MW,

  You must know that you are a viturtual Tzadik for having made the "choice" to come here instead, and in fact, this choice has built an unbelievably strong infrastructure for you to do it again. Once you have done it once, there is no question that you can/will be able to do it again and BUILD upon your new choice and action. I put my hat on for you!

You should know that I relate to your post 100% as I was in the same situation. I would fall, get up, and fall, and get up, and each time the yetzer just squeezed a little bit, I immediately gave in. Why?  I too believed that I was no match for him and so....what's the  use... I gave up-almost.

And yes, each time I would fall, I would fall a little bit deeper than the previous fall. Then hashem would remove the menuvals grasp from me, until the next time he returned. Then  I would fall even deeper then the previous fall. I saw the pattern, and I knew that it was only a matter of time that I would hit rock bottom and be completely out of control. This was a big fear for me, and caused even more anxiety which in turns feed the Y"H.  This animal drive somehow makes a person who is over laden with anxiety and depression, to feel as if he is alive. He is, but is all the nefesh habaheimi, not the neshamah.

It was actually the magic words of Guardureyes that helped me when he said that you must realize that this is not just a spiritual matter but also an addiction, and when you look at it as an addiction, then you can treat it. This is what changed the entire light for me. I completely understood that it WAS a great spiritual battle for me, (even more than just addiction), BUT, when in fact relating to it as an addiction, it changed my entire view of this disease-removed my helpless feeling, and allowed me to re-group and tackle it from another angle. b"H I am on the road to recovery, starting my 4th month, and I have no intention of going back to that place again.
    Believe me, the menuval is still starting up with me. He flashes ideas, pictures, thoughts into my mind like bolts of lightening, and I flash them right back out. It is not easy, but it is not meant to be easy. This is our avodah. This is what we are meant to be doing in Olam Hazeh..to fight hashem's battle. He almost got me a couple of days ago, but because of my new kabalah on myself, etc, Hashem saved me in a niflahdikka way.
   The most important point here is that: 

I also believed that I couldn't beat him: This is Sheker gamor. This thought is the most powerful arsenal of the menuval. Once you buy into this thought, the battle is finished before it even started.

So dear yid, I promise you that you CAN beat him, and the only thing that you are lacking is the changing of this belief that you can't. Change it now, and also make sure that you have the Ratzon (desire) to want to change.

with these 2 ingredients, nothing can stop you...I promise. But, you must WANT this.

One last point: I too use to surf the web out of bordom and anxiety etc, and I too ended up in the wrong places. I noticed this pattern and new that I could only be on line for  business or for a specific kosher goal. Once I fulfilled this goal, then I knew that if I didn't shut down I would get myself in trouble.

BTW- A computer filter (where you don't have the code) is a very very strong item to  bring to Yom Hakippur. This is something that hits the menuval where it reall hurts.

G'Mar Chasimah Tovah!

Battleworn, we need to change your name to General Battle-Worthy!

Someone just told me a story of a Bachur who used to go places where there was Pritzus and he told R' Elya Lopian that he wasn't afraid of falling in shmiras ainayim. So R'Elya Lopian asked him for his name. So the Bachur asked why R' Elya wanted his name. So R'Elya asnwered that he wanted to daven for him, because anyone who can go in a place of Pritzus and is not afraid of falling must be very sick. And R'Elya continued that even he, who was old, feeble, and blind in one eye, was terribly afraid of falling in Shmiras Ainayim...

So like you said, General. It is 100% normal (at least non-addicted situations). The Tzadikim though, are brave enough to fight it for Hashem's honor, and redirect their wordly passions to Hashem!

Ashreinu Ma Tov Chelkeinu!

P.S. Is that story in Shar Ahava true, or just a moshel?

hello all and a gmar chasima tova from the depths of my heart-
today is my 31st day. and this is the most difficult battle that i have ever undertaken voluntarily. and i couldn't do it without the phone support.if you are trying this on your own, maybe the forum is enough for you. but, for me, i need the phone support - the withdrawal symptoms are too strong - i need to unload on a human being who is there for me and will listen. did you ever see a drug addict coming off drugs? (i can only imagine) what it's like. well, what i have is not a chemical dependency, but the withdrawal symptoms are (i can only imagine) just as powerful, and i need a support person to listen to me scream and cry it out of my system. i don't know how long i will need this, but the people are there for me, and that's how i'm doing it. and that's what changed from the past 38 years, when i always wanted to stop, but couldn't. the withdrawal was just too much to bear alone.but now, i have a new family, and that's what's doing it for me, plain and simple. jack

Once you're clean for a few months, you will begin a natural search for the core reason
you were using this addiction to soothe your pain.  In that search you will find yourself.
Once you find yourself, what you love to do, there will be a natural state of serenity and
calmness.  Once you're in this state, you will not have a reason to act out.... after a while
you won't even think about it.  It will take something unexpected, like a filter free computer
or something else to trigger you.  Then you will pull out one of the tools from your toolbox
and find something else to soothe you.

