Alright, here goes. I've been away for about 3 months (not counting occasionally checking in to read posts). At first it was because i was B"H very busy between yeshiva and work, but i was also doing very well with shmiras einaim. But I grew complacent and... well we know how that goes. then for the last 2 months i wasn't doing well with shmiras einaim, but i didn't come back here to work on it. why not? probably because its easiest to just not fight. over shabbos i had a good conversation with some friends and the topic of porn came up. while some guys were saying the classic "everybody sees something, well what do you call an addiction, its not a big deal" and all of that garbage, one guy was actually being realistic. about how problematic it is, and who cares if you want to call it an addiction or not, it has to be off the table, not an option. i realized i have to wake up and get back on track. 
But... that means hard work, that means staying focused, that means being aware of what i see, it means sacrifice (i know I'm going to get responses to that "no, its not a sacrifice", but you get the point).
so as much as i want to do this, there's a side that wants to just keep going on autopilot. but either way, I'm here.

I left the GYE forum because it was too time consuming but I want to express my deepest gratitude to each and every one of the GYE members who posted as you all have shaped who I am today. I feel like a healthy person and I believe that I healed. It is all because of your posts and more importantly your criticism. I have used everything you taught me to navigate life's challenges effectively. I sorely miss you all but as per the advice of my psychologist I left the forum. Hashem should bless each one of you with sobriety and material and spiritual success.

I haven't completely left Guardyoureyes as I am active on Hitdanoigen nowadays. It is less time consuming and I am enjoying the chassidishe flavor of HDO which is helping me grow spiritually.

A special thank you to Cordnoy who reached out to me privately after I had to leave the forum temporarily due to an addiction to the forum and it is in your merit that I revised my plan and reached sobriety. In addition, your criticism was essential in purifying my mind from faulty beliefs and improper behaviors. A special thank you to Hashem Help Me who reshaped my approach to married life and it is because of you that I feel like I can have a healthy married life. Your guidance and chizzuk were essential in making me grow. A special thank you to Chaim for resolving a number of technical issues I had with the forum that required your intervention. Last but not least a special thank you to Rabbi Dr. Abraham Yehoshua Twerski Zatzal for your investment in GYE which made recovery possible for me.

GYE is dear to me and it takes up an irreplaceable corner of my heart. Hashem should bless GYE with everything that it can use to fulfill its mission broadly and effectively. All the best.

Hi there, welcome!
You sound like a normal guy with a healthy dose of tavaah mixed with some exposure to P and M. There is definitely a lot to gain on this site and amazing people to help you through it. Like the chevra said already start the F2F program grab a copy of the B of the G, and get ready for a bumpy but liberating ride as you start to face this challenge head on.
About telling your wife, I share the same view as others have shared, it is generally not recommended to tell her anything. It does depend on the individual situation, but I wouldn't even consider it unless a very pressing need arises (such as an addiction in which you are putting yourself or others at risk), and even then only with extensive guidance from a therapist/experienced rebbe.
You can get a lot of chizuk and support from the guys on this site, many of whom make themselves very available for each other.
Hatzlacha rabbah and keep on posting!

And so but maybe the only difference between those who stay clean from GYE'ing and those who don't, is simply that those who don't have a worse sickness...


[And okay, I'm incapable of keeping things short and sweet so I'll elaborate. I think the answer to this original question is impossible to know and we're all just speculating. But. I think every tool, attitude, change, whatever listed above has been tried by successful people and unsuccessful people.

And so then we have to think that the only difference is in the level of problem the person is suffering with.

And I know the line between an addict and not is not always clear. But it's undoubtable that GYE is not the most powerful tool out there and if you have two people trying to dry up a puddle with a towel, and only one of them succeeds, perhaps it's time for the other person to start wondering if what he thinks is a puddle is really a swimming pool or even the whole freaking ocean and that's why he's not succeeding. 
And I think it's confusing because there are people who post about serious addiction-level behaviors who became clean through GYE'ing. So we come to think GYE should be enough. But 1) those people may have also done things like copious therapy. The 12 steps are by no means the sole cure for addiction and GYE+therapy+serious lifestyle changes sounds like a pretty serious attempt at treating an addiction. 2) Just because ploni did xyz and got clean without doing more than GYE, doesn't mean that a person doing "just" x doesn't have a deeper problem than ploni did.]

notezy wrote on 28 May 2024 16:07:

When I was in the midst of my life metamorphosis, I was trying to change all the main negative behaviors I was exhibiting. P & M, movies / shows, addictive game apps, . . . and secular music. For the life of me, I had no idea how I was going to give up the music. It was the outlet that would pick me up and get me through the day-in and day-out hard work. Hashem only expects us to do what we can, and I left that challenge for a later date. No sooner did I quit the other negative behaviors and, all on its own, I just couldn't listen to the secular music anymore. 
Hashgacha that soon afterward I heard a speech from Rabbi Zecharia Wallerstein AH where he related having the exact same experience. That was super cool.

