Markz wrote on 15 Feb 2017 04:22:


1) Regular forum poster
 I'm new, but regular.
2) Passed 90 days clean
Not in the past 2 years, but before that (before joining gye) I was clean over 5 years.
3) And consider yourself a non addict
non addict here.

I don't want separate forums. 

Hey everyone - life has been busy. Going to SA meetings, trying to figure out when/how I can get to a secon meeting each week, going to therapy, working, focusing more on family, reading the White Book, along with another book on sex addiction my therapist recommended...I wish there were more hours in the day!

and how is this supposed to help me in any sort of way, its a nice story but does not resolve my issue. I feel Stressed out

Dov wrote on 15 Feb 2017 18:58:


Hi Dov,

It would be my pleasure; I just had a long post and somehow it got erased so I'll do it again.
Obviously, for many addicts there is an issue of tremendously low self-esteem and shame because of their problem. They feel broken, and they feel that there is something wrong with them that they struggle with this problem. Now, when you tell them that they just have to join 12 steps if they could admit powerlessness, what happens is that they perceive that as another attack on their ego. You mean I have this problem, and I can't control it? Now they know they can't control it, but when you tell them that they are powerless it increases their shame because now they feel that they are even more broken.

But then you tell them no don't worry about it, because God can take the problem away from you. But the thing is that when they hear that they think that that is impossible, because how can the same God who wanted to smite them for masturbating take away the problem and why would he even want to? Because they have so much religious shame associated with what they've done in the past, I don't even feel worthy to ask God to take it away or to believe that he would do it.

(On a similar note, it is worth checking out the Wikipedia entry for free will and looking at at the work of Roy Baumeister and the work he did in showing how much worse people's behavior is when they feel that they are not controlling their choices.)

Now perhaps you'll say that they are misunderstanding powerlessness, as you've explained many times on this website. That may all be true, but for where they are and amount of shame that they have, starting 12 steps and admitting their peril this is way too much of an attack on their ego.

Now obviously, the people who succeed with 12 steps were able to overcome it either because they understood it differently or for them, it was a relief. Many people give the example of addiction being like diabetes – you just have to deal with it and it's not something you should be ashamed of. But I thought you were interesting thing that I've seen amongst a lot of people and I have heard from a number of therapists-for some people, hearing they have diabetes which explains some elements of theirs is a relief, while for other people it's shameful. I'll just give a personal example – lately I've been very tired and so I went to the doctor and he told me that I might have a mild sleep issue. It's funny how much more tired and bogged down I felt after he told me that. It's not like I didn't know how tired I was, but now it's like he sort of labeled me. Why should that matter and why should I be ashamed of that? The answer is a long one but the point is that that's what happens to a lot of people.

This is how I understand it from a lot of literature that I read, and also from a lot of people whom I've spoken to who didn't succeed.

I'd venture that many people would probably be able to change that attitude after they spent some time in therapy and worked on their own self, in which case they might not view it as such a threat. I know that when I started going to therapy there was no way I was going to go to 12 steps, but after some time in therapy and learning to accept myself a little more I was like heck yeah, let's give it a try.

Thanks where do you think i should start?