’re not looking, and going places to get it, then you feel good afterwards.

2.       Avoiding triggering places, if you’re constantly hyped up and aroused then it’s very hard to be mindful, and hard not to fantasize. Not to go to the supermarket when it’s busy, or someplace where you get triggered from certain people.

3.       When I go on the street I don’t look, not that I look away, looking away is too late, because then your mind goes what was going on there, in my experience it was better to look then to look away after seeing (not saying its muter). Don’t look to begin with.

4.       When I felt I need to go somewhere and I didn’t feel strong enough to be mindful, I tried to take of my eyeglasses, and it helps, because the biggest trigger is what your eyes are seeing.

5.       Sometimes I practice (I need to do this more) to see women as people, and not s*x objects, they have kids family, problems.

gettingthere9 wrote on 01 Oct 2021 01:20:

Urges are normal, they are part of being a healthy and functional human being. They will pass eventually, the less you stress about them the quicker it takes. I find that distracting myself is the best way to not stress about them, some people use "urge surfing" I've tried that too and it can also work if I am in the right frame of mind. 


This is a difficult statement to live with. It may be better to say something like, tomorrow I will do "x" "y" and "z" so that this doesn't happen again. 

It's normal to have hard days or even weeks so when they come along, have a plan prepared. A hobby, some exercise, a good bike ride, or a good Tosafos, whatever works for you. 

Keep it up bro!