Begin to think of other ways to enjoy yourself, some way to pamper yourself and your body
so you feel good, OTHER THAN WHAT YOU'VE BEEN DOING   Kosher massages by men,
swimming, eating your favorite dessert as a reward for a good day or week, yoga, meditation.
Read Aryeh Kaplan's book on Jewish meditation.  For me there is no greater method to calming
me down and facing the day than meditation.

Maybe that would be a good topic.  What are some ways you soothe your anxiety & pain
in healthy ways?

Any takers?

MW, Congrats on having begun the journey! A great Rosh Hashana is worth all the gold in the world.

Yes, curiosity is what killed the cat. It is one of the addictions biggest tools. If you can beat curiosity, half the job is done.

Practice when walking in the street, a woman passes by, you get curious who it might be... but it's the addiction talking, the YH, he wants you to look, so he makes you curious. You ask yourself "maybe I know her" or some other "innocent sounding question". Don't be fooled for it. Practice working on curiosity and it will do you a lot of good in your struggle.

P.S. In response to UTS. The shots are known to work ONLY for the time the patient is on them. As soon as he is off the shots, all the garbage comes back. It's like closing the door on a room full of garbage. It's all still there, only the door is closed. Working on yourself however, is actually cleaning the garbage. And that is what we came to the world for! (We only suggest the shots to people who may get into serious trouble, like sex offenders).

MW, like battleworn once said.... The fact that you feel this urge to check out the new content is not a chidush. It's just the addiction talking. But the fact the you're waging war against such a powerful force, now that's a chidush. And that you haven't given up even though you're feeling weak, that's a huge chidush. The midrash says (shir hashirim 7, 1) that those who stand up and prevail over the despicable menuval, the whole generation depends on them.

UTS, it's something I have been trying to figure out for a long time, what happened to all those addicts before the 12 step program was created.  On the same note how did people tackle their depression, bipolar disorder, OCD, ADD, and any of the other dozens of disorders diagnosed today (gender identity disorder (it’s real, Google it), Mixed-Receptive-Expressive Language Disorder etc.) before today’s new wave of psychology began diagnosing and treating all these disorders.  I think people in the good old days were able to take pain and accept inconvenience much more then this generation and thus were able to face their problems without “acting out” or getting “depressed”.  We all know that one of the major components of any addiction is the addict running away from his problems and acting out with temporary pleasure; in the olden days people were able to face their problems.  What do you guys think?

You probably are aware that there are shots, as listed on this site under medications etc., which  completely turn off this desire. It would seem to me that if you want you can use this method for one to twelve months  if not medically contraindicated. After that period of time, you may or may not no longer be "addicted" to this desire.

I asked Dr. Krueger if the shots would accomplish making one not "addicted". Here is his answer:


[size=10pt][size=10pt][size=10pt]No, one would not loose it; one would gain control over it while they were taking the shot; one might be able to learn other ways of obtaining control while on the shot so that if they stopped they would be able to control themselves. However, there is no guarantee of this, and some might have to stay on the shot forever.

If you are interested I would be happy to evaluate you, but I have a private practice and fee for service.

Dr. Krueger

Medical Director
Sexual Behavior Clinic
New York State Psychiatric Institute
& Columbia University Department of Psychiatry
1051 Riverside Drive, Unit #45
New York, NY 10032-2695

Associate Clinical Professor of Psychiatry
Columbia University, Department of Psychiatry
College of Physicians and Surgeons

Associate Attending Psychiatrist
Department of Psychiatry
New York-Presbyterian Hospital

E-mail: rbk1@columbia.edu

Telephone: 212-740-7330

Fax:  212-740-7341

Page and text messaging: 877-904-5017; ask operator to
  dispatch message to me

Cell phone:  917-750-1596

Web Site:  www.paraphilias.com

WE DO NOT EVEN IN THE LEAST KNOW THE FINAL CAUSE OF SEXUALITY.  THE WHOLE
SUBJECT IS HIDDEN IN DARKNESS--CHARLES DARWIN 1862.