Last month I was walking through a mechanic's garage and there was a rock song blasting. My first thought was "man, that is an awesome song, why haven't I been listening to it"? followed by an "oh yeah, silly, I stopped listening to any of those songs a long time ago". It made me appreciate my efforts and the resulting change - especially after that little reminder that I still like the music a lot, but chose to give it up on my journey to be a better me.

Back to the post, I think there are times for insight and sometimes, to quote another deep thinker: "Enough talk, lets fight" -Po, the Dragon Warrior

chosemyshem wrote on 28 May 2024 15:35:

I agree with all of this! I've learned a lot and read/heard many times that thinking about the problem too much is often a hindrance (maybe "obsessing" about a solution is different). Don't think of a pink elephant. 
On my introduction thread May 14 & 16 I wrote a bit about my personal history with this. I'm certainly not on the level to be obsessively involved with Hashem all the time. Lust and recovery aren't the only two options - perhaps there is something you are or could be interested enough in to make it a focus when not busy with daily responsibilities. 

Maybe I'll look into Google voice. I'm no small talker either, so we can either talk tachlis or share an awkward silence lol.

Checking in.

Lionfree raised a really great point tpday about "obsessing" over recovery. Which is something I've been thinking a lot about recently (obsessively so?).  

One particular kneitch about that I've been thinking about is in regard to connecting with other people from GYE. I think there are a few probable benefits to that. The most obvious is the positive benefits of being part of a chevra that's working on this (Rambam, cave etc.) and the more you connect to the chevra the more powerful the affect will be. CO has a theory about coming to terms with facing our hidden selves - if I understand it correctly, meeting people introduces our Hyde to our Jekyll and that is healing. (a la Dov's Captain Kirk post).

But I was thinking that one benefit is probably that talking to people involves you in recovery much more than anonymously posting on a forum. Talking to "real people" is very real (for lack of a better word) and involves you on a deeper level than doing a program, meditating on ideas like urge surfing, or interacting through posting. And it seems to me like the more you are involved in recovery the better a chance it has of sticking.
Here's a theory as to why "involvement" in recovery is crucial. Ideally, the best would be to be obsessively involved with hashem so that lust is naturally excluded. For those of us who somehow fall short of that level, we've got to be involved with something. Right now, that thing is all too often lust. So even forgetting about addiction/habit/learned responses, just saying stop lust is very difficult - this is something we are deeply involved in. But instead lchoira we can replace the involvement in lust with an involvement in recovery. 

This is speculative. But it sounds good to me and I'm trying to put my money where my mouth is. This is a long way of saying I finally set up a google voice number and please feel free to pm for it if you want to schmooze. Fair warning: I don't really do small talk well.

ongaurd247 wrote on 23 May 2024 11:15:

Yeah, but the rest of us don’t….  

Please, continue to share. It has value for us, and for you. Connection is the opposite of addiction. 

Here’s a warm hand, 

מאן דבעי חיים

Sitting next to my wife on the couch on Shabbos and flipping through an old Mishpacha magazine I spotted an ad for GYE.

Had an interesting outcome, but can I just say I think the ad was extremely inappropriate.
The ad was a picture of a kollel-looking man, big beard and white shirt, sitting in his study doorway so that you could see his face but not whatever he was doing. The man was looking straight into the camera with a sad/guilty expression. The tagline was something like "Suffering from internet problems? There is help."

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but the tachlis of GYE ads is to raise awareness that there is help for people with lust issues - not to raise awareness that there are people with lust issues. From my perspective, the ad had the message that there are people with lust issues, and your husband/father in his study may be one of them (you think he's learning but maybe not...) and by the way, there's help for them. It felt wrong.

GYE should definitely be advertising. In fact, I came to GYE because of an ad. A long time ago, I saw the ads that used to run with the little stick figure happily shaking someone's hand and the tagline was something like, "I no longer think 'if only he knew...'" I remember being so envious of that feeling, and when I finally got to the point of working on myself I went straight to GYE. Contrast that ad with this one. That ad focused on the positive feelings of being clean, this current ad focused on the negative feelings of lust addiction and seemed inappropriate.

Remember, the average reader of Mishpacha magazine is probably women and kids. The spouse/parent/child of the addict, not the addict himself. Why are we raising awareness amongst that population that some percentage of frum men are worshipping naked shiksas in their studies instead of learning? Wouldn't it be better to raise awareness that being clean from pornography is a joyful feeling?

Am I missing the boat here?

(Disclaimer: GYE is amazing, bad ads are better than no ads, and no doubt whoever put in the ad is getting oodles of schar for it. On top of all that, my feelings of what is appropriate or not are pretty messed up, and often innocuous things can bring up feelings of shame. That being said, I think I have a valid point.)

Anyway, ranting aside. My wife saw the ad and asked, "How do they help?" But we were at someone else's house so I just shrugged. But later I brought it up and we briefly talked about what GYE does. Interesting convo. Drove home that she does not, and would not, understand anything if she found out the extent of what I'm going through. But I did say I want to be in touch with some GYE folks to "mentor them" and she thought that was great.

Muttel wrote on 26 May 2024 15:22:

​Print it and post it on the wall. Absolute fire!

amevakesh wrote on 26 May 2024 15:00:

Thank you for your very kind words. I can only say כן יהי רצון.
I hope that myself and all our GYE brothers should achieve the freedom to choose life over addiction, resistance over attraction, and hard work over inaction. 

Muttel

Shalom Bayis's thread "Breaking out of the cycle". A poignant journey breaking out of a cycle of horrific shalom bayis into a brand new relationship. This thread has it all. Lust addiction shattering a relationship, the hero protagonist awakening to the consequences of his actions, and a desperate rocky trip to sanity with loads of helpful (and/or entertaining) commentary from our GYE peanut gallery. It even has a happy ending!
As suggested by @amavekesh - shkoyach!

markj3905 wrote on 23 May 2024 16:15:

I can definitely relate.  It is hard to imagine stopping cold turkey.  Since every person is different there is not any one foolproof answer. 

in my opinion, starting slowly for you would mean, committing to staying off of the social media platforms that you described.  It is crucial that you don't follow any roads to something that could lead to in person meetings.  Starting slowly means that this is just the first goal and that you be cognizant of further goals (e.g. no camming, no viewing pornography, no stimulating yourself etc...)  that will need to come.  As long as you are consistently going in the right direction you will iy'h get there.  It is very difficult to stay clean if you are fantasizing so in order to break the pattern  i would try the following:

i would work very hard to change from the inside out.  I would try to fill my day with positive things that will be good for my neshama.  I would keep myself as busy as possible so that there is not time and empty space for things that will bring me down.

I would read a book such as the Battle of the Generation every single day before going to bed no matter what! (even when you are delayed in going to sleep until 3am)

I would try to work towards being comfortable speaking with one or two of the amazing chevra here on a regular basis.  Opening up to a real person takes away the grip that the secret can have on you.  You can no longer convince yourself that noone will ever find out.

I would post on here every single day.  Become an advocate for kedusha by encouraging others here.

I would open up to hashem and ask for help.  Since i am meeting with him three times a day it is definitely worthwhile to speak to him honestly and ask for his help.  Pay attention to what you say and how you ask.  Your life may depend on this.  View it as such.

There is a lot more.  This is just an outline....

Wishing you the greatest success
Vehkam

Hi all, I’m hesitant to be here but know I need to. 

Here is my story….

I began as a kid looking at magazines my mother brought into the house. As I got older I started using the internet (dial up aol in those days) and “tripped” on some content. As a Bochur in BM I got involved with 900 phone lines, and continued during shidduchim. 

I more or less stopped when I got married, but  my old habits came back a few years into marriage. Once I started working, I had full access to technology and money, and the freedom of my own space and schedule. At that point 900 calls weren’t doing it for me anymore and I began camming. 

I’ve been camming now for many years and recently felt like I needed more (part of the addictive cycle I assume). I joined a few social media platforms, and made some new “friends”. What scares me about this new development is that I’ve been faced with strong temptations to meet with some of these people in person - a dark place I haven’t ever gone yet, but fear that it’s too easy to fall into. 

This new development has forced me to realize that while I’m “comfortable” continuing my cam habits (sadly), it’s leading me to dangerous areas that I know I don’t want to be.

I now realize two things: 1) each habit gets boring and will make you look for the next
2) every habit feels wrong in the outset, but then becomes part of your norm to the point that you don’t even want to stop. 

My question to everyone here is where do I start? 
Is stopping cold Turkey and filtering every device the way to go? I fear that I won’t last a day like that….and if I fall I’ll just give up.

Do I stop slowly? Is that even an option? 

I’m too wrapped up in all of this to see things clearly. In moments of truth and clarity I’m well aware of what needs to happen- but a piece of me just doesn’t want to stop. How do I start on this road? Any and all help will be greatly appreciated. 

Hello i.l,

You made the right decision by joining GYE the best tool we have currently for beating this problem. 

First of all, know that you are not alone. Lots and lots of frum hielige yiden have struggled with the same or worse things. AND HAVE OVERCOME THEM! 
Number 2, please start by reading the Battle of the Generation read a little every day and absorb the lessons.
Number 3, Please work thru the F2F program its life changing!
Number 4, please post and post and post. Addiction thrives on darkness and loneliness, openness and friendship brings about healing.

Good luck.