Wow, Elya, that sounds like an interesting book. I'd love to see it...

You know Elya, if you are a writer and publish books, maybe we should put out a book together on Sex & Porn addiction in the religious world today, bringing stories from our site and forum, put down the 12 Torah steps, bring hundreds of tips from the site and from your experience with Zeva and Michelle and the healing centers, etc...

It could save many people and be a real hit (especially among those who decide not to have internet at all because of their problem, in which case our site can't help them).

Maybe that could be your next project :-)

Snax, after Yom Tov I'd love to talk to you about work issues, because they are similiar to mine, or
used to be.  I just wrote a book which I'm publishing called Addictive Entrepreneurship which deals
with workaholism and the balance we need in deciding when to trust our own intuition or rely on others.

I may have some ideas for you on finding your passion and mission.

Mevakesh, did you know Reb Moshe Aaron Stern?  I did.  he used to come to my city
every year to collect and would give us wonderful Shiurim.

I would like to make a suggestion to everyone.  As a writer and a reader, its difficult to
read such wonderful postings in large blocks.  So if we could separate our paragraphs
like this, it would make it easier for old people like me to read.

Battleworn's struggle is common.  When I went back into my past, after I was sober for
awhile I recognized the abandonment issues I was put through and the lack of any positive
reinforcement of anything I did.  This is what I keep telling people that call me. There is usually
a past childhood issue that is the root of our addiction to wanting a connection with others.
What we do to medicate ourselves is just what we do, not the root cause.  It's difficult to get
to the root cause while I'm still acting out in my addiction. 

I want to wish everyone a KSiva V?hasima tovah.  I will be davening for all of us.

A

Please get some counseling immediately.  A certified sex addiction counselor.
go to sash.org to find one in your area.  You can do Teshuva by stopping and asking
Hashem to help you stop.

Guys, thanks a million for your chizuk and kind words.  You moderators are giving so much of your precious time to this site and forum and I truly appreciate it.  My filter is back on although my hope has yet to fully return.  I will do my best this Yom Tov.  Elya, the 12 step has always been an absolute NO NO for me but it's something I may have to reconsider, I have some serious reservations about the entire program and will probably contact you about them personally (yeah, I know what your thinking, it's my addictive thinking finding excuses not to go!!).  I am going to try this forum and group first and see how it goes.  The therapist I am currently seeing is certified through sash.net.    Guard, your articles are well written and to the point, thanks again.

Dear Jew, Holy brother.

You have to be besimcha. Being down is exactly what the Yetzer Hara wants. Davka because you feel there is no hope, no one to rely on but Hashem, that is the biggest simcha because you are not living in any delusions anymore that you can still help yourself on your own - you are completely dependant on Hashem, and THAT is what Hashem was waiting for all this time... See Chizuk e-mail #290 on this page, for more on this important idea (scroll down to the bottom). I also want you to read #287 on that page for some good Yesodos to help you get started, from battleworn (taken from the forum).

Run to Hashem and cry "TATTEH!!". Throw yourself on him.... And even if you chas veshalom fall, cry out to him! never let go of him! He is the only one who can help, and ultimately he will. No, your tears are not just Reshaim mela'im Charata. Every Jew who shed tears at one time or another because of this, will one day be worthy to see salvation from this. That is what I have seen in my work in this field, again and again.

You are not worse off than the rest of us here. We were all in your situation at one time. Read the stories of recovery on our site over here, and learn that you are not alone and that yes, there is hope.

The first thing you need to know is that the phenomenon you are dealing with is not because you have huge desires and can't seem to be able to deal with them. Rather, you are simply dealing with a strong "addiction". It is important to understand this because, as an addiction, it can be dealt with in many tried and proven ways and methods.

The first step is to block access to the porn. I once wrote a whole article that deals with the issue of people who claim they are too computer savvy for filters to work, if this is the case with you, I ask you to please see the article here. You may begin to read the article and say "I know all this stuff, it won't help" - but I ask you to please read until the very end. There is a lot of advice there that can help. But like I wrote in the article, nothing is ever 100% fool-proof. After all, you could also buy a new computer each time you wanted access. The idea here is "out-of-sight-out-of-mind". When you know it's out of reach, you feel free. It's all in the mind.

If you have been to therapists already and it hasn't helped, it doesn't mean that group support won't help. Group support, according to Rabbi Avraham J. Twerski, is the most powerful tool in breaking free from these things. For group support you can do one or all, of these 4 ideas:
1) Keep writing about your struggles here on the forum - you will get a lot of chizuk from fellow strugglers, as well as the fact that writing it out alone is already helpful to break the yetzer hara
2) Sign up on the forum for an accountability partner to keep in touch with
3) Join the Jewish Healing Group Hotline. It's better than having to join a non-religious SLA group. Firstly because everyone there, including the certified addiction counselor - are frum. And secondly, because you have full anonymity.
4) Call Elya, our experienced addiction sponsor, and speak to him live with full confidentiality. He has a lot of experience and is a great person to help you start your journey to recovery.

Also, if you have been to many therapists without success, it could be you are a candidate for medication. Millions of people take SSRI or antidepressants. These things today have virtually no side-effects and can do wonders in taking off the "edge" of the obsession, or the underlying cause of the addiction. You see, addictions are often caused by various underlying issues, such as anxiety, depression, low-self esteem, a difficult child hood, etc... These situations make one a prime candidate for addictions in that the person seeks to medicate their feelings of inadequacy or the dark feelings of their subconscious with various "self-soothing" stimulations. If these problems are not dealt with at the root, it makes it that much harder to recover. See this page for some ideas about possible medications. (Scroll down to the middle).

If you are determined to change, you will also need to do some homework. Set aside some time each day to make a careful reckoning of what things lead you to fall, what situations, in what what ways your mind has become accustomed to think. Then you can start working on changing these things, on making fences. This is the ikkar Teshuvah according to the Chafetz Chaim.

Please take full advantage of all the wonderful tools on our site. Browse through the hundreds of tips on our site, divided into useful categories to help you break free. Read through the FAQ page. Read the Stories. Spend the time you would normally spend on filth, instead on things that will help you begin to live like your heart always wanted to!

Dear Yid. Never give up. We will do our very best to help you through the recovery process. Start by taking one day at a time. Tell yourself each day, "Just for today, I will remain clean". Tomorrow is out of your hands.

This year Rosh Hashana you will come before Hashem having made the first steps to Teshuvah!

May Hashem be with you!

Dear hopeless MW:

These other people on the forum have happy endings because they've either been on this
forum for awhile or been on the Tuesday night calls.  Miracles are happening every day.

There is no ending this addiction.  It will always be there. But once you're sober it
gets much easier.  Only by asking Hashem for help
can you get better.  BUT before you do that, you must become a pure KLI (vessel) that
can accept the help.  You've taken the first step here by telling your story.  The next step
is to admit (which you have) that you are powerless over this and your life has become
unmanegable.  Then ask Hashem to help you.  Unlocking your filter is not going to get
you brownie points with G-D

Therapists will not be able to
help you UNLESS they are certified and trained sex addiction therapists.  For a
complete list in your area go to:  sash.net.

There is no reason to be hopeless.  Ask your therapist if you need depression
medication - seriously.

Next:  Get to an SLAA group or SA group tonight - right away - before RH
and get someone to be a temporary sponsor.  even someone on this forum.
Someone to actually talk to, to educate you on what is really going on.

Rabbi Abraham Twersky, the renowned alcohol and drug addiction specialist
recommends 12 step groups.  Even if they are with women, in a church or
on the moon.  It is vital. I can tell you from 9 years of experience with
goyish 12 step groups (even some in churches) that you'll be surprised
at how accepting people will be of you.

You are now among a select group of people who share an illness.  If you
had cancer, G-d forbid, would you skip RH and YK?  I don't think so. You'd
pour your heart out and sincerely do Teshuva. No it's not going to be easy.
We in some respects are all on a higher level than your typical jew out there.
Even frum jew.  The Torah says, " Don't pat yourself on the back for your successes
and say, now that I'm successful I will walk the path I want."  most people
have this attitude and don't take any of this seriously. But we are searching
for help and sincerely want to stop - and that's what Hashem wants - SINCERITY.
Rachmana Liba Boi.

So pick yourself up and stand tall, go into RH with a written essay of this past year
of despair.  Get it out on paper and resolve in this Cheshbon Hanefesh to do better
next year.  Sheva Yipol Tzaddick V'Kom (7 times a Tzaddick falls and gets up). 
A Tzaddik is a person who falls and gets up, not a perfect angel who people think
have been geniuses from the womb.

If you want to talk before RH, the hotline will be open all day Sunday. That goes
for anyone reading this message.

www.guardureyes.com/GUE/hotline/Hotline.asp